The truth will set you free, but first it will make you miserable. - James A. Garfield
Hello all. Welcome back to the Disciplinary Couples Club. Our weekly meeting of men and women who are in, or interested in being in, Domestic Discipline and Female Led (FLR) relationships.
Once again, before we get started, I would like to thank the female commenters who have recently joined us and to extend an invitation to all others who may be inclined to move from “lurker” to “commenter” status. We like having you around.
Well, now with the most boring large-scale holiday of the year (Thanksgiving) out of the way, I can finally start posting Christmas pictures!
There is such a dichotomy between those two holidays in terms of the amount of kinky, sexy, and DD-oriented artwork out there. My biggest challenge at Christmas time is choosing among an extensive and growing collection of artworks. Yet, some are so perfectly suited to the season, I find myself coming back to them over and over.
This year, I’m particularly fascinated by Krampus-themed stories and art. Before last Christmas season, I don’t think I’d ever even heard of Krampus. Now, I’m seeing more and more cultural references with Krampus themes. I’m not sure whether it’s a good or bad thing that people seem to be exploring some darker stuff these days, but I personally love it. Maybe it’s because I’m such a Halloween fan, and Krampus feels like a bit of Halloween’s naughty darkness imported into my other favorite Holiday.
We did manage to get a jump on holiday decorating. My attitude has been better than usual (I love Christmas, yet putting up lights isn’t a favorite), though I did get a bit snippy when trying to do part of the job that Anne usually handles but can’t this year due to her ongoing medical recovery. It was fairly minor, but we’re getting to a point where I almost feel like something—whether large or small, serious or trivial—needs to register as a convenient excuse to get us back on track.
Anyway, thanks for participating in last week’s topic, which leveraged a comment from Aunt Kay’s husband about the DWC’s “confessional” group sessions. I knew it wouldn’t be some folks’ cup of tea, but we did still manage to generate some thoughtful discussion. I do still wonder how the Disciplinary Wives Club manage to generate a fairly substantial amount of club-like personal interaction, yet even among those here who are somewhat open to it, it seems like confidentiality concerns—and also a fair degree of aversion to anything regarding participation by others—outweigh whatever level of desire there is for more “community.”
I suspect some of the difference is attributable to the respective generations involved. Aunt Kay’s husband is now over 80, and I assume his age is reflective of that of many of the other original DWC participants. So, I assume most of them came of age in the late 60s and early 70s, which to my lasting chagrin turned out to be the high point of sexual and transgressive cultural experimentation. I was born a decade too late . . .
A couple of weeks ago, Alan posted an inquiry that is similar to, maybe a slightly different angle on, some our discussions about origins and how we each came to be in this lifestyle:
“Wondering …and a question. Miss E alluded to the Thanksgiving spanking her husband received. I will call it his “epiphany” spanking, using epiphany to mean the experience of a sudden intuitive grasp of the essence of something. This seems to be the moment he marks as seminal in his journey toward DD and spanking.
Much of the prevailing thinking about the roots of a spanking fetish and the lifelong impact of spanking points to this happening to most spankos. That is, something—a book, a person, an experience, or? “trigger” a pre-existing (predisposition) to spanking or being spanked.
What precisely produces the pre-disposition is unknown. It is probably some combination of genetics, hormones, gender, and environment. The predisposition itself probably exists in far more people than there are actual spankos, the difference being the “trigger” experience. Dan has mentioned his trigger experience, discovering the DWC. As I recollect, one or two other posters have also described such. But most seem to relate spanking interest to an early time that is not well recalled.
So, my question to anyone who can answer is: What do you remember about your evolving interest in spanking, and most particularly, what triggered the need to be spanked? Does anyone have an experience like Miss E’s husband or a late experience like Dan's? What was your epiphany?
It seems clear that Alan is right that, for most of our commenters, the spanking interest came very early and may not be tightly linked to a particular event.
I seem to be a very rare exception in terms of that early interest. I really don’t recall ever having any interest at all in spanking until I was well into my 30s.
However, while it was very compressed, there was a bit of evolution before I found the DWC.
A few months earlier, I had seen an episode of an HBO series called Real Sex, which included a segment on adult erotic spanking.
I don’t really think of it as an “epiphany” in and of itself. It did catch my interest, but that was a fairly horny period for me, and coming from a fairly inexperienced and vanilla background, lots of things caught my attention in that period.
It did interest me enough, however, that we experimented with F/m erotic spanking for a very short period. I think for both of us it was one of those things that was fun to try, but we both lost interest after a few few times. Moreover, Anne was concerned that in play-acting fake punishments for some real offenses, she was reinforcing behavior that was genuinely pissing her off.
But, the real purpose it served was fostering an interest in spanking that was at least sufficient to lead me to search out on-line material regarding it, in addition to other kinks. In the course of that looking, I came across the DWC, though I still don’t remember exactly how.
That definitely was an epiphany, though it’s honestly taken me 10+ years to process the “why” of it all, and I’m sure I still haven’t fully appreciated why it hit me so hard given my lack of experience with adult spanking in general and complete lack of interest at any earlier stage.
I suspect the DWC epiphany hit me so hard in part because it was so unexpected. As I said, at that stage I wasn’t very experienced kink-wise (not that I am today either) but I was interested in (reading about, viewing, etc.) all sorts of unconventional kinks. But, nothing had been remotely close to the reaction I had to the DWC.
Today, I think the reason the DWC hit me so hard while other spanking-related kink exposure did not is that the DWC prominently featured ingredients that were missing in whatever else I’d seen to that point: harsh, reality-based disciplinary consequences, delivered in a close, loving personal relationship, by someone with authority.
I also now appreciate how much a “maternal” vibe plays into my attraction, but I’m not sure whether that was a part of the initial reaction or something that evolved over time.
If you’ve had the kind of “epiphany” experience Alan talks about, please tell us all about it.
Also, let’s expand it a bit to cover not just the “need to be spanked” but, to get the wives involved, any epiphanies related to a desire to give spankings or take FLR-like control.
Was there a moment where you realized that your husband’s desire to be spanked had morphed into a strong desire on your part to do the spanking? Or, did you have an interested that pre-existed or arose independently of any desire your husband had?
Enjoy the season.
My interest in spanking started in my early childhood. I think I was about 6-7 years old when I witnessed our neighbor girl getting spanked by her mother with a birch. There was something special about that and the red stripes that were left on her butt and legs. I remember that after that time, almost every time we played family or home with other children, I wanted a birch to be there too :D For some reason, I wanted to experience something like that too. A few years later, I witnessed my friend getting spanked by his mother a couple of times and I remember feeling some kind of excitement about it, although at the same time I was also afraid that I might get spanked too. From that moment I kind of started dreaming about it. Since all this happened in the 80s and there was no internet yet, for a long time I couldn't think anything about this weirdness. The fact was that it never went away and only got more intense over time until I finally managed to experience it as an adult. Today, it's part of my marriage and I can't imagine it any other way.
ReplyDeleteI do think it's an open question whether the lack of internet in the 80s and most of the 90s discouraged or encouraged actually practicing kink, as opposed to reading about it. No question that things like early messaging boards gave interested people more access to spanking-related stories and that the internet undoubtedly exposed people to more spanking-related materials. Yet, I really wonder whether that led to more people *practicing* alternative lifestyles. Or, was there some sweet spot that something like the DWC occupied, that provided more inspiration and opportunity for real-life encounters, but didn't end up being a *substitute* for real-life encounters. If you can't tell, I really am fascinated by the fact that in the 70s and early 80s there was this explosion in real experimentation and transgressing cultural norms, yet after the internet came along and offered an explosion of information about and visual depictions of alternative lifestyles, we've drifted into what seems to be either sexual prudery, or maybe sexual apathy, in Gen Z.
