“A woman should be two things: who and what she wants.”
Hello all. Welcome back to the Forum: Disciplined Husbands & Disciplinary Wives. I hope you all had a good week.
Mine was pretty damn unproductive, which is becoming kind of a disturbing pattern. I finished off a huge project in September, and I've had some trouble getting back to anything resembling my normal work focus. It's kind of irritating, because I'm one of those people who actually like what I do and like being productive, so downtime just starts feeling like laziness. And, it kind of is. As I get older, I become more convinced that you can only maintain a frenetic pace for so long. At some point, you hit a wall and your performance goes down whether you want it or not. It's a humbling thing for a Type-A to admit, but true nonetheless. Anyway, that is what I was thinking about on this lovely Saturday as I face up to having to now spend time this weekend catching up on stuff I neglected during the week because of that lack of focus thing.
Speaking of humbling, I want to thank Aunt Kay again for stopping by and hope she will continue to do so. I would like to follow up on one thing she wrote for last week's post, making it this week's topic as it is similar to one I had planned to do anyway. Aunt Kay observed:
When we did things together with other DWC couples; like going to dinners, events, visiting for weekends, there was such a sense of liberation. Just hanging out, being able to talk about lifestyle stuff was amazing. It was like we knew we were special, we shared a kinky little secret when we were out among the rest of the world.
If you had an opportunity to interact in some more personal way with other husbands, wives or couples in the lifestyle, whether as a group or one-on-one, would that be something that interests you? I am not necessarily or even principally talking about group gatherings. It could be something as simple as a phone call between two Disciplinary Wives, exchanging ideas or boosting each others' confidence confidence in taking over their households. Or, maybe just an email between disciplined husbands exploring something they are struggling with or recounting their latest punishment. Or, for those slightly more open to it, meeting for a beer or dinner after "coming out" to a Wife, husband or Couple you know is in a DD or FLR relationship. What would your level of interest be in something like that? As I ask this question, I am acutely aware that this blog gets around 1500 to 2000 hits a day, far less than 10% of those comment at all, and of those, the vast majority do so anonymously. So, I am assuming the baseline level of openness to real conversations with others is pretty low, but you all may fool me.
When I originally planned to do this topic, I was thinking of it a little more in terms of mentoring or mutual support for the Wives. There are times when my wife simply retreats back into her conventional upbringing and has a hard time staying in the role of Leader. I think she also encounters those, "Does he really want it if I take a stronger lead" self-doubts. (Yes, I really do want it, is the answer to that one, by the way.) I think it could really help her get past those self-doubts if she had another Disciplinary Wife to chat with directly, whether by email, phone or in person. Now, whether she would be open to that is an entirely different matter. I really don't know. A few years ago, the answer would have been no, but things and people do change.
I am not, by the way, offering to be Master of Ceremonies at the kind of gathering Aunt Kay and Jerry are talking about. I do know that however much my wife and I have opened up, we aren't there yet. We still have careers that could be damaged if our "kink" was more widely known. But, a dinner with a particular couples, or maybe just a beer with one of the regular commenters if we happened to be in the same city some time, who knows? A few years ago, I probably wouldn't have been open to even that, but I am getting progressively less concerned about whether others find out, possibly because as I get closer to the end of my career than the beginning, I just don't care as much about what people think. I took a baby step in this direction last year, when I started wearing a necklace with a pendent containing a symbol that at least some BDSM enthusiasts might recognize as identifying a "submissive man" in that community. (I still don't quite self-identify as a "submissive," but if there is any kind of ornamentation or jewelry associated with Disciplined Husbands, I couldn't find it.) Now, most people would never even see this pendent, as it is under my shirt most of the time, but it is openly visible when I am in the gym though it's small and probably hard to see from more than a few feet away. But, if someone who was in the BDSM community saw it, they very well could recognize it. And, that level of openness at least is OK with me right now.
I am not, by the way, suggesting we explore with this topic the extent to which we are "out" to the vanilla world. We have done that before. and fairly recently. I'm really talking about, if the opportunity arose to interact in some more personal way with another Disciplinary Wife, Disciplined Husband or FLR/DD Couple, whether for mentoring or mutual support or just to get to know someone better who is in the one of these relationships would that be something you would be open to or interested in?
Have a great week. If you are new to our Forum, please take a moment to go to the Guestbook (tab above) and tell us a little about your DD or FLR relationship or aspirations.
