Sunday, September 27, 2020

The Club - Meeting 356 - Interrogation, Reporting and Asking

If we are not ashamed to think it, we should not be ashamed to say it. - Marcus Tullius Cicero


Hello all.  Welcome back to the Disciplined Husbands Forum. Our weekly gathering of men and women participating or interested in Domestic Discipline Relationships. I hope you had a good week.


Where we live, summer seems to be winding down.  Not that it was much of a summer anyway.



Fall is definitely in the air here, which would usually have me thinking about leaves turning, college football tailgating, pumpkins being gathered and carved and, of course, Halloween. But, here we are with dodging forest fires and choking on smoke and haze instead of tree-gazing, fan-free sporting events with tail-gating banned, and it looks like Halloween will be be more or less canceled this year. Not only will most kids not be trick-or-treating," but even adult parties will be out of the question thanks to social-distancing.


That’s really a drag.  I’ve always loved that holiday, and I’ve groused many times that work travel has made me miss way too many Halloweens over the years. Ironically, and perfectly in line with everything else in 2020, this year I likely will be here for the holiday, but the holiday is unlikely to be here for me.  Oh well, I guess we will soldier on, and since it is outdoors maybe a trip to the pumpkin patch remains a socially-distanced possibility.



As I reported, last week was a tough one for us.  The one and only good thing about it was it brought home to me just how far my behavior has drifted over the last few months and gave me some real commitment to trying to fix it. It has me genuinely refocused on getting my shit together on multiple fronts. In response to one of my cryptic comments about my behavior, Alan offered this sage advice:


Regarding moving forward on the behavior front: I sense your frustration and offer what has worked for us. First following Aunt Kay’s original advice, we developed a list of behaviors that were problems for one or both of us. Very important at that point was that we both agreed that the behavior needed to change. In short we both needed to buy into it as a goal whether it was relatively trivial or later when the behaviors were serious issues. That buy in by both of us was crucial. I think the original list numbered around a dozen and it ranged from annoyances like my (then) chronic habit of being 10 or 15 minutes late for dates to smoking. Next ,also following Aunt Kay, we prioritized the list to 2 or 3 things to emphasize, picking middle range things rather than the most challenging behaviors, eventually working up to the most serious issues. We actually started with a cliché, leaving the commode seat up and one other. But even these “easy” ones established the habit of compliance and the reality of consequences. We dealt with the accountability issue by her committing to ask me as often as every day whether I was “disobedient” (i.e. violated one of her rules) – and me committing to never lie to her about that. She also committed to being consistent which meant if I confessed to disobedience I would be punished,, no exceptions This made it unnecessary for her to monitor my behavior (beyond the regular interrogations) and it turned out to be the feature about our system we both liked most. She doesn’t like to monitor and while I find it hard to ask for a spanking or “out” myself, I find it’s very easy to be truthful with her when she interrogates me even when I know I am in trouble. Looking back on this the two thing that seem most important to it working are first our commitment as a couple to modifying the behavior – and second her follow up including regularly interrogating me.


ZM responded to Alan’s comment with this:


Hi Alan.  I think the interrogation thing is pretty much what we are doing with the weekly check-ins. She has previously said that she doesn't want me to self-report, but in fact that is exactly what I am doing on most items, except that it is at her prompting/interrogating.


  To which Alan responded:


ZM, I can understand how your wife would discourage self-reporting because while the motive for doing so might be as pure as the driven snow- it can easily come off as topping from below, making her fell pressure to "perform" rather than to be in charge. Interrogation switches that dynamic putting her completely in control and allowing her to determine if an issue is timely to address or not. Interrogation puts responsibility on a wife but she gets to decide when and how to discharge that responsibility. I know I don't need to remind you of this, but committing to never be untruthful with her makes it all work once she has committed to regular interrogation. – Alan


Capping off this exchange and responding to my comment that I’m not good at self-reporting nor is my wife good at interrogating, ZM observed:


Hi Dan and Alan. Dan, I totally get what you said about the two sides of the same coin. I am fortunate because my wife is very, very good at keeping things on schedule, and there is no chance that she will just let it slip by the wayside. When we were doing this before, it stopped only because suddenly we had a house full of teenagers (returns from college plus our high-schooler), and it just simply became impossible to get ANY time alone at all for a while. So eventually we just kind of gave up on it. This time, we have much more freedom, so I think it will last, especially since she has started to notice and comment on the positive results it is generating.  And Alan, I think we are exactly on the same wavelength about the difference between self-initiated self-reporting and self-reporting in response to interrogation. With interrogation the power structure is reinforced, whereas (as you pointed out) self-initiated self-reporting can easily upset or weaken or undermine the power structure. By her making the decision to interrogate, she has also - at least implicitly if not explicitly - made the decision to act upon the information that she gets.  I am fortunate that my wife really takes to the keeping things on schedule and so she totally owns the process. And since this seems to strengthen the power structure, hopefully it will become a virtuous cycle where she feels more and more comfortable with interrogating me and exercising her authority (though she is already pretty comfortable with it).


I know we’ve talked a lot about reporting, but this whole issue of how to build some rigor and regularity into our DD relationship—which has been off track all year despite having a house to ourselves—has really been on my mind lately, largely because I’m trying to face up to the fact that I really do need to get on top of some problematic behaviors that just don’t seem to get better.  So, for the next couple of weeks, I may explore some things we’ve talked about before, in an effort to get more input and advice from the group.



So, like I said, we’ve talked in the past about self-reporting, asking for it when you know you deserve it, etc., and the tension that Alan alludes to between those husband-initiated means of helping ensure bad behavior gets addressed and the possibility that they might cause the wife to feel pressured or disempowered.  It sounds like for both Alan and ZM, the tension has been resolved by their wives interrogating them pretty actively about their behavior, though ZM’s new regimen has a pretty rigorous reporting mechanism built into it.


Interrogation hasn’t really been a part of our dynamic, and perhaps that has been part of our enforcement problem.  Though, that kind of begs the question – if it is not a part of our dynamic, and if the dynamic might improve if it were, how can I bring that improvement about without taking control by once again trying some kind of reporting regimen to kick it off and hope it becomes part of her personal arsenal for addressing bad behavior and keeping things on track?



Mulling this over this morning as I was thinking about a topic for today reinforced to me just how dependent DD is on the husband either proactively self-reporting or being honest in response to questioning from his wife, because so much of our limiting behaviors may happen outside her presence and be more or less undetectable without an actual confession.



Now, for some wives, that’s probably just fine.  She may have little or no concerns about behavior that isn’t readily apparent and doesn’t impact her directly.  But, then there are couples at the almost opposite extreme, like Liz and Art.  Art recognizes the problems that arrogance and attitude have caused him at work.  But, because the problematic behavior happens outside Liz’s presence, it could go completely undetected if he didn’t take the initiative to report it.  Their way around the problem is interesting in that it doesn’t really rely on either interrogation or self-reporting but, rather, on “prophylactic” or “preventative” spankings that attempt to address bad behavior by ensuring it doesn’t happen in the first place.


For our Disciplinary Wives, how do you feel bad behavior should best be detected so it can be addressed?  Do you currently do something like Alan describes, actively interrogating your husband about whether he has behaved as agreed or disobeyed one of the rules?  How do you feel about him reporting bad behavior?  Is it something you expect, or would you feel that undermines or pressures you?  What about not just reporting bad behavior but him actually asking for a spanking when he knows he deserves one?  That last one has been on my mind a lot this week.  I very seldom come right out and ask to be spanked or punished, yet there are times that I know she is stewing over something I did, and I know I believe I really deserve one.  In an ideal world, she would take command and just order one, but what if she doesn’t?


For the men, does your wife interrogate you to ferret out bad behavior?  If so, how do you feel about that? If not, would you like that to be a part of your dynamic?  If not, how do you address behavior you know you should be punished for—and perhaps even want to be punished for—that she may not be aware of or may not punish even when she does know about it?


Have a great week.

Sunday, September 20, 2020

The Club - Meeting 355 - Before and After Thoughts

“Wishes are brutal, unforgiving things. They burn your tongue the moment they're spoken and you can never take them back.” - Alice Hoffman


Hello all.  Welcome back to the Disciplined Husbands Forum. Our weekly gathering of men and women participating or interested in Domestic Discipline Relationships. I hope you had a good week.