DeleteThe Internet opened it up. I went to a number of local groups from time to time during the later nineties. I think I found them on the early web but I met people there whose interest pre -dated the web and learned about how it had been. Seems it was much more structured before the web was around. Certainly in the D/s world, there was a path to be followed, always starting as a sub regardless of which side of the fence one ended up on. So I think that pre-Internet the kink community was much smaller and less accessible, but the people were more knowledgeable and took it more seriously. TG
DeleteDan wrote: “There was this explosion in real experimentation and transgressing cultural norms, yet after the internet came along and offered an explosion of information about and visual depictions of alternative lifestyles, we've drifted into what seems to be either sexual prudery or maybe sexual apathy, in Gen Z.”
DeleteDan,
I would be interested in why, in your view, this “drift” occurred. To me, we seem to be living in an era of norm-busting, albeit not that of the 60s and 70s, but substantial --- and gender roles are among the norm-busting. In the late 70’s, I had not yet met a woman who spanked men –or, for that matter, was even very comfortable talking about spanking. Much of it went on, to be sure, but in private and in secret. Today, one can find spanking articles in mainstream media.
Now that the information about adult spanking is so widespread, I suspect more women will begin to suggest F/M relationships (given the enormous potential benefits of F/M, why would they not? And any woman today interested in relationship spanking has a vast amount of material available to her. That didn’t exist even 20 years ago. Your blog alone is a virtual handbook about making F/M work in relationships. )
Alan
"Now that the information about adult spanking is so widespread, I suspect more women will begin to suggest F/M relationships (given the enormous potential benefits of F/M, why would they not?..." I don't know if this will happen or not, but it certainly doesn't seem impossible, especially since it happens at exactly the same time that traditional gender roles - which certainly were an obstacle to F/M DD or FLR before - have been weakened greatly, younger women have become very much empowered, and younger men have (as a whole) become significantly less masculine.
Delete-ZM
Alan, I think my answers will be depressingly conventional. Obviously, the AIDS epidemic in the late 80s derailed a lot of the sexual experimentation of the 1970s. Suddenly, sex went from fun to dangerous. Particularly at the beginning, the transmission mechanisms weren't well understood, so suddenly *all* sex was concerning. While that probably doesn't account for what we see 40 years later, I do think it changed the trajectory where attitudes about sex were concerned.
DeleteFor this generation, I do think that the internet and social media play a big role and have created a situation where many seem to be scared shitless of any real, face-to-face intimate contact. They are just more comfortable getting their sexual thrills vicariously through Pornhub or, for the spankos, things like Spankingtube. While those platforms have given people much easier access to sexual material, I think they also have have become "safe space" substitutes for actual physical contact.
ZM and Alan, I'm less optimistic than you guys that FM-DD will expand because young women are more confident and/or males less masculine. You've got this odd blend among young males, with the hyper-(faux)-alphas following Andrew Tate and his ilk, and the incels who sit in their basements and whine about women, and the "soft boys" . . ., etc. Maybe especially for confident women, are they seeing any of that as remotely attractive? If anything, I wonder whether the trend is toward a milder version of the South Korean "Four Nos" movement, where women just swear off sex and marriage because, from their perspective, what's the point?
Though, hopefully, I'm being way too pessimistic. I'm sure that, despite the media attention on the extremes, there is plenty of sex happening among today's youth. If you haven't seen it, btw, I highly, highly recommend Sex Education on Netflix. Probably the funniest, sex-positive show in recent memories, and it all centers on high school kids in England. One of my top five shows of the last 10 years for sure.
I’ve recounted this before but I guess for me there were three elements. First, I’d always had an interest in spanking since my teens. This was a kink thing and I was equally happy on either side of the paddle. I actually met my now-wife on an early spanking website before meeting people online was a thing (1999). Secondly, like apparently so many others, we (I think it was she) found the DWC website which seemed interesting. But thirdly, the final catalyst was when I complained about something unreasonably, that really upset her and that I immediately regretted - out of character for me. I don’t remember which of us suggested a real DWC punishment as the way to get past it, but we agreed on it, the severity was at a totally different level than anything I’d felt before, this was in November of 2000, it washed away my guilt, worked off her anger and we’ve never looked back. TG
ReplyDeleteGiven that your wife found the DWC website and may have been the one to suggest emulating, if one of you had an "epiphany" it may have been her.
DeleteCould be
DeleteAs have explained previously I have had a spanking itch since my teens but that was in M/F. It took me till my early 50's to go F/M. I suspect that without the UK female Disciplinarians market and this blog my knowledge of what is possible would be lesser than it presently is. Have considered seeing a Psychosexual therapist about the periods of obsession that can happen but given they don't come cheap I stick to paying out to enjoy my interest rather than have it over-analysed. Cheers GLM
ReplyDeleteMy interest began very early in life, when I was spanked by a female teacher in 1st grade. My parents were pretty much not present or involved with us kids, so to have a woman give me boundaries was shocking and embarrassing, but there was a very exciting element to it that stayed with me for life. For most of my childhood it was unknown to me that there were others who found spanking exciting and wanted it. In my late teens, I discovered some "adult" spanking mags, which depicted some 50s disciplinary wives spanking their husbands. It wasn't until much later when Penthouse started publishing letters, some of which included adult, consensual, spanking, that I became aware that there were probably other people out there like me. Like so many others, the DWC came along and completely grabbed my attention like nothing else. I had many relationships with various women, but very few were even aware of F/M spanking, let alone willing to do it. Most of my life I was constantly pushing boundaries and taking risks, especially with large motorcycles. I did eventually find women to spank me, but what I really craved was a caring, but strict, DD relationship. When I finally got one, I reduced my alcohol consumption by half, sold the motorcycles, and stopped taking unnecessary risks. I feel there is no question that had I been in a true DD relationship earlier, my life would have been more stable, and I would have been a much better husband. That said, better late than never. This blog has been extremely helpful in normalizing DD, by giving us ideas and encouragement.
ReplyDeleteNorton, see my longer comment to ZM below. I do recall reading spanking stories in Penthouse and other publications, but I don't recall having any strong reaction to them. The DWC did, as you say, grab my attention like nothing else.
DeleteAs far as I can remember, I had a morbid fascination with spanking since I was a child. Probably this was true of all spankings, but what I remember are school spankings. I was always very interested in hearing the details of friends sent to the principal's office, and there was a deep fear I had of facing that myself someday - which never happened. While I remember all this in retrospect, at the time I don't think I would have considered it a spanking interest, and certainly not in any kinky way since I was still pretty clueless about all things sexual.
ReplyDeleteMy huge moment was when reading letters to Penthouse, I stumbled across one about a guy who was spanked at a party by his dominant girlfriend. This was the first time I had ever heard of or thought about spanking in a sexual context, and I was immediately hooked. There have probably not been 3 consecutive days in the following 40+ years that I didn't think about spanking or something involving power exchange.
The next 20 years were me thinking I had a spanking and femdom fetish, but I was never enthralled by the whole "whips and chains" thing. It was when I discovered the DWC that everything kind of clicked, and I realized that I was only into the whole wife-led, domestic dynamic. Naturally, I tried to get my wife to spank me for years and years, but that was ultimately just an exercise in frustration for both of us and helped to drive a wedge between us.