Hello all. Welcome back to the Forum: Disciplined Husbands & Disciplinary Wives. I hope you all had a good week.
Mine was pretty damn unproductive, which is becoming kind of a disturbing pattern. I finished off a huge project in September, and I've had some trouble getting back to anything resembling my normal work focus. It's kind of irritating, because I'm one of those people who actually like what I do and like being productive, so downtime just starts feeling like laziness. And, it kind of is. As I get older, I become more convinced that you can only maintain a frenetic pace for so long. At some point, you hit a wall and your performance goes down whether you want it or not. It's a humbling thing for a Type-A to admit, but true nonetheless. Anyway, that is what I was thinking about on this lovely Saturday as I face up to having to now spend time this weekend catching up on stuff I neglected during the week because of that lack of focus thing.
Speaking of humbling, I want to thank Aunt Kay again for stopping by and hope she will continue to do so. I would like to follow up on one thing she wrote for last week's post, making it this week's topic as it is similar to one I had planned to do anyway. Aunt Kay observed:
When we did things together with other DWC couples; like going to dinners, events, visiting for weekends, there was such a sense of liberation. Just hanging out, being able to talk about lifestyle stuff was amazing. It was like we knew we were special, we shared a kinky little secret when we were out among the rest of the world.
If you had an opportunity to interact in some more personal way with other husbands, wives or couples in the lifestyle, whether as a group or one-on-one, would that be something that interests you? I am not necessarily or even principally talking about group gatherings. It could be something as simple as a phone call between two Disciplinary Wives, exchanging ideas or boosting each others' confidence confidence in taking over their households. Or, maybe just an email between disciplined husbands exploring something they are struggling with or recounting their latest punishment. Or, for those slightly more open to it, meeting for a beer or dinner after "coming out" to a Wife, husband or Couple you know is in a DD or FLR relationship. What would your level of interest be in something like that? As I ask this question, I am acutely aware that this blog gets around 1500 to 2000 hits a day, far less than 10% of those comment at all, and of those, the vast majority do so anonymously. So, I am assuming the baseline level of openness to real conversations with others is pretty low, but you all may fool me.
When I originally planned to do this topic, I was thinking of it a little more in terms of mentoring or mutual support for the Wives. There are times when my wife simply retreats back into her conventional upbringing and has a hard time staying in the role of Leader. I think she also encounters those, "Does he really want it if I take a stronger lead" self-doubts. (Yes, I really do want it, is the answer to that one, by the way.) I think it could really help her get past those self-doubts if she had another Disciplinary Wife to chat with directly, whether by email, phone or in person. Now, whether she would be open to that is an entirely different matter. I really don't know. A few years ago, the answer would have been no, but things and people do change.
I am not, by the way, offering to be Master of Ceremonies at the kind of gathering Aunt Kay and Jerry are talking about. I do know that however much my wife and I have opened up, we aren't there yet. We still have careers that could be damaged if our "kink" was more widely known. But, a dinner with a particular couples, or maybe just a beer with one of the regular commenters if we happened to be in the same city some time, who knows? A few years ago, I probably wouldn't have been open to even that, but I am getting progressively less concerned about whether others find out, possibly because as I get closer to the end of my career than the beginning, I just don't care as much about what people think. I took a baby step in this direction last year, when I started wearing a necklace with a pendent containing a symbol that at least some BDSM enthusiasts might recognize as identifying a "submissive man" in that community. (I still don't quite self-identify as a "submissive," but if there is any kind of ornamentation or jewelry associated with Disciplined Husbands, I couldn't find it.) Now, most people would never even see this pendent, as it is under my shirt most of the time, but it is openly visible when I am in the gym though it's small and probably hard to see from more than a few feet away. But, if someone who was in the BDSM community saw it, they very well could recognize it. And, that level of openness at least is OK with me right now.
I am not, by the way, suggesting we explore with this topic the extent to which we are "out" to the vanilla world. We have done that before. and fairly recently. I'm really talking about, if the opportunity arose to interact in some more personal way with another Disciplinary Wife, Disciplined Husband or FLR/DD Couple, whether for mentoring or mutual support or just to get to know someone better who is in the one of these relationships would that be something you would be open to or interested in?
