“A man who can't bear to
share his habits is a man who needs to quit them.” ― Stephen King, The Dark
Tower
Hello all. Welcome back to the Disciplinary Couples
Club. Our weekly gathering of men and
women who are in, or would like to be in, Domestic Discipline relationships. I hope you had a good week. We had a difficult one as a family. I thought about skipping this week’s post,
but I kind of needed the distraction.
Though, I also don’t have a lot of ambition or focus this weekend, so I’m
going to simply play off of some of last week’s comments, using them to hearken
back to a topic we did about a year ago.
But, we have added some participants since then . . .
Frank and I had a series of exchanges
last week that began with observations on the eroticism of some spanking
drawings involving Disciplinary Wives talking on telephones before or during a
spanking.
This seems to be a popular theme with spanking artists, though this is the only drawing I have found that involves the party who is going to be spanked, or just has been, doing the talking:
Then we talked a bit about others knowing about our Domestic
Discipline relationship, but with the wrinkle that Frank knows his
sister-in-law is the spanked party in some sort of spanking-oriented relationship,
though not any of the details. While he doesn't know the details, his brother-in-law seems to be fairly open in displaying his authority and, perhaps, letting others know how he uses it?
So, let's extend the discussion Frank and I had into this week's topic. As noted, it is one we have talked about before and, while
some of our commenters have talked about this several times, others
haven’t and the situation may have changed for even those who had commented
about this on other posts.The topic is telling others
about our Domestic Discipline or FLR relationships, and also what we know about
others. When we addressed this last
time, it seemed like most of us (with a few exceptions, notably KD) are very
skittish about letting others know either that we are spanked or that it is for disciplinary purposes,
or both. And, I do think those two—spanking
and discipline—are separable with respect to what makes us reluctant to let
others into our weird little worlds. The phenomenon of so many seemingly
vanilla women openly reading the 50 Shades
books would seem to indicate that the spanking kink side of DD is
relatively well accepted, along with some light bondage. I’m not sure the same is true about the
reluctance to have others know that we are disciplined.
As Frank and I discussed,
there is something “edgy” about others knowing that I am a disciplined husband,
even when I have chosen to tell them about it myself. And, twice now (sort of three times), I have
made that decision. The first time, I chose
to tell a female friend and work colleague who also is friends with Anne. I don’t know exactly why I told her. We were (and still are) close friends, and it
was early in our Domestic Discipline and I think I felt some compulsion to share
it with someone. Maybe it was akin to the
impulse that led me to blogging. The second time, I was approached by a female
blogger who was the leader in an FLR relationship. We talked anonymously for a long time before gaining
sufficient trust to drop that anonymity.
In the ensuing couple of years, that relationship has gone in some
unexpected directions, becoming intertwined with my professional life in some
interesting and entertaining ways. Finally, there is one other person associated
with this blog who now basically knows who I am or can figure it out pretty
easily.
Now, even though I made the
choice to open up with all three of these people and one of them was a close
friend before I blabbed about our relationship to her, when I talk to the two
with whom I have had live conversations, there definitely is some nervous energy
that comes with them knowing about that side of me. I don’t know whether “embarrassed” is the
right word, but I am at least very aware when talking to them that they know
that my wife is my boss and that she spanks my ass when she is unhappy with
me.
And, the fact that one of them does
the same to her husband does not really change the “edginess” that comes with
our shared secret. Though, it’s not a
bad sort of edginess, and I do still feel some odd desire to let even more
people know about this aspect of myself.
Anne and I have been talking a lot lately about her being more openly
dominant, and while I’m sure that if she starts doing that it will be
embarrassing, I also think it will make me respect her and her power even more.
Though, work probably does
remain the exception. I work in a very
conservative, traditional, and competitive profession. I do think that in my particular field, there
would be blowback if my status as a disciplined husband were widely known. The thought of extended family knowing also
causes me some angst. But, I'm still not sure why it is the combination of
spanking plus the FLR aspect of our relationship that adds a special level of
such angst. And, I am less concerned
about family knowing that I used to be, perhaps to some extent by learning of
concrete examples, like a story KD has told about letting his mother know about
this side of his relationship with Rosa.
http://mattmansfigures.homestead.com/momssupport.html
I will leave this topic
fairly open-ended, but some things we could talk about include:
· Who, if anyone, knows about your DD relationship, and
how did they find out?