About 9 years ago, I met my current wife. We hit it off from the beginning in every way, so I didn't wait long after we began dating to tell her about my DD thoughts. I think I framed it pretty well from the beginning, but still it just began as a game to her, and honestly it probably was to me as well at that time. She took to it all quickly and soon learned to spank very hard. For the first time in my life, I was getting the hard spankings that I had always dreamed about, but interestingly, getting spanked like this helped me to realize that what really affected me was the exercise of authority, more so than the spanking itself. I am still probably somewhat of a spanko, but ultimately spanking takes a backseat to exercised authority at least for me.
As our relationship matures and grows, I have learned that while her exercising her authority (usually by spanking) is a huge rush for both of us, that is naturally something that only happens a small percentage of our time together. So over time we are gravitating more towards her having a bit more real authority in more day to day things and with her enforcing that as necessary with spankings and other punishments. This translates to less focus on the physical spankings over time, and more focus on the relationship dynamics, with the caveat that spankings, other punishments, and credible threats of punishment are still very important to our overall exercised female authority dynamic.
-ZM
DeleteI totally get the change of focus from spankings per se to a greater emphasis on the authority element, which is then enforced through spanking. Honestly, looking back, I think that was always the ordering of things that appealed to me about the DWC, but I didn't quite understand that at first.
Both you and Norton referenced Penthouse articles. Those articles are one reason I'm fairly sure that I didn't have any fascination with spanking until the DWC. I was a huge fan of the letters in Penthouse and in its Variations publication. I read them constantly. But, I don't recall any of them causing any kind of out-sized reaction.
Now, I do recall that sometime around the time I discovered the DWC, I read a story in something like Variations that involved a M/m discipline session. The details are a little fuzzy now, but it involved a dominant male who was in a D/s sort of relationship with a couple. The (beta) husband had done something the dominant male and the wife agreed should be punished, but the wife kept blowing off phone calls to schedule it. So, the dominant male interrupts a dinner party the couple was hosting. The wife is furious at the interruption, and the husband is mortified, but the dominant male let's them both know that he will make a scene if the husband does not accompany him to a horse barn on the couple’s party. The husband very reluctantly accepts the reality of what is about to happen. The wife tells the guests that the dominant was dropping by to check out something down at the barn, and the husband would show it to him and be back in a few minutes. The husband accompanies to the dominant to the barn, where he is made to take down his pants and bend over a saddle (or hay bale - I forget which). The dominant takes off a thick leather belt and whips the husband to tears before letting him go back to the party.
That story is one of the first in the spanking genre that I recall having a very strong reaction to. I think the fact that I reacted to it at least as strongly as I did to some of the DWC stories indicates that, for me, a big part of my DD need is rooted in wanting to have my will overcome such that I am held to account even when I don't want to go along with it, and the need is not really specific as to the gender of the disciplinarian, as long as it's not part of a kinky game.
There were some great spanking stories in Penthouse Variations , mostly MF but a few FM.
DeleteReally well written and illustrated.
I used to leave it around my apartment and my then girlfriend ( now wife) read it voraciously as I did.
In fact she read gave me a memorable spanking that I recognized she was re-enacting directly from one of the FM stories she had read which kind of ignited the spanking activity for both of us.
Yes, I am convinced that I was Penthouse's most regular reader of Variations. It started by me reading Penthouse (for the political articles, hahaha), and then I started to pay attention to the Letters section, so soon I was buying Penthouse Letters, and then I started to focus on the kinkier letters, so soon I mostly cared about Penthouse Variations.
Delete"...a big part of my DD need is rooted in wanting to have my will overcome such that I am held to account even when I don't want to go along with it, and the need is not really specific as to the gender of the disciplinarian, as long as it's not part of a kinky game." - Same, though I tend to always gravitate towards female disciplinarians, but in the end it is more the loss of control - or as you put it "to have my will overcome" - than anything else, so I focus more heavily on the situation than the disciplinarian.
-ZM
Glen and ZM, there was a period where I too had a pretty extensive Variations collection, along with a subscription that kept it growing. Anne read them as well though, interestingly, I don't think we ever really talked about what kinds of stories turned us on.
DeleteMy interest started very young as well. We grew up with no nonsense strict discipline at home, school, and church. I received, witnessed, overheard, observed bare bottom spankings all my life. I remember a girl getting the yardstick my her Mother/Teacher in a closet when I was about 8. I wasn’t suppose to be in the room. I saw the girl pull her underwear up and skirt down balling. I observed my best friend and his sisters getting spanked multiple times. I walked by one of the rooms as his sister was getting spanked on her underwear. I was strapped and paddled at home probably every two weeks at home. I received the paddle at school about a half dozen times a year for missed assignments or fighting. I observed many church spankings in the “quiet room”. My last bare bottom spanking was at 12 or 13 for stealing. I took the paddling of a lifetime. My first teenage spanking was when I was fifteen or sixteen. It was with a girl I was “dating” at the church. She had been spanked growing up as well. We were fooling around and I asked her to give me a strapping bare bottom. She was enthusiastic and spanked long and hard. I was squirming through it. I remember it like yesterday. The internet opened my eyes as well to what was possible. I remember looking at pics online and reading stories. Obviously, the DWC was an eye opener. I saw my first professional disciplinarian at 25 years old. She was an extraordinary women. She was caring and actually listened to what you wanted, needed, and craved. I was sad to hear her passing. My first true love had no interest in spanking me. She gave me one strapping and it did nothing for her. After our relationship ended, I met my current wife and actually would send her text messages quoting some of the DWC lines. She is a bit older and would not put up with the crap I used to with my ex. We dabbled in erotic spanking at first and then proceeded to DD. Like all DD relationships, ours is strong at times and then runs cold. Life gets in the way, but she has definitely helped me change with some serious thrashings. I wish she was a bit more serious at times and stricter.
ReplyDeleteShe has grown into the roll but still wants me to lead in life. If something ever happened to her and I did date again, I would seek out someone like a few guys here. I would be upfront about my desire for this type of relationship. It is definitely intertwined in your being. I don’t think I could ever go without thinking about spanking. It’s been hard wired into my brain for a long time. I would assume that some of the kids I went to school and church with; would have to be hard wired the same way. I don’t have any relationships with them so who knows. The debate continues.
T
You and I seem to have both grown up in areas where spanking was so much a part of the background, that it's easy to identify lots of instances of seeing or overhearing it. but, where we seem to differ is that as I got older and was no longer in that environment all the time, years passed in which I had no exposure and no residual interest. For that reason, the events that led to me understanding that I wanted to be in a DD relationship seem very distinct to me.
DeleteIt seems like yours was a much more seamless transition, from being exposed to it on a regular basis, to the incident at 15 or 16 when you requested a spanking from a girl you were dating. Was there any specific time before that when you knew that you were actively interested in being spanked, as opposed just being around it all the time? I think that was what Alan was getting out when asking if people had "that moment" when they realized that they actually wanted spankings, when in the past they might have observed them, experienced them, and maybe even strongly wanted to avoid them.
It was probably the one I witnessed in the room. I shouldn’t have been there and enjoyed seeing what I observed. Part of me wanted to be in the closet with her getting thrashed. I think since that incident, I craved seeing it and to an extent getting it. Although at the time, they were no nonsense. While crying, I regretted ever thinking why? After the stealing incident, and I got humiliated with a bare bottom paddling, I toed the line. Then a family moved across the street. They were “jehovas” with three daughter and a son. The Mother was beyond strict. I was able to over hear and witness many strappings given to her kids. I would deliver papers and collect at night. I would peak in as she was spanking her daughter. She never closed her windows and everyone could hear the girls crying. I remember one day I mentioned to the Mother I was suspended. The Mother responded , good thing you weren’t my son, “I’d whip your bare ass till you couldn’t sit for a month”. I know I turned beet red. I was probably 15. I didn’t have the nerve but wanted to ask her to do it. She was a true disciplinarian. I found one of her daughters online. She is successful and appears to have a good life. I guess all the spankings helped lol.