Have a great week. If you are new to our Forum, please take a moment to go to the Guestbook (tab above) and tell us a little about your DD or FLR relationship or aspirations.
Those of us in the BDSM lifestyle have something we call a "Munch". It is usually held once a month at a local restaurant. We are often given a private room, so we can speak freely without scaring the "vanillas". The Organizers usually reserve it as a book club, so no one outside the group is aware of our proclivities. It gives us a chance to meet others who practice the same thing we do.
ReplyDeleteStitch is doing the typing for me today.
If you are still on Fetlife, I will be happy to give you a link there that explains it in detail.
Book club. Love it!
DeleteMunches are not only reserved for BDSM. i have attended ones for Polyamory and Chastity as well. It is only limited by one's imagination.
ReplyDeleteAll things considered, seems like the Polyamory ones might be a lot more fun than the Chastity gatherings. Just saying . . . ;-)
DeleteYou'd be surprised. Polyamory and chastity need not be mutually exclusive. ;-)
DeleteTo a limited extent we have done this connecting with two other DD couples, one of which we are still in contact with regularly. For me it was a great experience talking to one other husband, long in a disciplinary relationship and willing to discuss experiences, and even what kind of spankings he got for what behavior. I found both guys more willing to open up about detail than either woman. Both wives were open about the fact they were in charge and spankings ( in both cases) were frequent. But both in my presence anyway shied away from much detail or specifics. For them I think spanking was something that happened but they were not that interested in having a in depth conversation about it ( in front of me)( although on one particularly memorable occasion one wife did spank her husband in our kitchen using one of my wife's paddles ( a nasty one) My wife was reinforced in her decision to make discipline a major part of our marriage by our friendship with these couples but she actually talks to her sister more about disciplinary issues than anyone else. Her sister is not in a F/M relationship but she strongly approves. As far as further connections I would cautiously welcome them but not sure about my wife. Having more friends in the lifestyle would not only be liberating for us but could not help but increase awareness of F/M marriages and their rewards.
ReplyDeleteAlan
Thanks, Alan. It's interesting that your wife is so open with her sister about it, even though her sister is not in an F/m relationship. But, the only person I have ever opened up to live about this also is not in a DD or FLR marriage, but I would still have no problem talking to her about it, other than the initial embarrassment.
DeleteThree of N's (my late wife) close friends - including J. - had watched me being spanked (and it may be that the word spread around) but J. continued the practice - the other two being common friends- but she also added another of her own friends... and, of course, B. (her own sister!). One of those 'common friends' once invited J. to come and watch HER husband being spanked (I wasn't invited, of course!). That's as far as we have gone (or wish to go) in the way of "opening up"...
DeleteL.
This isn't in-person contact but on FetLife there are two groups that deal specifically with women disciplining men: "F/m Spanking" and "Female Led Domestic Discipline".
ReplyDeleteI_ObeyHer
(my FetLife name)
I have long wished I could find a husband or couple that would be open to meeting for coffee or something! There would just be something about speaking to an actual PERSON that would make it so much more "real".
ReplyDeleteLike you and your wife.... at this stage there's no way my wife would meet w anyone related to this which is too bad. I think it would be an incredible catalyst for her , us and and an infant our DD relationship. "Misery loves company" so selfishly have to say it makes me feel better hearing your wife still moves in and out of the role.
Ok.... having put it out there, you have to share LOL. Now I'm dying of curiosity what's the symbol of your pendant!!??? That's so cool. Love the idea of the subtly of most that see it not giving it a thought.... but when someone in the know sees it might grin or in some subtle way acknowledging it!!!
I would love to describe the pendant, but it's just too close to "outing" myself to any reader who may actually know me. But, I will say that if you are interested, go to Etsy and run some searches for jewelry for submissive males. Lots of options to suit any fancy. There are also some beautiful paddles and other implements on there.
DeleteWhen Dev gives a punishment spanking its usually given in a short time frame. Sometimes I'll have an off day and be out of sorts and and a good paddling takes care of that nicely. However , we still have kids at home and often times she isn't able to " fix things ". Things brings me to having the thought of someone else carrying out that duty. When Dev is finished I feel very close to her. Having a different person in that role would make me feel like I was cheating and being unfaithful. We've been in this lifestyle 26 years. I wouldn't do anything to hurt her or jeopardize us.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Jr. Just to be clear, while some of Aunt Kay's comments included women allowing other women to punish their husbands at community events, I think it is worth nothing that WAS the context in which it was raised. Not husbands seeking out another disciplinarian on their own. Also, just to be clear regarding this topic, I was not meaning it to address spanking parties or similar group activities that actually involve spanking as part of the event. The topic focuses on whether people have or would want a DD or FLR mentor or have an interest in talking to or meeting another man, woman or couple in such a relationship.