Ours was really rough.  Every time I think this year just can’t possibly get any worse, somehow it does.  It wasn’t a great week for the country either.  Or at least for half of it.



I’m also sitting here on a pleasant Sunday feeling particularly bad about my own personal behavior.  Early in the week, I was really trying to turn a corner on getting some nagging health and behavior issues under control, yet with another weekend came another big fail.  It has me thinking again about “zero tolerance” policies, stern and strict discipline, etc.  But, the challenge is, of course, finding the right enforcement or incentive structure – something that has eluded me for years now.  I was thinking about some of this earlier in the week when watching the HBO series The Vow, which is about the Nxivm “personal empowerment” that billed itself as an “Executive Success Program,” that also had earmarks of a pyramid scheme, and had within it a small group of women that took personal power in a very Domestic Discipline direction.  As some of you may recall, I got intrigued this several months ago and about the philosophy of self-improvement described in this New York Time article.  What really intrigued me was the whole thing sounded so . . . disciplinary.  It was all about finding sufficient leverage to overcome those self-limiting habits or establish better ones.  Apparently, I was right in intuiting a very DD-like connection.  In the most recent episode, a woman talked about the communications between her and the woman above her in the hierarchy and the kind of structure and discipline that was imposed.  The producers displayed a series of texts between them.  It isn’t clear from the exchange what the underlying behavior was.



But, it becomes VERY clear what the consequences of not complying with the rules would be.



So, I exit this week and enter a new one pondering whether there is some system or set of procedures I can put in place to finally get enough leverage over myself to put an end to some of the behaviors that have chronically caused problems for myself and others.  I’m mulling some options, though the linchpin has to really be execution and follow-up.  I’ll keep mulling and think and, hopefully, report back where we end up.


In the meantime, the events of this week left me pretty empty of when it came to topic ideas.  Thankfully, one of our commenters provided me with one.  A couple of weeks ago, Belle suggested the following:


I want to suggest a possible topic because I am curious about this and believe it is probably much more intense for other couples than it currently is for us: What are the thoughts and feelings that both husband and wife think and feel immediately before and immediately after punishment? Describe them in exquisite detail. Before punishment means from the time a spanking is announced until the first spank lands, so including getting implements, lecture, removal of clothing, positioning of the husband, etc. After punishment means from the moment the last spank lands until the couple is back to normal, including cornertime or any meditation time, putting clothing back on, talk about the punishment, cuddling, sex triggered by the punishment, etc.



For me, the most consistent aspect of my thought process is really the gap between what I am thinking immediately before a spanking is announced and what I am thinking right after the announcement.  Particularly when I am in a remorseful mood or angry at myself for some behavior failure, I’m often actively thinking about how I really deserve one, hoping she will order one, etc. Then, after she announces one is coming, all that just vanishes completely and I become laser focused on how much I do not want to be spanked.  Even when I know an announcement is likely coming, my stomach still jumps to my throat when it actually comes.



I suspect that for some husbands, there is a desire to just face the music and get it over with soon. That virtually never happens with me. From the moment one is announced, I switch into avoidance mode and begin hoping that something will happen that interferes with execution of the sentence.  It’s pretty rare that she tells me in advance exactly what time it will be carried out, so I often have an hour or to stew and think about what is coming, then at some point she will either come downstairs and announce it is time for me to come upstairs and get ready or she will send a text to that effect.  Regardless of the form of that communication, in that moment I go from a kind of low level dread to a kind of resigned “I really don’t want this, but here we go.  . . .” Our routine is so ritualized, from that point I’m kind of on auto-pilot.  Without being ordered to, I retrieve the suitcase in which we keep the implements, put it on the bed and open it.  I then pull a large ottoman into the center of the room and put a large cushion on top of it.  I then undress and wait for her to come out.  During that process, I’m usually thinking about nothing other than how much this is going to suck, though I sometimes try to make myself think about what I did to get myself into this situation.  It really stays that way until the first spank lands.