DeleteT
Even though I didn't have an active spanking interest at the time, I did have enough of a thing for older women--including some teachers and friends' mothers---I'm sure that had one told me something like that mother told you, I too would have turned beet red and very likely been totally turned on by it. At the time, I didn't connect the thing for older women with anything related to authority. In fact, I'm not sure I even attributed it to age. I just knew I was attracted to some mothers and teachers. But, later it became more clear to me that I did have a thing to women who were substantially older than me, but it was a long time later--probably after I discovered DD--that I started realizing how much of that age interest was really about female authority. Though, some of it, to this day, is rooted in age. I am usually far more into a picture of an attractive woman in her 50s than one in her 20s.
DeleteI like you have always been attracted to older women. My wife is older than I am. I found her to be so attractive when I met her. I agree that I would rather look at a 50 year old much more than a 20 year old. For me, older women exude confidence and sex appeal. They know how to carry themselves and have put up with enough crap from their ex’s. My wife had a miserable relationship and couldn’t believe how respectful I was. Her confidence built and I reiterated to her to not put up with my crap. She eventually held me accountable for my actions with a good thrashing. It changed my tune and I thank her for it to this day. I also had a massive crush on my sixth grade teacher. She had long auburn hair and wore sundresses to school. Amazing how I cannot remember last year, but I remember her. Lastly, I always said if I run into that neighbor, I would ask for that thrashing. She still lives in state but would probably be in her 70’s now.
DeleteT
Although I was (and am) attracted to older women, I married one who was a few years younger than me, though at the ages we were when we met, it was a bigger separation than it is now. I had a massive crush on a teacher in high school. Drop dead gorgeous. She was also the mom of one of my best friends. And, she drank a lot of wine. So, I'd go to their house and hang out after school, chatting with the teacher I had the hots for, as she sipped wine and looked at me over her wine glass.
DeleteDan,
DeleteThat had to be memorizing. Watching her drink wine with thoughts racing through your head. I always found my friends Mom attractive as well. I did get spanked one time by her with a spoon. We both did. It wasn’t anything long or memorable. It was probably a dozen while she held my arm. I apologized profusely, but actually wished it had went on longer. My attraction to older women has to come from the strong personality of women I observed growing up. You definitely don’t see that in the young women today. There are few and far between from my observations.
T
It was definitely distracting. She was, objectively, one of the hottest women in town and by far the most attractive teacher. I felt a little sorry for my friend. He was constantly getting in fights because guys at school would come up and razz him about how much the wanted to fuck his mother. She also tended to get loose-lipped after a few of those glasses of wine, in a way that sent the sex appeal through the roof. We were talking about college choices one day, after she's had more than one glass, and she advised tipsily: "You stress too much. Some day you're going to learn that all you need to be happy in life is a good bottle of wine and good sex every night." I was 17 or 18 at the time, and will remember that conversation for the rest of my life, even if I did a lousy job of applying her advice.
DeleteYeah, I have seen very, very few women with real self-confidence in their 20s and often into their 30s. (Of course, the same can be said about men.) There were only one or two in my old office, including one who was young but had a very domme-like vibe, which came out even more prominently around her husband. I've always suspect they might have some kind of DD or D/s thing going on. But, in a very large organization, she was about the only one with any real confidence at that age.
Dan wrote-“But, in a very large organization, she was about the only one with any real confidence at that age.”
DeleteMaybe the confidence, in part, came from being, in fact, in some female-led relationship with her husband. Many testimonies out there from women purporting to be in female-led DD relationships do emphasize the role of self-confidence both in taking on DD and stemming from successful DD relationships. In this still very patriarchal society, men obeying their partners and accepting discipline from them for real issues must be a huge rush to many women.
Agree fully about female-led DD boosting the self-confidence of the women involved, especially if they really embrace it. I think it has really helped my wife to become more assertive. I am just incredibly proud of how much she has become a leader in our business. And she is from a patriarchal society that would be almost unimaginable to most Americans.
Delete-ZM
It's a virtuous circle for sure, but also kind of a chicken and the egg. They need to have enough self-confidence to take it on and be attracted to it in the first place, but if they can reach that point, it can reinforce and grow their initial confidence.
DeleteThe closest thing to a trigger I can think of is a conversation I had with my friends as adolescents. We discussed various things during that conversations, including our fantasies. Someone mentioned spanking and that got me thinking and I found myself looking into the subject for several years afterwards. The natural result of teenage male hormones, I suppose!
ReplyDeleteAt some point in very early adulthood, I came across a man who was in an F/M DD marriage. He gave me a summary of how things worked in his marriage and I was sold instantly. He died before I myself got married, so I was not able to report on the success of things, but anyway.
Not sure if this also counts as an epiphany, but I remember my wedding night. As planned, my wife gave me a very hard and memorable spanking (I suppose the first time is generally memorable). While we were having sex afterwards, I thought to myself that I had definitely made the right decision in pushing my then-new wife for an F/M DD marriage.
J.
It wasn't an epiphany at such a young age, but I remember visiting a friend around age 7, when his older cousin and her friend decided that the boys needed spankings. They each pulled us over their laps, but I was quickly able to escape. I knew about spanking all too well and wanted nothing to do with that. The odd thing was that it wasn't long before I wished that I had acquiesced to her desire to at least playfully punish me.
ReplyDeleteI continued to detest the spankings my mother gave me, but in the ensuing years I developed a keen interest when others were giving or receiving them. I remember hearing about a 7th grade girl whose parents still spanked her over the knee and a female teacher talking about the ones she had given when her kids were growing up. I was at an impressionable age and these rare glimpses fueled my fantasies as I hit puberty.
Although I was initially focused on girls being spanked, my interest began to include discipline being administered by older girls, female teachers, and even a few friends' moms.
It all felt very confusing at the time and fortunately I aged out of my own corporal punishment by the time these thoughts really blossomed. Even then, my mom was the disciplinarian in our house and she was the one who grounded me or imposed other such punishments. My parents separated and then divorced when I was a teenager and having a strict mom undoubtedly saved me from some bad outcomes.
My wife's upbringing bears no similarities to mine, but she understands why I encouraged her to discipline me. She knows that I can take a hard spanking and be a better person for it. I've noticed that lingering soreness that day and into the next is especially effective when it comes to making me regret my actions/ behavior. Beth understands that and makes sure that's exactly what I'll experience.
Kevin
Same here regarding the lingering soreness. Mine seems to have a three to four day cycle. Most spankings happen in the evening, so I feel some soreness while going to bed. The next day, I often don't feel a lot of residual soreness; some but not a lot. Then, on the second day, I start feeling a deeper, dull ache that may stay with me for another day or two. All that happens without a lot of marking, other than a gray tint to the skin.
DeleteI had an early spanking interest. I'm not sure if there was one strong trigger of the discipline idea. Some of the assertive girls I would've done anything for, if they'd asked. They were in my spanking fantasies by early teen years.
ReplyDeleteThere were definitely girls in my circle I would have done anything for but, unfortunately, none voiced anything like a spanking interest. And, honestly, I almost certainly would have been too clueless to pick up on it had they gone there. I was pretty oblivious in high school.
DeleteI was thinking today about how not only how my feelings towards spanking have changed over time, but also how much I have recognized only in retrospect. Here are some random thoughts.
ReplyDeleteAs a child I had a morbid fascination for school paddlings. But having said that, at the time I don't think I had any idea that I was much more fascinated with spankings than everyone else was, but it is easily seen in retrospect. And actually, this same pattern has followed throughout my whole experience; most of the time I haven't really known what I really wanted, and it really becomes evident as I looked back at what I used to want and what I used to think.
School spankings were a big thing for me because I mostly didn't want to get one. I was terrified of the thought. Now I really, really wish that it had happened at least once (so I would have less fascination with it). Of course, as I look at it from today's perspective, I realize that the paddling probably wasn't all that big of a deal, even if it really hurt and maybe even left bruises. What made school paddlings so terribly frightful - and what attracted me like fire attracts moths - was the humiliation aspect. Depending on the principal's office, depending on the reputation of the principal, meant that everyone in your class knew or at least assumed what was going to happen to you. And as you pointed out last week, having people know that you were spanked is one thing, but having them know that you are going to be spanked is something else entirely. And then when you came back, the other kids looked at your face to see if there were any signs of tears, and when you sat down, others were looking to see if you winced at all. And then of course there were the whispers on the bus and the playground. Even if they weren't talking about you, you thought they might have been. Note that all this is how I assume it felt, since I never had it happen, but all of this is what I really feared, much more than whacks with the paddle, and I am convinced that the experience was 90% of the punishment.
Of course, once I had my epiphany moment and "discovered" adult spanking, it quickly overshadowed everything, especially since spanking had clear ties to sexuality for me and it was exactly at the time that I was discovering sexuality.
Most of my "epiphany" moments have sprung from experience. As I mentioned in my earlier post, over time I have steadily moved from focusing on spanking to focusing on authority. Until I got hard spankings, I thought it was just spankings I wanted (like even for play). But then when I experienced hard spankings, I realized it was really punishment I wanted (spankings and other punishments for real things), and then after I started to get real punishments, I realized it was about the authority more than the punishment itself. In the beginning, I was put off by pictures with any bruising, but once I got real spankings, I realized that anything that was hard enough to be real punishment was probably going to leave more than a little redness. And then as spankings got harder and harder (and with more and more visible damage), I realized that what was really lacking was the emotional impact, which is what got me thinking more and more about witnesses, and so on.
Yet with all that has changed over time, what hasn't changed is my focus on "domestic;" from the beginning I always preferred people dressed normally and household and workplace themes as opposed to leather clad mistresses in dungeons or things like that.
-ZM
I'm always a little on the fence about whether I had some latent interest in spanking that I didn't recognize and instead attributed to a thing for older women (see my comment to T. above, but your fascination with school spankings illustrates why I really don't think I had any particular thing for spanking at that time. Like you, I never got spanked at school, but I did get sent to the principal's office multiple times, thinking I would be getting one. So, I experienced some of the embarrassment that you reference. But, that's what I recall -- being scared of what was going to happen and embarrassed about it. I don't recall any sort of fascination with it.
DeleteBut, that has changed over time, and I think it's something that changed, not something I discovered. I think about the movie Dead Poets Society (great movie, by the way). It has a scene with a very hard school paddling. It came out a few years after I graduated high school. I recall loving the movie, but I don't recall any particular fascination with the paddling scene, and while it does have a strong authority figure, it's not a female. Seeing it today, I have a much stronger reaction. It's again like something in the particular mix of elements in the DWC triggered either a new interest, or something latent that was exposed to lots of other spanking-related content (Variations, the Dead Poets Society, plenty of real overheard or known spankings growing up), and yet was never triggered.
ZM,
DeleteFor me the humiliation factor went away regarding school paddling. I think it’s because they became the norm. The kids would walk into the room and hold their fingers up indicating the number of swats they received. Most were flushed with tears. I began to despise a few teachers, who looking back, were miserable with their lives. I became defiant at times and refused to cry after a hard paddling. The paddling hurt like hell and I did have bruises but refused to show any emotion. At home though, that was a different story. I felt humiliated because Mom had to punish us and of course we didn’t want to disappoint her. Like Dan, to this day, I have always despised authority and go out of my way to avoid even some supervisors. I know I do a better job and there’s not much they can say.
T
I don't know for sure where I got my hatred of authority, but did have a couple of teachers in middle school who I came to despise because of their abuse of power (though no spanking involved). But, I think it was more growing up with a former Marine (and a couple of other colorful positions, one of which is a bit too revealing for me to disclose) who himself hated authority with a passion. I think I unconsciously modeled that attitude. The ironic thing is, if you asked him today, I think he would say that his lack of respect for authority caused him to step on his own dick. So, like father like son, even if it played out in very, very different careers and economic tranches.
DeleteWhen I talk of my "morbid fascination" I had for school spankings, that was totally rooted in fear during my early years; I was afraid it might happen to me. But then when I "discovered" adult spanking through the lens of a sexual context (thanks to Penthouse), my earlier fear of school spanking quickly morphed into wishing it would have happened to me, but by then I was living in a different city where it didn't seem to happen at least with any regularity.
DeleteT, thank you for your helpful description of what happened with school paddlings. I really couldn't remember whether students often cried or not. And of course, having never received one, I didn't know how much they really hurt (though I remember kids saying they did) and whether kids really had bruises or not. I don't remember anyone showing their bruises, but of course they would have been hidden by pants.
One thing I just remembered yesterday, as I have been reflecting on all this in the back of my mind, is that I did actually think about a male disciplinarian far in the past. I became good friends with one of my college roommates and got to know his parents pretty well. His dad was a big, tough guy who came across as very firm. He was a high school principal during the years I knew him, and there were occasional references to paddling kids at school. I had completely forgotten about this, but I do remember that I used to sometimes imagine him paddling me. Of course, I never had the guts to ask him to do it. Probably my bottom is still grateful for that.
And what you guys say about authority rings true for me as well. I have always been a rebel, which is particularly interesting since I have realized over time that much or all of my thing I have for spanking and other punishments is a want and need for imposed and exercised authority! Oh the paradoxes...
-ZM
ZM, it's interesting that I've been of the few on here (and now you) who says that my need for discipline isn't entirely gender-specific in terms of who delivers it. Yet, you are a step beyond me, in that while I am open to it as a thought experiment, I can't think of any real life male that I've ever wanted one from or thought that they might be someone I would theoretically want one from. It's always been at the very abstract level.
DeleteHi Dan,
DeleteI guess in a way I may be a step beyond, but maybe not.
It is worth keeping in mind that this thought was from many years ago, and I had even completely forgotten it. At the time, my discovery of spanking was relatively new, I had never gotten any real spanking as an adult, I could barely remember any childhood spankings, I could still remember well my fascination with school paddling, and I still thought I just wanted a spanking, not yet recognizing the need for accountability, authority, emotional impact, and so on. It makes sense that I thought about my friend's dad all those years ago because I was still so curious about what a real school paddling felt like, he was a high school principal, I knew he paddled kids, and he was just had a very commanding presence (ex military, very self assured, loud and outgoing, etc.).
But other than that, I really have gravitated almost entirely towards thinking about female spankers until very recently - and this is probably at least partly your fault, because you keep mentioning the possibility of a male spanker! And as I said, even now, when I think of any male involvement, it is usually with a cuckolding overtones, or maybe a guy punishing both my wife and I at once or something like that. And unlike having female witnesses or participants (which I really do want to happen), I am still pretty unsure about having any male involvement at any level.
-ZM
Got it. I can definitely see why, if you were already wired for a spanking interest, knowing a high school principal at that point in time could stir up a lot of feelings and curiosity. Your description of him sounds a lot like my step-father, though in his case it was almost *too* much alpha. At the time, it scared me more than attracted me. And, I think I always felt it was something I couldn't live up to. I've always thought that modeling him accounts for my anti-authoritarian streak, but I think it probably played out as feeling inadequate in comparison, which led to some over-compensation. Though, that sounds overly dark and depressing. As much as I do think the anti-authority thing capped my trajectory in my career, it's also true that I probably never would have gotten as far as I did, as early as I did, without it. And, I think I'm pretty quick speak up against things that are wrong or harmful to others, especially bullying behavior, and I'm not sure I would have that in me were it not for growing up with someone who just didn't give a fuck about consequences and confrontation.
DeleteMale involvement for me in terms of being spanked by a male or even having one witness me spanked is a nonstarter—the exception being a spanking witnessed by another male also under female authority. The latter, I imagine, could be a bonding experience and a positive experience.
DeleteIn my imagination (fantasy), I can also imagine being disciplined with another male in a DD relationship. In reality, these “co-spankings) scenarios may not work at all. What seems to hold all of them together is the commonality that wife(s) or girlfriend(s) control it all.
Also, coming from the experience of being spanked in the presence of my wife’s sister—someone witnessing you disciplined is a sort of social validation and makes it real as hell.
Alan
I think I understand what you mean by "social validation." It's kind of like some discussions we've had about the powerful effect of someone else not only knowing you have been or soon will be spanked, but them actually approving of it because they fully agree that you deserve it. It sort of reconfirms the reality you are in and your place in a recognized hierarchy.
DeleteI think the whole "makes it real as hell" is probably a huge part of what drives my obsession around witnesses. Even those who currently "know" my wife spanks me don't really know, since they have never seen it happen. But once someone sees it, it is pretty much undeniably real.
Delete-ZM
ZM, that's a good point. And it kind of explains why someone knowing that a particular spanking recently happened or is imminent feels so much more unnerving than them knowing about the DD relationship. It's not quite as "undeniably real" as a witness, but it's a move in that direction.
DeleteHello Dan. Dev here again. He thought it be better if I answered for him so I’ll try. He approached me about spanking him over thirty years ago. I remember him being very nervous. His ex wife wasn’t very supportive but I totally understood and was open. The first time was awkward but we got through it ok. The second time I spanked him on the couch with a newspaper. I know he enjoyed it. He had an “ accident “ on my lap. Then he regularly started to annoy me. I knew what he was up to and ignored it for months. Finally one day I had enough. I gabbed his arm and led him to the kitchen corner. I said if he was going to behave like a child I would treat him as such. I said stay here till I returned. He was becoming erect. I went to our bedroom and took out a paddle with holes in it that I got from Etsy recently. I returned to the kitchen and called him over. Now he is fully erect. He sees the paddle and backtracks. I pulled him over my knee and paddled him long and hard for several minutes. He quickly began screaming begging me to stop. I said ALL spankings from now on would be the same or worse depending on the situation. I continued for a few more minutes to be sure he totally understood. It’s the same paddle I use to this day. lol. Since then we have progressed and he is spanked when needed. It isn’t often as he may say. He does so many other things very well but upon occasion not so much. I totally understand his fetish and needs and will do all I can to help with it. It’s been 34 years. I have no idea how many spankings were given but even though I’m angry sometimes I always do it out of love. Merry Christmas. Dev
ReplyDeleteHi Dev. I can see what spanking with a newspaper might have led to an "accident" for someone with a spanking fetish. :-)
DeleteThat had to be a very rude awakening to go from spankings that were simply feeding the fetish to something much more real like a wooden paddle with holes. I do understand the erection though. Or, I should say, I understand that they do happen, even before a spanking that you know you really don't want, because I have experienced it many times, particularly in the early days. I still don't understand precisely why they happen in that circumstance; only that they do.
Merry Christmas to you, too!
For me it was not one epiphany but more of a series or sequence. Spanking where I grew up had always had a slightly naughty 'frisson' when mentioned in the mass circulation newspapers, comedic movies, children's books & comics and even when referred to in conversation. Corporal punishment was an everyday occurance in schools and most homes. I have always had that 'feeling' about spanking. That was crystalized as a sexual interest soon into puberty when I was very turned on by a TV cartoon spanking, after which I actively sought out books, TV and any references to the subject. hence 'Epiphany 1'. Early on it was a general interest in the subject as I explored all variations. I was still subject to corporal punishment at school and discovered early on the difference between the pleasurable fantasy and the painful reality.
ReplyDeleteI had no concept of adult spanking until the internet and many of my early web searches were finding forums, fictional and real accounts. Those searches were certainly an eyeopener for me. Epiphany 2.
Twenty years into a very good marriage we were fooling about one night and she started spanking me with a slipper, just for a very short time. Epiphany 3. I had never told her of my interest and I (naively) had no idea that I could incorporate this into our marriage but felt that I could not avoid it or miss the opportunity. And so I wrote my first 'journal' explaining my interest and how she could help me with it. Initially the spankings were playful rather than painful, my feedback was most often that she could definitely go harder and longer but I didn't seem to have the language or concepts to explain why.
I then found the DWC site (Epiphany 4) - a light bulb moment as I outlined to her that she could have a better behaved husband and I could have my key needs satisfied. Over time and with regular feedback via our shared journal she increased the severity of discipline way, way past the point of any enjoyment.
I am now in that place where I 'enjoy' the anticipation and the memory but the event itself is very painful and uncomfortable. We have a much discussed and mutually agreed set of rules, I am better behaved, she is happier and we have a great way of resolving any issues between us. We still have the occasional difficulties but DD has been a major positive influence in our relationship.
I see the route where we are as being triggered by those key 'light bulb' moments. It has taken a while and I often think that if we were able (as a society) to be more open and accepting of differences than we could get to personal congruence a lot quicker... TB
I think maybe one reason I didn't associate spanking with anything remotely pleasurable was I don't think in our community it ever had a "naughty" vibe, even that was a term parents used to describe kids' behavior. It was very common at home and school, but there was never a sense that it was for anything but serious behavior correction (at least to the extent of my exposure to it).
DeleteAs I think everyone knows at this point, I'm very on the fence about whether society being more open to it would be good or bad. I think one of the reason I'm attracted to it now is precisely because it is seen as transgressive. If it ever lost that "naughty shared secret" status that Aunt Kay talked about and became more common and accepted, I think it might lose a lot of the allure for me.
Hi Dan,
DeleteI think I want it to become just mainstream enough that my wife can actually do all (ok, maybe most, but not all) the crazy ideas she has involving witnesses and so on, and yet still retain enough of the "naughty shared secret" status that it will still be super edgy if and when it ever happens!
-ZM
I think for me it would be great if it stayed closeted and transgressive, yet we somehow stumbled into a couple that were into it and into the kind of "crazy ideas" yours have. Honestly, I think the only way it plays out that way for us is if some miracle happens and Anne ends up having a relationship with someone who is openly dominant and it leads to conversations . . . I don't see it being something that I have ability to bring about.
DeleteInteresting topic. I don't know that I can pinpoint an exact moment of epiphany when I realized that I wanted/needed a disciplinary wife relationship. It was more an evolution in terms of my desire to have a disciplinary wife, even though the fantasy of being being bare bottom paddled by an attractive woman began at puberty - as an otk spanking over by an attractive aunt a couple of years earlier morphed into a sexual fantasy. I've shared that story here before more than once. At the time of that very real and serious otk hairbrushing, there was nothing fascinating about it at all - and I made absolutely certain that I stayed on my best behavior for the rest of the time I spent at my aunt's house that summer - I wanted no more of that! Nevertheless, when I hit puberty a couple of years later, that recollection became a frequent masturbation fantasy (as well as with other attractive women being the disciplinarian).
ReplyDeleteThe idea of being spanked by a women remained in my repertoire of fantasies as I aged, although far from exclusively, especially as I hit my mid-teens and began having sex with girlfriends. A random fling with a kinky older woman in my late teens resulted in me giving her several spankings, and her giving me one otk paddling that while not of "dwc intensity" did truly sting and left me with a red bottom. And - as that fling ended - what I remembered most in the years to come was that one time that she spanked my bare rear, further embedding the F/M spanking fantasy in my psyche.
I married a couple of years later while still in college - and then for the next 20 years or so, F/M spanking was just a sometimes-fantasy and an occasional story in an adult magazine - as I was quite certain that my wife would have absolutely no interest in spanking at all. And then in the early 90's the public Internet came online (text only at first - no websites) with the Usenet spanking story forum - where I first encountered stories of wives spanking their husbands on a regular basis to keep them in line. It was in reading these stories that the idea of being a regularly spanked husband came to appeal to me - perhaps that was the first "epiphany" - although I still thought it to be a fantasy scenario that probably only very, very rarely ever happened in real life (if at all) - and certainly would ever be possible for my wife and I (all though our years together, while our sex life was consistently good, she had never given me any reason to believe that she was anything but straight vanilla).
Then - perhaps only a year or two later - the Web came online and soon after that I discovered the Disciplinary Wives Club - still relatively new and quite active. Reading every word on the site multiple times, my mindset shifted to the belief that it was quite possible to have a disciplinary wife relationship - and that may have been the "second epiphany", Nevertheless, I still did not believe my wife would have the slightest interest, and could not take the "risk" of even mentioning it.
Until one night over too much wine, as my wife and I swapped fantasies, I did mention it. And - it turned out that I was very mistaken - she was very much interested, and that weekend I became a disciplined husband (in a story that I've told here a few times). While not truly an epiphany by definition, it was certainly among the greatest surprises of my life - to discover that my wife was a natural disciplinarian who discovered that she loved to spank for the joy of spanking. --al
The only sad part to your story Al is that you had to wait twenty years to realize that your wife enjoyed spanking you. I’m glad when I met my wife, we initially incorporated erotic spanking into the relationship. It laid the groundwork for DD, it helped when I sent her quotes from the DWC. As with most, that site laid the groundwork for me. For me the topic of the week, I think it’s partly therapeutic to talk about how we all started down this primrose path. For a long time I thought I was an odd duck out.
DeleteT
Al, I recall those Usenet sites, but I don't have a clear memory of when I discovered them. I don't think it was between seeing the Real Sex segment I've talked about and discovering the DWC. Rather, I think I discovered the DWC, then that sent me looking kind of feverishly for similar content. I do recall distinctly that at the time I discovered the DWC website, it was still being updated, with new stories appearing fairly regularly in the "Real People" section, and a few new fiction additions from time to time. And, the Guestbook was still active. But, I think it was less than a year, two at the most, that the updates slowed to a trickle and then stopped.
DeleteI'm never 100% clear on when I discovered the DWC, but I think it was sometime in 2004.
It is too bad you didn't have that tipsy conversation earlier. I'm glad I discovered my interest in it when we were only about 10 years into our marriage, yet I wonder what would have happened had we discovered it earlier. I like to think that maybe with more time, we would have explored the DWC community more thoroughly. But, honestly, I kind of doubt it. We were both (overly) concerned about anonymity, and I'm not sure that would have changed even had we had more years in the lifestyle.
T wrote: >"The only sad part to your story Al is that you had to wait twenty years to realize that your wife enjoyed spanking you."<
DeleteIn a sense, yes. However, prior to the disciplinary wife spanking stories that I began reading on the Usenet spanking forum in 1997, I don't think I really equated my fascination with F/M spanking with having a disciplinary wife - or with my wife, Susan (who while quite sexual in the traditional sense, always seemed very plain vanilla). F/M spanking certainly had remained a fantasy all through the years but really without a specific context.
While that context shifted to the idea of a disciplinary wife with the those stories on the Usenet (beginning in 1997), it was discovering the the DWC site in 1999 that really provided me a definite idea of what a disciplinary wife relationship would look like. And certainly after encountering the DWC site (and building on those Usenet stories), I had come to have a definite fantasy of a having a DWC marriage. I would say "desire" instead of "fantasy" - but at that point, I felt certain that Susan would never be interested and might even think badly of me in some manner for even talking about it - so it seemed completely out of reach.
Of course, that changed in 2002 when the conversation did finally - if unexpectedly - occur. So, really it was roughly 5 years from the time I began to equate F/M spanking with a disciplinary wife, and only a couple of years after discovering the DWC site that our DWC lifestyle began. In retrospect, it probably could have occurred anytime after I started reading those stories - I suspect Susan would have discovered her appreciation of spanking even if it had been a few years earlier (although perhaps not too much earlier - I do believe we both had to be a a certain point in the maturity of our relationship to entertain the idea). I do think it was a positive that it did not occur until after I discovered the DWC - which served as an early guide for both of us. --al
Dan wrote: "I recall those Usenet sites".
DeleteI've probably shared this here before, but for anyone who missed it - the Usenet had a specific group naming structure and the one for the spanking forum came out to be "alt.sexuality.spanking" - so in a bit of a humorous coincidence, the abbreviation/acronym was "ass". Consequently the participants appropriately nicknamed the group "assville".
I was fortunate to have made text file copies of some of my posts, emails, and stories for my archives - so I do have some firm dates (at least the year) of the sequence of events that led up to that fateful evening in 2002. (Mentioned in my response to T above). --al
Al, it's a good point that the DWC supplied something very different than the Usenet stuff, Penthouse, Variations, etc. Those other venues for spanking material were mostly lacking the "domestic" part of DD. There was pretty much zero reference to anything like a DD marriage or what that might look like. For me, the triggering formula was pretty specific: spanking + accountability/penance + real relationship. Without all three of those elements, the trigger wasn't there. It's not that I didn't find spanking stories without them titillating (I've gotten plenty stimulated by plenty of stories involving young men taken to the woodshed by uncles or fathers), but they didn't trigger a sustained, obsessive interest in the way the DWC did.
DeleteI have had F/M DD spankings throughout my marriage, but I suppose I have occasionally wondered what it would have been like if it had been introduced later on.
DeleteWe got married quite young and I am certain I would have done some stupid things, had things not been the way they were. My wife got a lot of bad habits out of me early on, plus I didn't have to contain my sexual desires: I have seen young men around me without good women in their lives to control them and no outlets for their desires who do silly things!
J.