DeleteI did the "munch thing"for while a long way back. I can't say I really enjoyed it that much. The thing is, you get a bunch of people together with this "common interest" only to often find that the commonality is never what one expects. So many of us do this with different reasons approaches and degrees that it still doesn't feel like a true connection unless you find that person or couple who think more along the same lines.
ReplyDeleteAnd at a munch the conversation is not going to stay centered on the lifestyle the entire time, and as soon as it drifts you begin to see just how different the participants are in belief, politics, educational levels, and incomes.
I have "met" other couples online over the years that seemed to be more aligned with how I see things......but they are rare. As such, I would welcome such a friendship in RL, but personally can't see it happening........and we are as open as you can get!
(So for fun, picture this hypothetical gathering of fellow DD-ers.....and imagine how quickly the comradery would degenerate as folks mention the approaching election! )
Or, watch when they DON'T mention the election, even though a hell of a lot of them are interested in it.
DeleteIt is an interesting point that a single common interest is usually not enough to make a group really cohesive, and that the differences between people are often a lot more determinative than their similarities in the extent to which they can really enjoy each other for any period of time. A book I read recently observed that people really are not that different from one another, but those areas where they do differ are VERY important.
Your observations are also why, when I was first thinking of this topic, it really was not about groups in any way. It was about connecting with some other person as a mentor or part of a mutual support relationship, or maybe talking with one other like-minded couple. You are right that those things can be fostered online. I have one that definitely fits in that category and a couple of others that I think could. The question for me is whether any of those might some day lead to a personal meeting, and I could definitely see that happening. A bigger question is whether my wife would do it, and how that might develop. A few years ago, I would have said no way, but now . . .
We have been to a couple of Fetlife Munches too. Had the same sense of "no outreach or efforts to help a new couple feel comfortable. But, by the same token, I have to say they mostly seemed like very nice people.
DeleteWith some real effort, I managed to get a couple of the women talking. Bless their hearts, they we not all that interesting to me. Must be just right for people who actually fit whatever the sweet spot for Fetlifers is.
But when you think about it, it is similar when one goes to any new group. This is NOT, however, how it goes when DWCer get together. Almost always is very inviting atmosphere.
I wonder if part of the issue is Fetlife might draw a more varied set of people, with a wider range of practices and motivations? DD is, at least as I see it, a much more tightly-bounded kind of relationship that BDSM, the latter covering a lot of ground and also having a very different and varied set of motivations? I'm not saying DD is not complicated (it clearly is, particularly in terms of why we gravitate to it), but there seems to be a smaller set of core practices and less of an erotic component (though it's plainly still part of it). If I'm right about that, the more varied the group the less likely you'll have a strong personal connection with any particular member of it.
DeleteEven within the context of this blog, I've been hosting it for over three years, and yet I can count on both hands the number of people I feel like I have closer personal connection with, and on one hand the number that I have exchanged any off-line communications with, or at least more than one or two stray emails. Those connections require a combination of common interests, similar life philosophies in key areas, and a mutual openness to the communication process itself.
Just speaking for myself, I have always experienced a different vibe at B&D and S&M events. We checked out several of them during our early years thinking that we might find DWC types among them. That never happened.
DeleteAs I have said before, most seemed like nice people. But in general not very communicative. If I try to put the energy into words, and I mean to do so respectfully, it had an isolated, desperate, quality to it - for most of the people in the venues.
I repeat. I am NOT insulting or judging or anything like that. Just sharing my experiences.
Its hard for me to say as I haven't attended gatherings of people in either community, but I can see the groups being very different. DD is not a subset of BDSM. The motivations and goals are very different, and I;m sure that would driver very different participation in such gatherings.
DeleteDAN
ReplyDeleteNot sure my comment go through let me know . Its sort of funny
Peter
Hey Peter, nope, didn't get any other comment from you. Also just checked the spam box. Nothing in there either.