Belle also asked about the thought process from the last swat onward until things are back to normal.  When she tells me it’s over, my first thought is usually just plain old relief, though every once in a while I feel disappointed if I feel like the behavior really deserved a longer spanking.  Since most of our spankings happen shortly before our usual bed time, and since we often but not always do have sex, I will often ask for her direction on whether we are having sex.  If so, I usually don’t undress.  I put away her tools, put the ottoman back in place at the foot of the bed, etc.  During that process, I’m generally not thinking about what just happened.  It really is like the slate has been cleaned.  When we get back in bed, however, we often do talk about the spanking she just delivered.  I’m usually feeling very loving and attracted to her in that moment.  There is something so very attractive about her willingness to exercise her power like that.  That period right after a spanking is probably the closest I ever get to feeling “submissive,” though the better word probably is “humbled.”  It’s like a lot of the male ego, stress, anxiety, etc. just vanishes.


How about you?  What are you gentlemen thinking about during that after a spanking has been announced but before it has been delivered?  What about immediately after?  


How about our Disciplinary Wives? What are you thinking about during the lead up to announcing a spanking?   What about when you are actually communicating your decision to give one?



Has it changed over time?  Have you gone from tentative to confident?



How about when you are ready to deliver?


How do you feel after you’ve taken care of business?  


I hope you all have a great week. 

Sunday, September 13, 2020

No Post This Week & RIP to A Boyhood Crush

Hi all.  I'm sorry, but we have family stuff going on this weekend.  So, I won't be posting other than these tribute pics to Dame Diana Rigg who passed away earlier this week.  I'm a huge James Bond fan, and one of the few among such fans who rates On Her Majesty's Secret Service as one of the best Bond films.  I don't recall when I saw it or her for the first time, but I think it was back in high school. Whenever it was, I had a serious crush from that point on.  I wasn't very attuned to such things at the time, but I've always felt she had a remarkably kinky vibe. While a bit sheer, this first pic seems to be quite fitting for this Year of the Mask.



Sunday, September 6, 2020

The Club - Meeting #354 - Jobs, Careers, Professions and DD

To be accountable means that we are willing to be responsible to another person for our behavior and it implies a level of submission to another's opinions and viewpoints." ― Wayde Goodall


Hello all.  Welcome back to the Disciplined Husbands Forum. Our weekly gathering of men and women participating or interested in Domestic Discipline Relationships. I hope you had a good week.


For those of you in the U.S., I hope you are in the middle of an enjoyable, long Labor Day weekend.  Since Monday is a holiday devoted to laborers and workers, it is timely in relation to a tangent some of us went off on last week.  Spanked Cowboy noted that his wife is a former teacher, which led to these responses from Liz and Alan:


I think teachers and school officials are very likely to become spankers in their personal lives. Police officers and judges as well.



This is interesting, suggesting as you do that certain occupations are more likely to produce spankers, presumably linked to the authority their day jobs provide. ( although it is also possible people with a lot of everyday authority may be interested in the power exchange that spanking often produces. I don't know of any formal research bearing on the relationship between spanking and occupations. although there is some anecdotal evidence that spanking may be more common among police officers and military personnel, (in the former case ( cops) the interest in spanking might be more the spankee that the disciplinarian). None of this is very scientific although the question as you present it could be interesting to research. In my own limited personal experience people from the medical fields are attracted to spanking.




That led me to refer tack to a poll I did way back in 2014 (when Blogger still had a polling gadget) that asked about our readers’ professions.  The results were as follows:



Doctor/Medical Provider:                     2%

Lawyer:                                                 12%

Accountant:                                           3%

Teacher:                                                4%

Other Profession:                                 13%

Business Executive:                             11%

Business Non-Executive:                     4%

Engineer/Technology:                          15%

Business Owner:                                  14%

Other:                                                   16%


As I admitted at the time, this poll was about as unscientific as it possibly could have been, for reasons both within and outside by control. The potential sample size was limited to however many readers I had at that time.  Of those, only 107 responded to the poll.  So, both the overall pool and the number of respondents were small.  I also came up with the categories, which were obviously very under-inclusive. But, even with a sample of only 107 self-selected respondents, a few interesting points seemed to emerge.