I have posted before about my husband’s and my “ epiphany “re our DD spanking history snd present life dynamics.. i want to share somewhat for offering a view for people about this lifestyle in our 70s. As i have said before many years ago i drew a line between spanking punishments and sex.fairly early in our relationship when discussing our families I had shared that in my very religious family rules were strict and rules violated were punished with spankings. It never occurred to me that there were any sexual contexts certainly none for me as these were events to avoided . I recall him asking for details about spankings and he seemed interested in hearing about my mom and how she dealt-with me and my siblings. at the time I didn’t give it much thought. His childhood was lonely snd his parents were mostly permissive. In a conversation with my mom during one of our first visits one if his comments to my mom caused het to ask him “ did your mother ever take your trousers down a blister your behind” . When he said well no, she said it shows, a few visits later my mom went out if her way to find herself all alone with my young very naive husband .The spanking that happened that morning was the epiphany for him. He has told me that when she confronted him about his disrespect and said that she would teach him a lesson he got a strange feeling of some kind of excitement. While waiting in my childhood room he was confused and anxious. When she entered the room with a strap the strange sense of excitement turned to fear.. some 50 years later he still has difficulty accepting why he submitted . My epiphany was seeing how he interacted with my mom .my mom has been gone for years but i can still elicit a response by producing her strap.in the years after that first spanking on a few occasions I told him I was going to report his transgressions tomy mom and he begged me not to. Once many years later he said something that caused her to ask him” do you want another taste of the strap? He was silent the rest of the day.With so much on line about DD and FLR, he is still very concerned about anyone knowing he is spanked, but when i tell him he is going to get it , there is no hesitation to submit. It has been many years since we visited Aunt Kay and Jerry, he says the most humiliating experience ever, being spanked in front of a man.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Miss C. "It never occurred to me that there were any sexual contexts certainly none for me as these were events to avoided." That's how I remember the whole vibe around spankings when I was young. Corporal punishment was pervasive, but if anyone experienced any kind of turn on from that, it certainly was never mentioned. Of course, I was pretty young. We moved from that community while I was in grade school, though I visited family there many time afterward. I attended a funeral there a couple of years ago, and adults *still* referred to kids needing or getting spankings, so it doesn't appear that the overall drop in corporal punishment nationwide has permeated much of the Bible Belt, where the emphasis was always on the Belt part.
DeleteYour epiphany is interesting to me, given that it was based on a personal observation of your husband behaving differently after a real disciplinary spanking but before you had any experience giving him one yourself.
Miss C: “My epiphany was seeing how he interacted with my mom .my mom has been gone for years but i can still elicit a response by producing her strap.”
ReplyDeleteMiss C, was your epiphany observing his reaction to discipline and realizing it could play a significant role in your relationship? A related question is whether you think today that your mother was sending both of you a message about what your relationship might need in the future. ( put directly, did she expect you to follow her example?)
I am asking because of a point my former (disciplinary) girlfriend often returned to. She expressed wonder at what effect spanking me had on my behavior and attitude toward her. (As in, “Alan, spanking you turns you into a different man, and I like that man.” She also said that she couldn’t imagine being in a relationship with me without the authority to spank me.)
I am not sure why I have remembered this after many years. But I think it was an epiphany for her. She seemed to change from viewing spanking as something she was doing because I “needed it” to seeing and using spanking to manage my behavior for both of us. Is this similar to your epiphany?
Alan
Hi Alan,
DeleteYou said: "...I think it was an epiphany for her. She seemed to change from viewing spanking as something she was doing because I 'needed it' to seeing and using spanking to manage my behavior for both of us."
I think that this right here, if it happens, is the largest epiphany moment for any disciplinary wife. The first epiphany for many might be when they realize that the actually get a charge out of exercising authority. That is when they start to initiate things a bit more, because they like it to.
BUT, if and when they realize that they can actually use it to their benefit and that it can have huge benefits to the relationship, that is the huge game changer. My wife is not yet at that point, though she is progressing in that direction. I am kind of thinking, but may not be right, that the answer to whether your wife has had this particular epiphany or not is exactly the same as the answer to whether you are in an FLR or not; once she discovers the power she has to affect real change, it will soon become an FLR whether you are thinking you want that or not, especially because those of us who are wired this way can't really resist once we have submitted to her control, so ultimately it will go just about as far as she wants it to.
-ZM
Alan, my mother was an old fashioned woman who was the disciplinarian in our family. I had seven siblings and we all new that breaking family rules or back talking lead to an immediate always bare bottom spanking. The girls spanked with a hair brush or wooden spoon.” The boys were subjected to her strap or told to bring her a switch. Any infraction was dealt with immediately. The spankings were to maintain order and to change behavior. All of us new after a session or two that breaking a rule meant that as she said you will be doing everything standing up
Deletefor a while. The night he angered mom we all were trying to tell him to stop. It never occurred to me that she would spank him. We got married young and neither of our parents were happy with the marriage but we were 20. It was several trips later, we lived in different cities , that I mentioned that he had told me that she had punished him. All she said was he got to big for his britches and” i got his attention “ I never discussed it again I doubted she had any idea of me spanking him. As I have posted before I have drawn i line between spanking and sexual intimacy. I don’t get sexual satisfaction from spanking him but i do find satisfaction in changing his behavior. Over the years i have felt times that spanking him really relieved tension. When many years later my mom gave me her strap it made me question my assumptions. Some 30 years later he made some condescending comments about mom’s religious beliefs she followed him into the next room. He told me she grabbed him by the ear and asked him if he wanted a taste of the strap. He was shaking when telling me .He was )50 and she was in her 80s
Miss C—It sounds to me that your mom meant to give both of you a gift in giving him that first spanking he badly needed and showing you what you could accomplish with the strap. It's very revealing that she gave you the strap later in light of the fact she only used it to spank males. Is there a chance that she may have had similar interactions with your brothers' partners? Or maybe she saw your husband as someone in particular need of her “therapy.”
DeleteAlan
ZM—"BUT, if and when they realize that they can actually use it to their benefit and that it can have huge benefits to the relationship, that is the huge game changer. “
I agree -although I would argue it doesn’t necessarily equate to a formal FLR. That, as you point out, is up to her. Both of my disciplinary relationships have been with women who wanted dynamic partnerships. My wife's point of reference for punishment is things that endanger us, untruths of any kind, disobedience to clear rules she has made, or anything she determines damages our relationship. That is broad, but in practice, it is still short of “we discuss, she decides model.” So my conclusion is that if a wife has an “epiphany” about spanking, her experience almost guarantees it will become a genuine DD relationship if it isn’t already. But whether it goes full FLR depends.
Alan
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ReplyDeleteAs far as witnesses go or a desire to be paddled by the member of the opposite sex, for me it’s a no. There was always a witness present when paddled as school. If did not matter the sex. Men would paddle boys and women teachers would paddle the girls. I was paddled by a female teacher once and it was because the principal was on vacation. The female secretary was a witness. As far as being thrashed by a male or a male witness, it does nothing for me. The group setting does nothing for me as well. I would be ok with my wife sending me to another women in private to be spanked, but that won’t ever happen. She is much too prudish for that. The discipline for us will stay in the household. I would see a professional if my wife could no longer discipline or who had zero interest in doing it. I know obviously the intimacy would not be present.
ReplyDeleteT
I suspect that, for us, the reality is it will stay in the household. Though, in my case it's about her probable lack of interest and the logistical hurdles, not a lack of interest in my part. The group setting doesn't do anything for me in terms of something like a spanking party. It would have to be something more like the DWC "confession" sessions we discussed last week, and even that might be too party-like to trigger my need for spankings to be "real" discipline.
DeleteI know that having a teacher or administrator was a thing in many school settings. I don't recall that it was in mine. It was pretty common for teachers to take someone into the hallway and do it there. If sent to the principal, I think he did it alone.