· How did your relationship with, or feelings about,
those to whom you have confided or who learned about your DD relationship change,
if at all, after they found out?
· Do you know about anyone else’s DD or FLR relationship? How did you come to know about it?
· Is there anyone you would like to tell about your DD
relationship but have not? What keeps you
from telling them?
· Do you think your spouse has or might tell someone
about your relationship? How would you
feel about that?
· For the Disciplinary Wives, if someone does know that you
discipline your husband, how do they feel about that? How does their knowledge make you feel? Would you like to be more open about your own
disciplinary status, i.e. that you “wear the pants” in the relationship and
have the authority to punish your husband?
I hope you all have a great
week.
Here is how our journey got started into domestic discipline. My first marriage my wife wasn’t interested in much of anything and we finally divorced. I started dating and when I finally met a woman I dated several times. I started thinking before I get too involved I wanted to approach the subject of a female led relationship along with domestic discipline and punishment. I didn’t want another marriage where I had to keep my desires to myself.
ReplyDeleteI searched the internet and found Aunt Kay’s site (DWC) and ordered some of her booklets. I also searched other websites about domestic discipline. I copied and printed all the material I could find and put it into a binder just waiting for the right time to show her. I had over 100 pages dealing with a female led relationship.
After several weeks I finally got the nerve to talk to her about it. I invited her over for dinner. After dinner we sat in the living room and I brought up the subject of a FLR relationship. She seemed a little shocked but I told her that if we were to marry I want to be as perfect of a husband I could be but I will need someone who was strict and would set rules and not be afraid to discipline when necessary. I told her that I know your former husband was abusive, a drunk and cheated on you so with you in control of the relationship you won’t ever have to worry about that. I then gave her the binder and told her to take it home and read it and if she was interested then we will go forward from here.
Three days went by before I finally heard from her. She said she read all the materials and was interested but told me there will be no turning back once we started. She also said it will start the day we became engaged. I agreed.
Three months later I was ready to ask her to marry me so I told her I wanted her to come to my house for a special dinner. After dinner we went to the livingroom then I got on my knees and asked her to marry me. She accepted and we kissed then she told me to stay on my knees. She reached into her purse and pulled out a chastity cage. She put the ring around my scrotum attached the cage and snapped the padlock shut and said “you now belong to me and you will do what I tell you when I tell you or you will be spanked.” She also said the chastity will assure me you will not cheat like my ex.
The next day we went to her mothers house to inform her mother and sister of our engagement. Her mother wasn’t too happy about it because of her previous marriage so my fiancee said not to worry because we were going to have a female led relationship where he will obey me and not to worry about him cheating because he can’t then ordered me to drop my pants and show my chastity to her mother and sister. They were a little shocked but I thought it was a good idea.
Her mother, sister and a couple of her friends have seen me being spanked. There may be more that know about it than I know. In fact I’ve been naked either in the corner or being spanked so many times in front of her mother and sister it doesn’t bother me anymore. If they come over and I was in the corner they will come up and hug me and think nothing of me being naked.
I sometimes feel like I would rather have everybody know about our relationship rather than having to keep it a secret.
DanMel
DeleteThanks for opening this week's discussion. When we married I thought we were the perfect match.
After our boys were born and I stopped working things changed. We went to marriage counselor.
It was there one friday evening, Peter confessed that he needed me to be more in control. He also
admitted that to make himself balanced he had gone to a woman for discipline and then said there
was no sex involved.
With two sons I was ready to explore any avenue to keep our marriage together. I met the woman
that had disciplined him for some time. She too assured me there was no sex. She demonstrated
how she spanked. She then suggested we set up rules.Were the rules broken spanking would
be handed out by me. We began with a simple list that has grown. I took over the finances which were
one of his failings. Without going into too much detail I wanted him more involved with our boys and to
teach them the importance of following rules.
