Riffing on Some Member Comments About Strictness, Female Leadership, and Openness About Roles (Club Meeting - 562)

“Followership is a discipline of supporting leaders and helping them to lead well. It is not submission, but the wise and good care of leaders, done out of a sense of gratitude for their willingness to take on the responsibilities of leadership, and a sense of hope and faith in their abilities and potential.” — Reverend Paul Beedle

Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Wives Club – Tribute blog.  Our weekly on-line gathering of women and men who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship of the type advocated by the former Disciplinary Wives Club (archived copy in the “Links I Like” list, below right).

 

I hope you all had a good week.  Mine was okay. Getting back to full mobility is a painfully long process, but it is, in fact, a process.  I’ve been a little bummed out, as some friends left on a trip this week that, absent this injury, I would be going on. But, it is what it is . . . . 

 

I don’t know whether it’s a good or a bad thing, but while progress may be slow, there is progress, and it pulls me inevitably closer to that first post-injury spanking.  It’s been on my mind a lot, and it’s also clearly been on Anne’s. 

 

A couple of days ago, she referenced a tentative plan to give me one this week.  I had to remind her that my tailbone is still a problem. And, it is. 

 

But, it may be getting to a state where spanking in some form is doable. I don’t think I could take a hard paddling with anything wooden quite yet.  A cane is the more obvious candidate, though Anne has never liked, or gotten proficient, with that instrument. Maybe if it’s the only way to get back into it?

 

And, I do feel like she really is itching to get back into it.  Which is, in itself, a testament to how much has changed over the last couple of years.  In the past, I never felt like she was just accommodating my need for discipline; it was reasonably clear that she did get a lot out of our DD relationship.  But, getting a benefit from it isn’t quite the same thing as really embracing it and being into it as much or more than he is.    

 

Really adopting it as her own, openly lamenting when it’s not happening, bringing it up, often in the context of threatening its use . . . those are all things that have become a more prominent part of her approach to our relationship only in the last couple of years.

 

It’s one reason this medically-induced hiatus—our second (and sort of third) in two years)—is so unfortunate. It feels like we were on the verge of a truly meaningful shift in her level of dedication to taking charge, but it’s been one long interruption after another.

 

Ward talked recently about a similar process he’s gone through:

 

I can sympathize with Dan. I had to wait for months for my wife to heal, and I dreaded the impending spanking when she was close to being able to administer one. Like you, it's all I could think about while she was in the process of healing. The interesting thing was when we talked about it, she couldn't wait to be able to give me a spanking. The hard thing was when it finally happened it was for a very real selfish act on my part. The guilt was eating me up. When the spanking was over, I was crying real tears for some time, after which I stood in the corner apologizing over and over again. That did not prevent her from putting me back across her lap before bed to drive home the point that it better never happen again. It definitely was a reset for us. Things have been way better, and the intimacy is like nothing we have experienced before. Touching and holding each other like we are truly in love. She loves the attention I have been giving her since she started spanking me again when I get out of line.

 

I’m not sure whether it is the same incident (maybe he’ll clarify), but Ward also talked about his wife’s new dedication to taking charge:

 

We are full FLR now! I made a huge mistake and manipulated her to get my way. The whole deal went sideways and we missed out on an opportunity both of us wanted. I felt terrible it was all my fault. If she had stuck to her instinct instead of being pushed into something she wasn't sure she wanted by me we would have been way better off. We talked about it when it happened and I told her how sorry I was but we both knew that it would happen again and the only chance to prevent it was some severe consequences. I was put over her lap and paddled while she lectured me about it not happening again. I was crying real tears not from the pain but because I was truly sorry.. I was sent to the corner until I was able to stop crying then we had a long talk about her putting some guard rails in to to prevent it from happening again. I had to stand in the corner for an hour tonight and got another spanking before bed. I hope this helps me change this behavior in the future. I really screwed up.

 

I was curious about what he did, but T beat me to asking about it:

 

“Ward, just out of curiosity, what was the big mistake that was made. Is it something you can reveal here? I do envy a bit of your relationship. I would wonder what a true FLR relationship would feel like. I would like to know if it would have a positive change on me, or would I build resentment towards my wife. Unfortunately, I will never know because my wife wants me to lead. We have a typical marriage except for DD. I wish I had met her in my mid twenties. I truly believe FLR could have benefited me then. My wife is a bit older than I am and I’ve always been attracted to older females. I find that they know what they want and seem to ignore the BS for the most part. Dan post some incredible pics of older women who I find incredibly sexy.”

 

Ward gave some additional details:

 

I manipulated her into signing a contract on a home I thought I wanted, only to see our dream home. But, we couldn't put in an offer because of the contract I pushed her into, and someone else bought our dream home in the meantime. It's not the first time I have manipulated her into a decision we both regretted. She spanked me multiple times that day to make it clear that it will never happen again. I am to be the perceived leader, but I am her husband and never allowed to make the final decision. At home I obey her and do most of the work inside and outside. We are retired but now I have to do her bidding or suffer the consequences. To be honest while I don't always like the punishments and chores it has made our marriage unbreakable. I'm still struggling at times to trust her judgment but she has great instincts and has never made a bad decision unless I pushed her into it. My love for her is beyond description.

 

I quote that exchange extensively, because I don’t have much of a real topic in mind this week, so I thought I might riff on some of the things it brings up for me.

 

First, T stated that he experiences some envy at Ward’s description of being in something like a real FLR.  I get that and feel a similar envy whenever someone describes a scenario in which a DD wife really takes charge.  Part of me really craves Anne stepping up her level of control in a powerful way; a way that is so strong-willed that it feels irresistible.