DeleteDan
ReplyDeleteLong before Anna came into my life, I was a rather naive college student who ended up in a relationship with an older woman. ( I was 20, she was perhaps 35 ) Long story short she insisted I get a tattoo to
show my commitment as her submissive. Well on my left buttock I have an O. It is about an inch in diameter. When I first met Anna I told her it was a fraternity prank. Now of course she refers to it as
her target. I never thought much about it and no one in the locker room etc ever mentioned it. Then about
3 years ago I was a visitor at a friends health club in NYC. In the shower there was a man who came over
and asked me if I would like to go for a drink. I stared at him a moment and he pointed to my tattoo. I blushed said thank you and quickly left the gym. Anna loves this story!
Absolutely hilarious!
DeleteI'm pretty sure my wife would feel threatened by the prospect of contact with another female, even a wife in a committed marriage. I can only see her going for it if the wife was a generation older, but even then her imagination might race ahead to the possibility of a future meeting. I suppose her thinking might be along the lines of, "Am I not enough for my husband, that he wants to include others?"
ReplyDeleteThe only way I could see it working would be if a strong friendship developed naturally and then she discovered that her friend already practised DD. Dream on!
What if the contact was purely between your wife and other woman? That is really the primary scenario my "mentoring" question contemplates -- either one DD wife mentoring another DD wife, or them mutually supporting each other. There very well could be no contact between their husbands.
DeleteI think that my wife would say that she has it all under control (she does btw!) and doesn't need mentoring. Whether she'd contemplate mentoring another, I really can't say. I've never been able to get her interested in anything on the internet to do with DD, which would be the first step. Several of our friends know that she wears the trousers, but I've yet to hear anyone express an interest to know more.
DeleteI would love to meet other men in similar relationships. I have so many questions. There seems to be so many stories about mother or sisters in law participating. It just seems like an erotic kink. Why not brother or father in law? I have a male lover my wife knows about and encourages but I would opt out of the disciplinary relationship with my wife if anyone else participated.
ReplyDeleteYes, it is remarkable that there aren't more brother and father--in-law stories, isn't it?
DeleteDan
ReplyDeleteLast year I met a woman at a PTA meeting. She and her husband, with their son, who was about the same age as one of our boys, began a friendship. Sadly the boys hated each other but we hit it off. This past summer we were at a pool party and as her husband was getting out of the pool, his swimsuit slipped down enough for me to catch a familiar type bruise on his left buttock.
It was one of those moments, she caught me seeing the bruise and in a flustered manner, began a wild tale about how her husband had taken a spill down a flight of cement stairs in the park. She was in a state and without giving it a thought, I said " What a shame, that happens to Peter a lot lately. We looked at each other and we both burst into laughter. Finally she smiled and asked me "Paddle or brush?"
At once she begged me not to even mention it to Peter. Her husband was one of those guys that Peter
describes as " A MANLY MAN ". Sort of guy that seemed to always have a football in hand.
We seldom discussed what we were doing but more time spent on how hard it was to find that balance
that women in a FLR has trying to maintain both sides of what is required. Sadly they were transferred
a month ago. We tweet and talk but miss her.
That is absolutely fascinating! I am totally on the fence about whether encounters like yours indicate there are a lot of couples out there who do this, or if sometimes it's just coincidence. I have personally never seen the slightest indication that any of our acquaintances engage in DD.
DeleteDan
ReplyDeleteThe above is me i didnt sign it.... dont you think that where you live, city or suburb etc accounts for a lot.In a city there is often more privacy and a more relaxed attitude to things in general.
anna
Could be, but I have lived and/or worked in both city and suburb and just haven't come across any indication of others doing this. But, maybe my city and suburbs and just extremely boring compared to where folks like you, KD, Merry and others live!