First, contrary to Alan’s observations about those in the medical profession, in this small poll it seemed that members of the medical community either were not very interested in domestic discipline, or did not visit domestic discipline or spanking oriented blogs very often, or were very shy when it comes to filling out polls.  I was a bit puzzled by that one, as I had always believed that DD seems to appeal guys with "control freak" tendencies or high-pressure jobs, and the medical profession seems to be chock full of those. And, maybe the egos in that profession might lead some of doctors' spouses to take up the paddle?

Second, I was a little surprised at how many engineers and technology professionals were represented, as I don't associate that group with the Alpha Male and "controller" archetypes that I usually associate with DD.  But, again, that may be no more than my own biases and limited experience shining through.  ZM was not one of our contributors at that time, so I hope he’ll weigh in on this once since he is into DD and has a very technical background. 


Third, one poll result did conform to my pre-existing biases and suppositions, namely that lawyers, business executives and business owners seemed to be over-represented among those who are into disciplinary spanking. 


Finally, "other" and "other professional" were, in combination, the largest block of respondents, which could indicate either that even back then we had a very diverse group of visitors to this blog or, less flattering, that I did a really poor job of selecting specific job categories and left out one or two large segments of the DD community.


Looking back, there was one other really big flaw in that poll:  It didn’t discriminate between spanker and spankees or between men and women.  At the time, I was really focused on blogging for men who were the disciplined parties in DD relationships, so my poll question really focused on whether there were discernible trends in the jobs and career choices of men in F/m-oriented DD relationships.  I didn’t focus at all on whether our Disciplinary Wives tended to come from any particular job or career background.



So, let's make jobs, professions and career choices, and their relationship to Domestic Discipline, the focus of this week's topic:  For those who are willing to share, what job, career or profession are YOU in, and what, if any, connection do you think there is between that job and your interest in DD?  Did the same personality factors that lead you into that career also influence your interest in DD?  For instance, if you are inclined to submit to your wife's authority, are you similarly submissive to authority at work?  Or, is the inverse true and you feel attracted to DD as a way of giving up the control you exercise on the job?  For our Disciplinary Wives, do you see any connection between your job and career choices and how readily you took to DD or how you approach being a disciplinarian at home?  I hope that some of our commenters who have more experience with a wide range of people in DD relationships, like Tomy and al, can tell us if they have noted any patterns regarding certain professions and careers that seem over-represented among DD participants on either end of the paddle?


I know that talking about jobs and professions may be sensitive for some, given that many do not want to reveal too much about themselves.  If there are sensitivities on that score (and there are for me), I would suggest posting your comment anonymously and not signing the name or pseudonym you usually use when participating in this blog.  


For spankers, teachers and principals are almost too easy (as evidenced in part by the sheer volume of spanking art representing school spankings).  I also wonder whether, even if the stereotype may once have had some basis in reality, does it today when corporal punishment in schools is not longer prevalent?  I could see how it might still have some validity, given that as Liz has pointed out husbands sometimes act like overgrown boys who need boundaries, and teachers have daily experience keeping such boys under control.  However, might having to exercise control like that in their day job make them averse to having to take on similar responsibilities at home?


I am in one of those professions that was over-represented in my 2014 poll.  This did not occur to me when I wrote that post back in 2014, but while I had been in my profession for several years when I discovered DD, it was at about that time that I had taken a big jump into real executive-level responsibility.  I’ve never been able to account for why I was so attracted to DD even though I did not have the pre-existing spanking interest that so many of our male commenters had, but it could be that for me it required a confluence of two elements, i.e. exposure and timing.  Until I discovered the Disciplinary Wives Club, I’d never really encountered the concept of adult disciplinary spanking.  Coincidentally, it was around that same time that I took on far more responsibility and stress in my career.  It very well may be that had I learned about DD earlier, when my career was less stressful and I felt less overwhelmed with responsibility, it would not have had as much appeal.  


So, give us the benefit of your observations and experiences with the role of our career and job choices play in  Domestic Discipline. And, have a fun, relaxing, and safe weekend.