 

Yet, T is clearly right to at least wonder whether it would prove to be a positive change, or would he resent it?  TB made a similar point when talking about what he went through mentally when his wife started ramping things up, from accommodating his spanking interest to something that involved more rules and that was truly disciplinary in severity:

 

So, in many ways it was a ‘be careful what you wish for’ as initially I had no real concept of how painful a real spanking would be and how difficult submitting would be, not just to the increasingly painful spankings but also to a set of modified behaviours and controls.

 

 

For me, I suspect that increasingly stringent controls on my behavior would be harder to deal with than the resulting spankings.  It’s one thing to fantasize about being under someone else’s direction, and quite another when you’re experiencing it in real-time in circumstances where you feel a real curtailment of your own agency and independence. 

 

Coincidentally, I came across this meme last week that sums up a wide range of consequences some of us sometimes suggest we’d like to experience but that might feel uncomfortably uncomfortable in reality.

 

Yet, while I think T is right to ask the question about possible resentment, I also can’t help but sharing the curiosity that leads him to want to at least experience it.

 

Since I don’t have a real topic in mind, I’ll throw this out for any thoughts others might have about being under someone’s increasing control and how the reality might differ from the fantasy?  If you’ve gone through such a transition yourself, how did it come about, and how did it make you feel?  Was it a positive development, or one you struggled with?

 

One discomforting thing a real FLR, or a very strict DD, might entail is the wife’s empowerment being very visible to others.  Which raises another interesting angle on Ward and T’s observations.  T notes that, as much as he may be curious about what an FLR-like relationship might feel like, “Unfortunately, I will never know because my wife wants me to lead”.

 

In a similar vein, Ward notes: “I am to be the perceived leader . . .”   

 

This is something that’s come up in a lot of comments over the years.  A couple is in a genuine DD relationship, which inherently involves the wife taking on authority above and beyond what exists in most marriages, yet it’s important to one or both of them that he is either designated “the leader” or at least perceived to be so by others.  To me, it's doubly interesting in that Ward seems to see his wife taking over as a good thing, as she has good judgment, even if he needs to learn to trust it, and T has often commented on the fact that his wife has great temperament and judgment.  Yet, in both relationships, one or both parties thinks the man should be the leader, or at least should be perceived that way bother others.

 

It's an interesting issue that maybe calls into question how much gender dynamics have really changed over the hears and/or whether the mere establishment of a DD relationship does much to challenge them.  To put it succinctly, if the husband wants the wife to be in charge, and if she, in fact, exhibits better judgment and/or temperament, why shouldn’t she be the openly acknowledged leader?  

 

Maybe T. and Ward, and others who have experience with it, can talk about this more?  It’s not something I have much direct experience with. The closest I come is that, when the kids were still at home, Anne said that she worried that being more open about her spanking me and being more in charge might cause them to lose respect for me. 

 

But, it’s worth noting that I never really shared that concern. To the contrary, I’ve always been attracted to the idea of others knowing Anne is in charge.

 

However, I also need to keep in mind that Anne’s concerns on that front arose when we were in a life situation that no longer exists. We had kids at home. We had jobs and job-related reputations to be concerned about. That’s not the case anymore. Therefore, if those were the things that caused her to be less open about being open, given that those conditions no longer exist, maybe her attitude toward openness could change.  

 

And, and, if things were to change, it could happen quickly and unexpectedly. I recall former commenter KOJ (who I miss a lot) talking about how quickly his wife became very comfortable displaying her authority:

 

“Dan, it was shockingly abrupt with my wife, with no explanation. She must have been thinking about it for a long time. She had been hiding her authority over me due to concern about both of our careers. I had no idea that she wanted to display her authority, or at least not hide it. But suddenly she was making the same demands and comments in public that she did in private. I was taken aback. Eventually we talked about it. She was her matter-of-fact self. ‘You'll just have to accept it like you do your spankings,’ she said. I came to realize that power is more powerful the more people know about it!”

  

 

When he described specific instances in which she exercised that openness, I was morbidly attracted to it, and I still am. For me, the desire to be subject to increasing levels of strictness and control, and the prospect of Anee being more confident and open in wielding her control, are probably different aspects of the same underlying desire. It's not so much about wanting to suffer the embarrassment of being "outed" as in a relationship where I get spanked at my wife's discretion but, rather, wanting to have a wife who is so self-confident and in touch with her own power that she doesn't feel the need to hide it.  At bottom, my kink (for lack of a better word) has always been rooted in being taken control of by a powerful woman and not about spanking per se, though the spanking is an important element of the expression of that power.

 

The DWC’s Aunt Kay advocated that wives being in control was not just appropriate but ideal, though she acknowledged it’s not the world we live in:

 

“Attitude is the whole thing in spanking a man. You can work on improving your techniques over time, but you have to start with the right attitude.  Think about it. How many times and in how many ways has he shown you that he is basically a spoiled brat, a little boy, in a grown man’s body? A million? Two million? That's what you are dealing with, and if our world wasn't so confused, it would be normal for the woman of the house to wield the moral authority and the hairbrush without a second thought.”

 

Although I may regret if it actually happens, part of me really wants to experience that overt display of authority, combined with picking up the brush without a second thought, even if it’s a fantasy that I might come to regret were it to be fulfilled. KOJ’s experience is a cautionary note that it could, in fact, happen even if it feels very speculative today.  Yet, I also didn’t get the sense that he was unhappy with the development, even if it was sometimes profoundly embarrassing.

 

Again, I don’t have a well-defined topic in mind.  Chime in with anything that interests you.

 

By the way, in a week in which two major AI platforms have disclosed that their creations escaped and hacked into other systems, this seems appropriate: