Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club. Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.
I'm headed off on a small adventure over the next week, with some of it off-grid and all of it with other people around all the time. So, I won't be posting or commenting much. I had planned to just say I was taking the week off, but TG posted a comment on last week's topic that will serve well as the topic for this week.
"If this is an inappropriate post, please remove it. It has nothing to do with the current conversation but is more a suggestion for a future topic. I guess it could be summarized as “I know myself but I don’t understand myself.” I’d be interested to know if others have similar thoughts. First, some context: we’ve been in this DD lifestyle a long time - twenty years plus - and if I’m honest, I don’t receive discipline as often as I feel I should. Firstly I don’t understand craving that, as it is genuinely a painful experience. Certainly there is the element of washing away any feelings of guilt over whatever it was that I did, plus making her feel better by getting the anger out of her system, but that doesn’t explain it all. Anyway, a few weeks ago she told me to come to the room she was in and bring the cane, I had no idea why but did as I was told. Turned out yet there was a fairly small thing that I had been reminded to do many times and had forgotten once too often, and this time was caned for it. Of course (1) I was happy to take the punishment and (2) it was very painful and certainly not in any way pleasant at the time."
"So here’s my confusion, firstly let me say that I would never intentionally do anything that would get me disciplined - I think that would come under the heading of disappointing her to a much greater extent and would be out of the question for me. However I have not repeated this small transgression a single time in the last few weeks, even though I have had plenty of opportunities to do so and it wouldn’t look deliberate if I did. So the punishment really worked. I can’t reconcile my craving for discipline with the pain of actually getting it with my absolute reluctance deliberately to do even a small thing to earn it. Is this just me being even more weird than others, or do others have similar confusions ? TG"
I look forward to reading your responses but perhaps not until I get back. I hope you all have a great week.
Hi TG,
ReplyDeleteIf I understand your feelings as you have expressed them, you are saying I don’t want to disappoint her, but I still want and need her discipline. Those feeling plus the reality that spankings really work to incentivize you to modify your behavior WHILE still seeking discipline conjures up a huge puzzle for you.
As you put it so well, you “know: yourself but don’t “understand” yourself. This is not the paradox it seems and if you focus upon the spanking and how much you really don’t want it when one is imminent and inevitable (and during one as well) – if you focus upon that you will realize the spanking itself is a means to an end and not the end itself (the puns are awful and not intended)
What you are seeking in discipline is the love and other deep feelings including some sexual feelings that comes with experiencing the exercise of firm female authority within a loving relationship .It is a woman that you love and respect delivering a scorching scolding, or ordering you to bring her the cane, or just giving you a firm pat on the bum as she ushers you into the corner –that is what fires runs your engine and makes it all fit together.
It’s that exercise of feminine authority and not the spanking itself that you need, I believe all this derives from the developmental interaction of hard wired genetics and formative experiences in both males and females who have a need to be spanked.
But it doesn’t matter where it comes from. What matters is that you allow yourself to experience who you are and what you need and to share it with your wife without being confounded by it. It is what it is and most of the time it’s pretty good.
Alan
Hello Alan,
DeleteExcellent insights as always!
"What you are seeking in discipline is the love and other deep feelings including some sexual feelings that comes with experiencing the exercise of firm female authority within a loving relationship .It is a woman that you love and respect delivering a scorching scolding, or ordering you to bring her the cane, or just giving you a firm pat on the bum as she ushers you into the corner –that is what fires runs your engine and makes it all fit together." - Exactly this. It is all about the "exercise of firm female authority."
"It’s that exercise of feminine authority and not the spanking itself that you need," - Again, exactly right. However, I should mention that this only works for me if there is the direct or implied threat of spanking or other (mostly physical) punishments, and even then only if at least sometimes these things actually do happen. So it is the exercise of female authority backed up by the realistic threat of receiving punishments like she has used with some regularity in the past.
-ZM
It is funny, I also cannot bring myself to intentionally break a rule to invite the punishment that I crave but do not want. It seems like cheating. It does invite the response from wife that why should she give me something that I want when I've been naughty - but I genuinely don't. There is a minor task that my wife feels strongly about that I just will not do (because it seems a waste of time)... unless there is the threat of punishment hanging over not doing it, since that has been in place I have only forgotten once!
ReplyDeleteI've been thinking (and writing) about this for a long time. Speaking just for myself. There is an underlying sexual component. I'm turned on when I think about being spanked. Reading some of the DWC stuff is very erotic to me. I'm sure I'm not alone.
ReplyDeleteThat doesn't mean I like being spanked. I hate it. It hurts a lot. Yet... I asked for it and want it when I haven't been spanked in a while. Taken by itself, this is a very odd combination of feelings. Based on what I've read on the Net, it's common among men who want domestic discipline. As an aside, the women I've known who receive domestic discipline are far more upfront about the sexual aspect of disciplinary spanking. I know at least two women who are naughty enough to orgasm during disciplinary spankings. Not me or any other guy I know.
I would never intentionally break a rule. The idea of provoking a disciplinary spanking feels wrong. The entire point of my domestic discipline is that it gives my wife extra control in our relationship and she is encouraged to spank me if I do things that upset her. So far, she only spanks me for breaking an established rule, like forgetting a chore.
Spanking definitely teaches me. I don't consciously try to remember my chores, but for a while after I've been spanked, I do them faithfully. I'm not clear on exactly what's going on with me, but spanking is effective at conditioning my behavior. That's what I wanted from the beginning. Like not intentionally breaking a rule, I'm not intentionally "learning" better behavior. The paddles seem to change me without my voluntary help.
I agree. Whilst spanking thoughts, talk, stories and videos are an erotic turn on for me, once a discipline session starts all erotic effect goes out the window! And whilst I have often thought of asking for a spanking, I never have as the closer I get to an actual session, the more I try to get out of it.
DeleteI was interested in ‘she is encouraged to spank me if I do things that upset her’ - is that you doing no the encouraging and if so how? TB
Frankly, I want the pain because it turns the emotional pain of disappointing my husband and myself into physical pain that is quickly released. The sting may last but the guilt is gone and I feel I have paid a fair price for my transgression and learned a lesson for the future. At least that is the theory if he would only set my behind on fire!
ReplyDeleteCynthia Ellen
I mostly agree with Cynthia. I don't want to be punished but do feel much better when it has been given. I would much rather live with the pain of a spanking than the guilt. You are right Cynthia, there are times when I know I need the learned lesson and to physically pay for my infractions and truly wish she would spank me to tears and beyond.
ReplyDeleteWe are at the game stage of our hopefully developing DD. With rare exception I only get spanked erotically. To encourage the disciplinary element, I do sometimes misbehave on purpose, especially in bed. For instance, he may tell me earlier in the day to wear a certain nightie to bed but I may "forget" in the hopes he will punish me for it. I don't see anything wrong with this now, but if we were truly DD I would not misbehave on purpose.
ReplyDeleteCynthia Ellen
I understand completely, Cynthia
DeleteAll, just a heads-up, I'll probably be off-line for several days beginning later this afternoon. While I'm glad people are posting in response to TG's question, several comments were caught in the spam filter. That could happen while I'm off-grid and won't be able to release them. So, sorry in advance if your comments get held up for a few days.
ReplyDeleteI thought Anne had given up on the cane?
ReplyDeleteI guess practice makes perfect?
No I would never do anything deliberately to be spanked , firstly I figure she would see right through it anyway if I did , and secondly it would be plain dishonest.
I prefer she initiate it , as my desire is for her to take charge, and yes I definitely think twice about repeating something I have been spanked for.
Spanking pretty much cured me of my habit of interrupting her when she is speaking.
I consciously check myself now on that , and she will not hesitate to reprimand me publically if I were to try.
My mistake, it was TG , not Dan who was caned.
DeleteGetting back to the question TG originally-- asked which he summed up as making him feel he ‘knows’ himself but doesn’t “understand” himself.
ReplyDeleteSeveral folks have cited the pain of corporal punishment as the trigger and the motivation to seek spanking. My question to anyone who says that is are you sure it’s not the powerful endorphins and other lovely chemicals that come with spanking –rather than the pain.
I know it’s hard to disentangle all the emotions that go with spanking , but I have received hundreds of disciplinary spankings and beyond those first few cracks there is nothing erotic about a serious ass warming in and of itself. Yes I have presented many times with a raging erection before a spanking but it disappears in seconds after she starts –and yes it has returned while doing corner time or otherwise remembering the experience.
But the spanking itself hurts like hell and is a means to many ends (including behaver mod) but it is not itself erotic in any sense
To test what I am saying acquire one of those mechanical spankers or caners on the market (better borrow one because you probably won’t want it long
Then hook yourself up and spank AWAY –even better .climax before you turn it on. See how erotic it is without the presence of another loving caring human being doing the punishment. Or hire a professional who is willing to beat your ass without any personal or emotional connection. .Then decide if it’s the pain alone you seek
I am not unaware that apparently there are some who really are aroused by the pain exclusive of any other emotional factors. To me this is the stuff of BDSM rather than DD. As others have asked, how can you be punished if you enjoy the punishment?
I want to stress that I am in no way being judgmental here but simply trying to understand TTWD. I welcome dialogue on this including anyone with different views.
Alan
I think Cynthia puts it really well, and in a way I haven’t thought of before : it’s converting one form of pain - emotional that really won’t fade away anytime soon - into another form - physical that will dissipate over the following hours or days. The responses overall are really interesting though as it seems that to various degrees, others have many of the same feelings as I do. I note the references to the sexual aspect of spanking, even when it’s disciplinary. Occasionally, if a more severe punishment is justified, a forced climax might be required first. This removes any hint of sexual pleasure from what follows. I think I have seen similar comments from others in the past TG
ReplyDeleteI wonder if a forced climax proor to punishment would add to the pain of a female as it does a male. Maybe I will find out some day. I have orgasmed while being spanked and taken from behind and loved it. The pain enhanced the orgasm.
DeleteCynthia Ellen
It is very unlikely it would be as effective on females as it is on males since the arousal patterns are so distinctly different. When males have an orgasm, they are just done and their level of arousal just falls off a cliff. Whereas females reach a high plateau from which they come down slowly. I think this difference is a large part of why women are often frustrated with the way men just want to roll over and go to sleep after making love.
DeleteHaving said all that, I would reserve post orgasm punishments for VERY rare occasions (if at all), since while they do remove any erotic element from the spanking, they also remove pretty much all the closeness and intimacy as well, and that is a huge loss. Also, they might make the spanking pure punishment, but in my experience they don't really make it hurt much more.
-ZM
Hi ZM,
DeleteI find your musings interesting about women and the effects of orgasm on spanking for them. You may be correct pointing to differences between males and females post orgasmic, particularly with regard to spanking. I have zero experience with spanking a woman post orgasm (some experience before) , so I would like to hear more firsthand evidence, pro and con on that.
Re males, I agree with you completely regarding the wisdom of rareness and in fact Dan has indicated he might do a topic on this in the future since post orgasm spankings are practiced apparently by some couples. After a lot of discussion about this with my wife ( plus an earlier GF) I do agree that a disciplinary wife should not be prohibited from using or threatening post orgasm spanking if she sees that within her authority, but for the reasons you note and others, it should not be used regularly in any long term DD relationship
Since Google is now exclusively using robots to make a human being prove that they are a human being, and because their robots are not very smart, you may not see this But if you do I would love to hear your thoughts
Alan
While a forced climax prior to spanking is a fairly common plot element in F/M spanking fiction, I recall being somewhat surprised that the practice was not unusual among our group here when the topic was discussed here a couple years back. The practice would not appeal to either of us, but one can obviously see how it would certainly increase the effectiveness of a true punishment spanking.
DeleteI would imagine that the situation would be different, however, for M/F spanking due to the difference in orgasmic response between the two sexes. As we all know, with men once the climax occurs, any sexual tension is immediately relieved for a given time. With women, however, this is usually not the case, and the sexual energy is often even more intense afterward. ( At least based on my experience, and what I have read. Obviously individual results may vary)
--al
“Al wrote: the practice would not appeal to either of us, but one can obviously see how it would certainly increase the effectiveness of a true punishment spanking.”
DeleteI find it unlikely it would appeal to any male, particularly one who has experienced it. However both of the women who have disciplined me in long term relationships have come to insist on it as an option. My former GF who was really my first disciplinarian saw it as a limit on her authority and I came to be uncomfortable with her feeling that way and so agreed to it, fortunately as it turned out just once partly because she felt it was not a positive experience However she made it clear she retained that authority despite never using it again. My wife of more than 20 years now knew about the practice and was pretty indifferent to until discovering its effectiveness for one particular behavior we struggled with early. She has not used it for many years now although she has threatened to use it. These experiences with post orgasm spanking have taught me they are to be avoided at all cost. But somewhat paradoxically I think they do belong among every wife’s disciplinary tools should she choose to use them. Back to my former GF’s argument, a guy just can’t say to a woman that her power to discipline is unlimited and then try to limit her in that way. (Argue against yes, deny no)
Now let’s see if the Google robot can get two in a row right.
Alan
Alan wrote: >I find it unlikely it would appeal to any male, particularly one who has experienced it.<
DeleteI would say that it does have a "fantasy appeal" for some men - just based on what I've read on forums over the years. However, I am absolutely certain the appeal of that fantasy would would immediately vanish at the moment of ejaculation. And, as you note, after one such spanking, the "fantasy appeal" would likely be greatly diminished. Although my wife has never intentionally spanked me after a "forced climax", very early on in the DWC lifestyle (maybe a couple of months), she did paddle me shortly after we had sex (with 10 minutes or so for a legitimate reason) It was truly an absolutely miserable experience - just sting and pain with no sense of the connection that I (and I suspect most spanked husbands) usually experience while being spanked (in spite of the very real pain).
At the time she was not aware of the effect that the male climax would have on "spanking receptivity". Later, we discussed the issue, and while she would still spank me shortly after sex if she found it necessary, she has said she would not order a forced climax before a spanking - as she finds it too "femdom-ish" (she mostly prefers old fashioned "domestic discipline" - no chastity devices, no feminization. Although she does employ anal discipline on occasion - pegging, plugs, large enemas - same area, I suppose).
Alan also wrote: >Back to my former GF’s argument, a guy just can’t say to a woman that her power to discipline is unlimited and then try to limit her in that way. (Argue against yes, deny no)<
Ideally, that would be true for a truly disciplinary relationship. However, in reality, we all have out contracts - implicit or explicit - and our limits. Other than in fantasy, very few men would consent to their wife spanking them in the middle of the living room while all their friends and family were over (just to use a silly extreme example). But we all strive - to varying degrees - to maintain the illusion of non-consent (or "consensual non-consent"). So, ultimately, it simply comes down to what a couple has agreed on up front to maintain the illusion of non-consent (a topic that has been extensively discussed here and on many other forums, F/M or otherwise). That said, if a disciplinary wife insisted on having the authority to order a forced climax prior to spanking - and the man (as is usually the case) has asked for the disciplinary arrangement - then I would agree that he should just accept her authority on the issue - and then hope it is seldom used. --al
Hi Alan, Interesting that you mention Google's stupid filters, since I wrote a reply to one of your posts a couple of days ago (regarding pain), and somehow it got stuck in spam neverland. I won't try to rewrite it completely, but the gist of it is that I absolutely agree that for almost all of us, pain is not the primary thing, but rather exercise of female authority. Also, pretty much all sexual feelings are forgotten about 30 seconds into a spanking, so while it may be stimulating thinking about it before and after, during it is simply not all that sexual. Finally, of course there are masochists, who actually get off on pain, and I think for them spanking would never be an effective punishment. But for those who don't like pain (like me) it is most definitely punishment even though I do find the whole thing a huge turn on anytime except when it is actually happening.
DeleteRegarding post-climax spankings, most all of the posters here over the years have resorted to that very rarely, and I think with good reason. The biggest effect of it, as I remember from my total of one experience, is it just removed all warmth and closeness from the whole experience. I agree that it should probably remain in the wife's power to use it as necessary, but I would really reserve it for very rare circumstances. It is kind of the spanking equivalent of the silent treatment; it may work, but at a huge cost.
Regarding spanking a woman post-orgasm, I have no experience either. I was merely speculating that it probably wouldn't have much effect since women don't fall off the cliff of desire nearly as quickly as men do after orgasm.
Finally, Al, I agree that much of what we consider "non-consent" is an illusion, but I think there is value in maintaining that illusion, especially if everyone is aware that the consent is never absolute. Could I stop my wife from spanking me? Of course. But then she might never do it again, and this is something that I need, even if I don't always want it.
-ZM
ZM wrote: >Finally, Al, I agree that much of what we consider "non-consent" is an illusion, but I think there is value in maintaining that illusion, especially if everyone is aware that the consent is never absolute. Could I stop my wife from spanking me? Of course. But then she might never do it again, and this is something that I need, even if I don't always want it.<
DeleteWell said - while most men have the physical capacity to simply get up from a spanking at any time - and anyone can just refuse a spanking to begin with, that really does defeat the entire purpose of what we asked for to begin with. And I suspect that most men who have asked for a disciplinary arrangement realize that - and that becomes a psychological motivation that makes the "illusion of consent" less of an illusion.
Again, the topic of "the illusion of nonconsent" or "consensual nonconsent" has been discussed here a few times before - and endlessly on all types of bdsm/kink forums. I only use the term "illusion" because ultimately we can theoretically all walk away from it at any time (as opposed to a child being unable to refuse a parental spanking). In actual practice, however, this is not always as simple as it seems at the psychological level. In addition to the practical consideration that we should not refuse a spanking because we asked for this lifestyle to begin with, and doing so may cause us to lose the disciplinary life we asked for - as Alan and I have both discussed here before - there seems to be a point at which the regularly disciplined husband becomes (psychologically) virtually unable to refuse a spanking that his wife has dictated. When our wife says to drop our pants and assume the position, we realize that we simply have no choice. Our wife has decided that she is going to spank us, so we are going to get our bottom blistered - whether we like it or not or want it or not. We just have to accept our fate and take what we have coming - refusal is not even an option.
So, although at one level consent is always given - psychologically the non-consensual discipline that we have asked for can indeed seem very real.
--al
Hi --al and ZM,
Delete_At this point in our relationship I am probably immune to a post orgasm spanking, and so I can probably think about it as unemotionally and rationally as it is possible to do. (I am absolutely immune to a spanking after any kind of forced orgasm. She simply doesn’t do that. If it ever did happen, again like your example, it would be after normal intercourse and because of my behavior after intercourse, not before)
To the extent that there is a fantasy aspect to it, that is extinguished after a single experience. There is simply nothing erotic or bonding about it. When there is a second or more experience, it really is devoid of any emotion except dread and regret. That obviously is one male’s opinion and maybe it is different for other guys or from the female perspective. Perhaps a female with some experience can comment on it but my wife has said she gets nothing out of it except that it’s short and requires little effort.
I have read (third party) arguments from women claiming experience, who advocate it and claim that it actually is more merciful, leaves less marks, and allows them to give a much lighter spanking. There was a guy who ran a yahoo group a few years back who reported ( if I am remembering correctly) his wife used it for every spanking ( forced climax)
But even allowing that is true for the sake of discussion, the lack of emotional resonance in spanking after all eroticism is removed –makes it a poor choice in my opinion for effective relationship building discipline . One thing worth mentioning though is how post orgasm spanking has to be very effected by the absence of endorphins and other “happy” chemicals that can happen for a spanko. The pain and generally miserable psychological experience males usually report is probably because those chemicals are absent and not because she is spanking him harder.
There is no question in my mind that a post orgasm spanking is a very “real “punishment and probably effective behavior management. But the bigger question is whether what it gives up to do that makes it worthwhile. I think my answer to that is pretty clear. Anyone else care to agree, disagree or equivocate?
Alan
nonymousJuly 10, 2022 at 10:32 AM
ReplyDeleteGetting back to the question TG originally-- asked which he summed up as making him feel he ‘knows’ himself but doesn’t “understand” himself.
Several folks have cited the pain of corporal punishment as the trigger and the motivation to seek spanking. My question to anyone who says that is are you sure it’s not the powerful endorphins and other lovely chemicals that come with spanking –rather than the pain.
I know it’s hard to disentangle all the emotions that go with spanking , but I have received hundreds of disciplinary spankings and beyond those first few cracks there is nothing erotic about a serious ass warming in and of itself. Yes I have presented many times with a raging erection before a spanking but it disappears in seconds after she starts –and yes it has returned while doing corner time or otherwise remembering the experience.
But the spanking itself hurts like hell and is a means to many ends (including behaver mod) but it is not itself erotic in any sense
To test what I am saying acquire one of those mechanical spankers or caners on the market (better borrow one because you probably won’t want it long
Then hook yourself up and spank AWAY –even better .climax before you turn it on. See how erotic it is without the presence of another loving caring human being doing the punishment. Or hire a professional who is willing to beat your ass without any personal or emotional connection. .Then decide if it’s the pain alone you seek
I am not unaware that apparently there are some who really are aroused by the pain exclusive of any other emotional factors. To me this is the stuff of BDSM rather than DD. As others have asked, how can you be punished if you enjoy the punishment?
I want to stress that I am in no way being judgmental here but simply trying to understand TTWD. I welcome dialogue on this including anyone with different views.
Alan
Reply
Hi Alan,
DeleteI agree fully about the spanking itself - at least after the first few seconds - is not erotic in any way. I expect that most people who find it to be erotic aren't experiencing what I would classify as "real" punishment spankings.
I too think that for most everyone here - including those who think it isn't - it is really pretty much ALL about the exercise of female authority from someone who cares about you, and the intimacy that naturally flows from the experience. I don't understand why anyone would want to remove that part, and that is the main result I see of pre-spanking climaxes. Yes, the wife might want to reserve it for RARE circumstances to deliberately cause this reduction in the feeling of caring and intimacy, but this would be something that maybe happens maybe every 5-10 years. Otherwise, if she wants to make it a "real" punishment, all she has to do is swing the paddle, strap, or cane harder and longer!
And yes, there are those who are genuine masochists who actually get off on the pain, but I too see that as being more of the BDSM crowd. And in those cases, I don't think spanking could be an effective punishment (since they like pain), and even forcing them to climax before would probably only make the whole thing more fulfilling to them. For the rest of us non-masochists, spanking is quite an effective punishment indeed!
-ZM
I found my two disciplinary spankings extremely erotic, at least at the beginning and the end, as others have noted. During the spanking I was concentrating on handling the pain and feeling punished, not whether I was turned on. But since I obviously don't have the visible sign of an erection that disappears during the spanking, I don't really know how my body was responding. I am quite sure I stayed wet throughout, and my husband easily entered me immediately afterwards. But that doesn't mean I was turned on by the pain but rather by the whole punishment ritual. Maybe it's easier for a female to stay aroused.
DeleteCynthia Ellen
For me, there are two different things going on.
ReplyDeleteFirst, I very much enjoy being EROTICALLY spanked. That is, in a sexual situation, with a nice warm up, maybe pushing my boundaries, but only gently and with my (implied or explicit) consent. That's sexy and wonderful to me, and a core part of my sexual identity.
Second, I very much need, or at least crave, being subject to my partner's real discipline and control. It feels "right" for me, and makes me feel loved and cared for. But that requires her, when I misbehave, to employ disciplinary measures that I genuinely dislike. For practical reasons and to be compatible with J's needs and desires, that usually means corporal punishment.
So how do we resolve these two things? First, I'm very lucky, because J is willing to indulge the first from time to time and is equally comfortable as I am with the second. So what we've settled into is this. I'm free to ask her for an erotic spanking any time I want one, and if she's so inclined, she'll indulge me. I do ask for spankings from time to time, maybe once a month or so, though most of my sexual pleasure and energy lately is focused on her (which is also very gratifying for me).
But when she disciplines or punishes me, she goes out of her way to de-sexualize it and make it painful from the get go. Often (and always if she's punishing me for something major, which is rare), that means having me climax first. I absolutely hate this. There's no "warm up", and it is always both harder than I expect and goes on longer, using implements (cane or rubber strap) reserved for the purpose. There's no sex at the end, though she'll usually hug me later to reassure me that the matter is over. Nothing about it is comforting, sexy, or fun, and I hate being disciplined, and seek to avoid it. I'd NEVER misbehave deliberately just to get spanked, because I know that I will get MUCH more than I bargained for, and I can always ask for the kind of spanking I'd like if I want one.
But here' s the thing. While I hate being disciplined, the fact that I'm disciplined and that I know she'll do it is very comforting to me, in more than just a sexual way. A couple years ago, after she disciplined me for something, she asked me if I resented it. I told her, honestly, that I resent it while it's happening, but the memory of it weeks and months later reminds me how lucky I am to have her.
I think it depends on the nature of the desire. The idea of spanking as punishment is highly provocative to me, no matter what my perspective is on the actual experience itself. I have no problem embracing the sexual nature of it, but if it's not about a penalty for actual misbehavior, spanking doesn't live up to what it needs to be. If someone, including myself, intentionally misbehaves in order to get spanked, then it falls flat. It becomes a game. Nothing wrong with games, but they don't intrigue me. They don't elicit the right emotions. It's a completely different psychology. The one instigating the spanking is in control, and being in control of your own punishment is not the condition that satisfies. That's why I can be happily married to a wife who is not into discipline. I can live fine without it but, if it happened realistically and without being contrived, my mind would be blown.
ReplyDeleteYes, Brett, I also want it to be real and not a game. I am just trying to get my husband there. Since he enjoys erotic spanking, I am trying to expand on that as Dan suggested. My two actual disciplinary spankings where he was totally in control is exactly the feeling I crave. But I made a huge mistake of telling him I needed it harder, and that drove him away from the idea. I did not truly realize the concession he was already making.
DeleteCynthia Ellen
Hi Brett, I think you nailed it on a number of points.
Delete"The idea of spanking as punishment is highly provocative to me, no matter what my perspective is on the actual experience itself." - Exactly this. I am turned on by the underlying authority and by the fact that she can and does spank me. But I am not excited by spanking, and in fact try to avoid it.
"I have no problem embracing the sexual nature of it, but if it's not about a penalty for actual misbehavior, spanking doesn't live up to what it needs to be." - I too have no problem with the sexual nature of spanking. I am always surprised when some people try to deny the sexual nature of it, or somehow minimize it, when I think that it is precisely the implicit sexuality of it and the strong underlying fantasy that make spanking so powerful.
"If someone, including myself, intentionally misbehaves in order to get spanked, then it falls flat. It becomes a game. Nothing wrong with games, but they don't intrigue me. They don't elicit the right emotions. It's a completely different psychology. The one instigating the spanking is in control, and being in control of your own punishment is not the condition that satisfies." - Again, fully agree. I would never misbehave to get a punishment. Primarily because I don't like getting punishments, I just like the thought of being subject to them. And secondarily because if I did intentionally cause the punishment, it is indeed me in control of it, and it is hardly a punishment at that point.
-ZM
Cynthia Ellen, that's a difficult situation when you can't be totally honest about your desires. But at least you know where you and your husband stand on the issue of severity. You can work towards bridging the gap. I don't believe I'm a typical case with regard to a desire for DD. Trying to get my wife interested in it is not the way it works for me. If it's not something she wants to embrace without my urging, then I just let it go.
DeleteThanks, ZM. In many ways, for many reasons, spanking is potentially sexual. The tricky part is that, as discipline, it must be authentic. The most exciting thing to me is that spanking actually works as effective punishment, whether it be to modify behavior or administer justice. That's the power of it. While it seems I've always wanted to hold that kind of nurturing authority, I'm also highly attracted to a woman who wields that power.
DeleteLike TG, Mark and Caged Lion, I wouldn't intentionally break a rule in order to get spanked. For instance, our last disciplinary session involved reminding me to keep the sink clean. I don't know what our next one will be about, but it won't be about the sink!
ReplyDeleteThere is one area where I may be a repeat offender, though. That's being spanked for ogling girls - generally either at the beach, or on tv. I am allowed some ogling, and my wife will even join in when there's someone particularly noticeable. But, as Bob Dylan says, "sometimes you just find yourself over the line."
I'm certainly not trying to get a spanking, (or disrespect anyone) but I know I'm flirting with the line, and somehow that makes it even more enticing.
CrimsonKing
Hi CK,
DeleteI agree about intentionally breaking a rule in order to get a spanking. It just wouldn't happen with me.
I view repeat offenses as something much different than that. At least for me, repeat offenses are because I really want to do something, or perhaps it is an ingrained habit. I do it not thinking about the fact that it may result in a punishment, or even if I know it may, I think I can weasel out of it somehow.
Regarding ogling girls, I am with you 100%. It is just something I do. And my wife, like yours, allows me plenty of leeway on this, as long as I am not being so obvious that others would notice (especially the girls I am eyeing) and as long as it is not so blatant that my wife starts to feel disrespected (which I would never want her to feel).
"I'm certainly not trying to get a spanking, (or disrespect anyone) but I know I'm flirting with the line, and somehow that makes it even more enticing." - Well said!
-ZM
I will on occasion intentionally do something to earn a spanking. It's not that I want to feel the pain. Its more I want the attention. I have told her at times and it is up to her to decide how to deal with it. I think the anticipation is a big part of it. Knowing it's coming and there is no getting out of it does excite me but when the paddle strikes that pain has me wondering why I wanted this
ReplyDeleteLike most of you, I would not diliberately do anything to earn a disciplinary spanking. That said, I do benefit from getting one every so often. Because of my desire to make our DD relationship real, I self report, usually about going past my alcohol limit. That will always result in a hard paddling soon after the offense. I agree with Alan about wanting "firm female authority within a loving relationship". My lady gives me a sound maintance spanking every week using a timer, lasting between 5 to 7 minutes. She also gives preventative spankings before a stressful situation, which has worked out very well. Often they are preceded by 5 minutes of corner time, which is humbeling and helps me focus, as well as heightening my anticipation. The combined effect of these spankings has improved my overall behavior, as well as providing increased sexual tension. I don't really understand why my desire to be held accountable and have boundries enforced is so exciting and important to me, but there is no escaping the truth of how much good it does.
ReplyDeleteI agree with a lot of comments about needing it to be a real disciplinary spanking. She seems to think this is a game because she knows it excites me. She has given me two sever spankings over the last weekend and threatened me with another while she was not feeling well but when I asked her if she was going to follow thru and give me another she took it the wrong way.
ReplyDeleteShe thought I wanted it and got upset that I asked her
My point was she did not take it seriously. I think it's a game to her and I was extremely disappointed not that she did not spank me but that she did not follow thru with some kind of punishment for disrespecting her like extra chores or corner time.