I adjusted to giving the spankings quite easily. Peter might say too easily. The one thing that I didn't expect was the arousal that his submission to my rules gave both of us. The most important rule we
set up was that there was to be no release for him after punishment. Today he knows to after discipline
to kneel look up at me and listen too what I wanted from him As I became more secure, I came to enjoy
him orally pleasing me with no relief for him. Currently he is caged CB6000 before discipline and he
must sleep caged.
As to others who know my sister, her husband and one or two other friends. In one case I trained a friend how to spank a man , using Peter for demo. We might be more open were it not for our sons.
Discipline Nite is usually Friday as our boys go spend time with my folks.At the moment its fine but the boys as they approach their teen years we aren't sure how we want to handle it.
Dan a great topic is how do we handle kids knowing. How and when do we tell them or do we?
Thanks for this outlet I feel so good and am ready to answer any question anyone has.
as always
anna
Hi Anna. I might do that one soon, though we have covered it several times. Though, at this point, we have covered EVERYTHING several times . . .
DeleteThe kids thing has always concerned Mrs GL and me, we worry they will hear a spanking happening. My slightly glib suggestion when we last talked that we just say "daddy was naughty" just made Mrs GL raise her eyebrows and say "no". So we will just have to hope they hear nothing or say nothing if they do. Cheers Good Life Mickey.
ReplyDeleteYour last sentence is why I have my doubts about whether our kids know; if they do, we probably would be the last to know.
DeleteNot wanting to explain their relationships to me, I will share that I know two women who are very close friends with each other, and I know their husbands. When I first met one of these women, it was immediately obvious that she has a dominating personality. During our first conversation, over dinner, and after some drinks, she made some kind of comment that strongly suggested that she disciplines her husband, without quite saying it explicitly. So, with my curiosity piqued, I asked her what the comment meant, and she replied, “You know what I mean!”- and gave me no further explanation. Yes, I am pretty sure that I know what she meant. Concerning her very close friend, I know that her husband serves her breakfast in bed every day, and I have some indirect evidence that she disciplines him.
ReplyDeleteThough I am happily married, with a wife who spanks me regularly, but not within a disciplinary context, I find myself a bit envious of the two husbands, who apparently are spanked within disciplinary contexts. The fact that my wife spanks me is a tightly kept secret, but who can be absolutely sure about something like this.
Doug
Hi Dan,
ReplyDeleteSince I don’t have huge amounts to say on this topic, I will just stick to the questions!
- Who, if anyone, knows about your DD relationship, and how did they find out?
As far as I know, nobody knows. However, it seems like that many of us with teenagers are just fooling ourselves as we think that we have done such a good job hiding things. It seems possible, though not necessarily likely, that one or more of our mostly grown children have come across our stash of tools/toys, so they might suspect something. However, even if they discovered something, they have no reason to suspect it is me getting spanked, or even more that it is more than just some kinky game.
- Do you know about anyone else’s DD or FLR relationship? How did you come to know about it?
I don’t know of a DD relationship, but a couple that I have been friends with for years is certainly strongly FLR, even if they don’t do anything DD or punishment related (who knows? maybe they do?). Anyway, she makes pretty much all the decisions and if she says “jump,” he says “how high?” with absolutely no hesitation.
- Is there anyone that you would like to tell about your DD relationship but have not? What keeps you from telling them?
Again, there is nobody that I would specifically like to tell, but in some strange way the idea of somebody knowing about it doesn’t sound all bad, especially since it is so much a part of my make-up. Probably the biggest thing that would keep me from telling anyone is that I would fear that they would see me different. If only you could tell somebody something and talk openly about it, and then they would forget it the next day! Also, I kind of like it that it is something that is so private between my wife and I.
- Do you think your spouse has or might tell someone about your relationship? How would you feel about that?