DeleteHi Dan,
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, there is considerable evidence that a lot of adult spanking is going on. I am thinking of the endless web sites, Tumblr’s, commercial enterprises selling spanking products and last but not least general surveys indicating up to 20 percent of the population have some interest in spanking. I think there are many sociological reasons interest in spanking has grown but will not go into them now. Having said this the large majority of interest and probably actual spanking is traditional M/F and mainly erotic and not real domestic discipline. So we are part of a large community but those of us who practice or seek F/m domestic discipline are doubtless a minority of that community. But with this the case, there are still enough practicing F/M couples that the odds favor having at least one or two " sightings" if you are looking for them ( the overhead spanking in a hotel, a quick view at the gym of a recent spanked bottom, , the confession of a close friend, credible information from a third party or just dumb luck)This kind of serendipitous occurrence has been my experience and apparently many others ( Anna's incident is an example) Yet you who is obviously an intelligent observant and " motivated" guy has no encounters. Why? One reason could be just chance and chance over time always evens out so maybe a year from now you will be regaling us with stories of unintended "outings". But another reason could be you (unconsciously) guard against it, guard against revealing yourself and consequently missing evidence of others. If you do this it could be you are in a high status occupation where really being outed would carry harsh social and financial penalties. (We are still living in repressed times)I speculate about this because I went through something like it only becoming more open as I got older and entered quasi retirement. The reality is the cost of being outed goes down dramatically as one gets older. I am still not at the place where I am ready to go outside and tell the first person I meet that my wife just spanked me but at the same time I fell very open to let it all come out naturally in a supportive setting. I feel pretty strongly that we should reach out to each other without being crazy or reckless about it. That is the only way wife led domestic discipline will gain the acceptance and respect it deserves as a valid life style choice.
Alan
Alan, I don't know what the basis is for the assertion that "there are still enough practicing F/M couples that the odds favor having at least one or two " sightings" if you are looking for them ( the overhead spanking in a hotel, a quick view at the gym of a recent spanked bottom, , the confession of a close friend, credible information from a third party or just dumb luck)." Other than pure speculation, what is the basis for the assertion that there is some large enough number of people (a) in F/m relationships; (b) that involve spankings hard enough to leave visible marks or who talk about it loudly in public, such that among the hundreds or thousands of random people I encounter every year, I would notice it if I was really looking and/or was not repressing what is there to be seen. With all due respect, that seems to be a pretty convoluted psychological theory, i.e. that I am so unconsciously threatened by the career ramifications of a subject that I blog about every week, exchange emails with people about, etc. that my mind affirmatively represses sights and sounds verifying the plethora of DD practitioners out there who are either open enough or careless enough to provide me with such sightings. I don't think that stands up very well to scrutiny.
DeleteEspecially in light of what little evidence I do have about how many people there are who who are actively practicing DD and even the least bit "out" about it. This blog has had about 1.2 million visitors since I started it. I left a poll up for an entire year asking those visitors to identify their DD status. It is still posted above. Only 1298 people responded, and of those a pretty large percentage said they are not actually in DD. That is a tiny, tiny number of self-identified DD practitioners. And, I'm not sure you can overcome that by pointing to the number of F/m oriented Tumblrs out there, because most of theme are recycling the same content over and over, and I have no way of knowing how much of their readership is basically the same small-ish group of people jumping from one such Tumblr to the next.
As KD knows, I am not a big fan of Occam's razor. But, if the options are (a) a guy who writes a DD blog and should be, if anything, hyper-sensitive to DD sightings represses them unconsciously; or (b) there are not really all that many people who are getting disciplinary spankings and those who are guard it closely enough to prevent most random sightings, I have to go with option (b).
Dan
DeleteI think the figures you showed is a demo of how many men are interested but fear either exposing their needs or admitting to themselves they want this. I also think women are
more likely to seek out info and never speak up here. It is why I feel its my duty to speak
up.I will set off my soapbox now ....
anna
No worries about the soapbox Likely true on the stats, and on women being more reluctant to speak up. Which is too bad, because the more they participate the more the men will get the confidence to come out.
DeleteDan
ReplyDeleteAs you point out my comments are mainly speculative given the lack of " hard" data on spanking. The various polls done or attempted including the one you cite on your own site are not scientific and suffer from one or more serious biases particularly self selection. Nevertheless there is plentiful and increasing anecdotal evidence ( some of which I noted in my comments) that interest in adult spanking is growing or at least more openly discussed. Scholarly interest ( including at least one dissertation I know of) some serious print articles on spanking , a best selling novel as well as it's sequels, and of course the enormous internet interest reflected in blogs, tumblr's, individual web sites and commercial activity. All of this can't be attributed to a " small-ish group". These data provide more than enough information to allow reasonable speculation ( and to repeat, that is what I am doing) Even given all this I absolutely don't know how much F/M spanking is going on but my personal experiences plus correspondence I have carried on with F/M practitioners tell me there is at least some, quite possibly more across the pond than in the US ( the UK, France, Germany etc after all have been talking and writing about spanking longer that we have.In fact your own blog over the past ( almost) four years has been slowing revealing the contours of that community) Finally my biggest point is that we will never move beyond this vacuum of ambiguity unless we begin to talk to each other, exchange experiences where possible and even dip a toe into the pool ( however large it is) at least once in a while
Alan
Sorry, not sure when you tried to post this Alan, but it somehow ended up in the spam box. Just found it this morning.
DeleteI don't know what lessons to draw from the 50 Shades phenomenon. Yes, it make me think there might be a larger kinkier community than I thought, but at bottom it has a disturbingly anti-kink message. The lead character's kinky interests are attributed to abuse as a child, and the heroine's primary role is to "save him" by getting him to to accept his kink as dysfunctional. The movie version, of course, ends with her getting spanked for the first time and running from the room in tears. The kinkier the character in it the more it is suggested the kinkiness is warped and wrong. Also, it is very much an F/m-oriented work, and I have no idea whether a M/f themed book of similar quality (I bite my tongue to prevent choking on my words in juxtaposing "quality" and the 50 Shades books) would succeed. A friend of mine had an interesting theory about the success of that series. She believes the fetish it appeals to is not S&M, but wealth, and that it's really just a kinkier spin on the Cinderella story of regular young woman rescued from her plain Jane life by obscenely rich dude.
Fear is the enemy of growth and progress.
ReplyDeleteThe "risks and dangers" of reaching out and meeting other Disciplinary Wives couples is practically non-existent; except in one's imagination. I have never heard of a single example of anyone's career being affected or anything else negative due to a DWC type couple "outing" another couple.
Who knows? There may be an isolated example out there I have not heard about. But we take far, far more serious risks every time we drive our cars.
Just saying :)
I agree fear is the enemy of growth and progress, but as for whether the risk is non-existent, run a Google search some time on "teacher fired for moral turpitude" and see the sort of innocuous behavior that can get someone fired even in this day and age.
DeleteYes that's true. But still it's the extremely rare anecdotes you are finding.
DeleteSo I'll modify "non-existent" to "extremely rare". I just hate to think of so many people missing out on the richness of meeting other like-minded souls. Oh well, I'm done with it :)
We may have to agree to disagree on this one, on a couple of levels. First, I am not sure that acts of discrimination or other real career impact, particularly for the Disciplined Husbands. There are lots of careers where being tough, strong and competitive (trial lawyers, some sales folks, military, etc.) is part of the dynamic, and I'm not at all sure that submitting to a woman's discipline would not be seen as a major negative for men in those professions. Second, Kay observed that part of the attraction to getting together with other DWC couples was the shared kinky secret. If DD and FLR were to become more mainstream, I think some of that kinky secret aspect would inevitably be diminished. Now, whether the trade-off would be worth it, I don't pretend to know.
DeleteRelated to the current discussion, I wonder what one would find if one were to poll cleaning ladies in motels and hotels, asking them whether, on the job, they have ever overheard spankings occurring. When my wife and I travel alone, it is not uncommon for my wife to spank me in our motel room. I think it likely that it has been overheard occasionally in the hall, or from the sidewalk, outside our room. My guess is that many of these ladies have overheard stray spanking sounds, maybe are use to it, and might not even give it a second thought. There might even be some clear evidence as to who is spanking whom. Such and investigation should shed some light on the frequency of adult spanking. Doug
ReplyDeleteHi Doug. I agree that it could shed light on spanking, but I'm not as sure about spanking for real DD purposes. If the discussions over the last couple of weeks have illustrated much, it is that DD spankings aren't the same as "funishment" or S&M play. When we have been in hotels, it has actually been hard to find anything that can really serve as an implement for a real DD spanking.
DeleteAs a bellman at one of NYC's finest hotels, I can tell you I have overheard or been asked to go to a sex toy shop to purchase toys, paddles, etc. One very prominent Washington D.C. politico sent me to purchase a riding crop. The guest in his suite was a woman I knew was a professional who specialized in discipline.
ReplyDeleteTrust me it is more common than most realilze.
A fan of your blog
Sent out to buy sex toys?? That is hilarious. It would never have occurred to me that even the best hotels came with such perks.
DeleteDan
DeleteTrust me that is mild tale next to many things we encounter!