Much of the time I think this is largely a game to my wife, and near the beginning it pretty much entirely was. In the end, I decided that it really doesn't matter too much if it is something different to her and to me, as long as we are both getting something out of it. And as time has passed, she has seen more and more genuine change (especially of attitude and mindsets, which was most surprising to her) and she has started to see that she can benefit a lot from it too. As this realization is dawning, I think it is becoming more and more real to her.
Delete-ZM
For my husband, spanking is foreplay. To me that is a game. I want punishment. But I know that misbehaving on purpose is also a game. My hope is that my punishment can be his foreplay. I will enthusiastically submit to any kind of sex he wants after he punishes me. It's all about being controlled and forcefully making me the best version of myself.
ReplyDeleteCynthia Ellen
Whilst I have never done anything deliberately to achieve a punishment, I have on a number of occasions indicated (in my written report / journal) that I had misbehaved to the point that I felt that a punishment was overdue. My not infrequent feedback to her is that she misses opportunities & behaviors that merit punishment. I have suggested that such inconsistency in punishment means that my behavior is inconsistent as I am not always sure of the consequences. I have tried to explain that if she always punished bad behavior then that behavior would, over time, completely disappear. Equally I want her to punish with emotion, when she is (slightly) angry instead of leaving it for hours / days and then calmly carrying out the punishment. I know that the few times that she has spanked when still angry have been the most memorable & the most effective. Not because they were longer or harder, but because they felt the most real. TB
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't ever want my actions to damage my relationship with Beth. Purposely acting out would certainly have that effect. Also, it wouldn't pass the straight face test if I tried to convince her that spankings don't turn me on. But that doesn't mean that I enjoy long hard sessions with her hairbrush.
ReplyDeleteThe first spankings Beth gave me were playful ones with her hand as part of foreplay. I still get those in the bedroom and occasionally ask for one. It probably doesn't do much for her libido, but she doesn't mind indulging me. A punishment spanking from her is a completely different story. I was surprised how quickly she took to it and she has confessed that it gives her some satisfaction to deal with my transgressions. A disciplinary spanking from her has never led to sex, even though I find the idea of my wife disciplining me to be quite erotic. Maybe a couple of days later as something more akin to "making up sex", but not right after.
Kevin,
DeleteI am interested to know how you transitioned from erotic spanking to disciplinary. You say Beth took to it quickly. But how did you introduce it?
Cynthia Ellen
(Posted by al).
ReplyDeleteSince the comments are a bit slower this week in Dan's absence, I would like to throw in a couple of quotes from the DWC site as possible discussion points at some point.
From the FAQ section of the DWC site - Spanking doesn't always have to be "disciplinary".
FAQ # 3
"Is it best to reserve all spanking for disciplinary purposes in a DWC home?"
Answer:
Oh, I hope not! While our theme is indeed proper discipline by wives, we are all about having fun and good times. Even the creation of a DWC home should be desirable for both parties. In reality, most of us love to do role plays, creative scenarios, or just have a spanking session for no reason other than "general principles", such as "you must have gotten away with more than I'll ever know, so into the bedroom with you".
On occasion we will attend a party where there is more likely to just be a lot of spanking going on with only very occasional role playing.
(Also from al) - The spam filter apparently ate my other quote from the DWC site - so I will try again as a reply to my earlier comment.
DeleteThis is from the the article "A Husband's Essay" from the Real People section of the DWC site - concerning whether our wives get turned on spanking us.
This is an excellent article as a whole, by the way. It is an excellent presentation of the DWC philosophy - highly recommended for those who have not read it.
The quote:
"Almost all of us, men at least, got into spanking through our erotic desires. Even a quite painful and unwanted spanking has erotic connotations to us, although perhaps not at the time it is occurring. I suspect the wife who spanks for discipline gets at least a little turned on, even when she's angry."
I would shiver with excitement if my husband ever said that to me ("You must have gotten away with more than I'll ever know ..."
DeleteCynthia Ellen
(Also from al) - From the article "A Husband's Essay" in the "Real People" section of the DWC site - on the question of "do wives get turned on spanking their husbands?"
ReplyDeleteThis is an excellent article as a whole, by the way. Highly recommended for those who have not read it - an excellent presentation of the DWC philosophy.
"Almost all of us, men at least, got into spanking through our erotic desires. Even a quite painful and unwanted spanking has erotic connotations to us, although perhaps not at the time it is occurring. I suspect the wife who spanks for discipline gets at least a little turned on, even when she's angry."