I have brought up the subject of “other people” in the past when it was a forum topic, and my wife said that she would never tell anyone. Consequently, I assume that is still the case. I think it is unlikely in any event, since she is quite private and doesn’t get involved in other people’s business. Also, we live in a very, very conservative country that is largely patriarchal, so it would not exactly be an easy conversation to have with anyone.
Having said all that, in the unlikely event that she ever did tell anyone, it would most likely be her sister or one of her very close life-long friends. If she chose to do that, I don’t think I would really care that much.
-ZM
Hi ZM. In the past, had my kids found any of our toys they too would have no real way of knowing on which parent they were used, or whether it was anything other than a kinky sex thing. Now that Anne is becoming more openly assertive, I think they would be able to figure it out.
DeleteLike yours, mine has never seemed inclined to tell anyone. But, if she did, I suspect it would, in fact, be one or more of our kids. They have always been very close, and I could envision her spilling it to one or more of them someday.
I love this topic but feel my input after all these years is redundant. However, perhaps I could just briefly address Dan's questions:
ReplyDelete· Who, if anyone, knows about your DD relationship, and how did they find out?
Most everyone in our circle of family and friends. We told them about it.
· How did your relationship with, or feelings about, those to whom you have confided or who learned about your DD relationship change, if at all, after they found out?
Mostly relief at not having to hide a secret so integral to our lives. As the spanked half, I do get teased more than Rosa......but only on occasion and only from those who are very comfortable with us.
· Do you know about anyone else’s DD or FLR relationship? How did you come to know about it?
Only online friends through forums and chats. Ironically, as open as people are with us, it doesn't seem like too many of the parties who would be likely to be in such a relationship are paired with partners who are of the same desire.
· Is there anyone you would like to tell about your DD relationship but have not? What keeps you from telling them?
Probably not. Pretty much anyone we'd be open to already knows.
· Do you think your spouse has or might tell someone about your relationship? How would you feel about that?
She has in the past at work. But I'm fine with that. I trust her judgement and no one seems to take advantage of the knowledge.
It's pretty easy to get a vibe from people with just a few comments to test the water. It becomes clear pretty quickly who is baffled by it, who is accepting and even curious but not "into it", and who is "into it". It's no different that discussing politics or religion. It's tricky but possible, if you can read the room.
And one thing that might surprise those more private is how little a difference the information makes with regard to how people see you. In m case, I may be a self-confessed male sub, but those without sanctioned 'authority' know better than to try to boss me around. I am still me. Even after finding out I get spanked by Rosa, few people in our circle assume it means more than that. Of course, we simply don't socialize with the types of judgmental people who might be more likely to have a problem with it.
You may have better DD radar than I do. I really have no idea whether anyone I know is into it. I did have an encounter at a work party that led me to believe that one of my younger colleagues might in fact be dominant wife in one form or another, or that could have been me projecting. And, given the never ending revelations about various preachers and politicians betting caught with their pants down, I have given up on thinking I really have any idea what goes on behind closed doors with seemingly very vanilla people.
DeleteSome is instinct, but verbal feelers are the key. BTW thanks for posting my story link. It's been a while since that conversation happened and I still think about it. And I can't help but wonder what things would have been like if my mother was still around?
DeleteSubtle verbal feelers about DD interest? Please share. :-)
DeleteTake any situation and when the opportunity arises, make a spanking reference or joke and watch the reactions carefully. Then if you get nothing to cause you to back away, throw in more innuendos. Maybe make a comment, like if a friend gets picky over their dinner, say, "wow, if you are that strict about your food, maybe you should consider being a part-time dominatrix for extra cash ."
DeleteStuff like that. If you get an eye roll, you get your answer, just as a grin would be another answer. It's actually very easy. A few comments with the right responses will at least open a door. But if your first jokes fall flat or get a response like, "I never understood those kinky people. What's wrong with regular sex?" change the subject.
I like to joke and I'm not afraid to be a little raunchy with people in fun. But those little looks between people, reveal a lot.
This is Elizabeth. This week's question has been very impactful for us and likely will be more so in the next week. So thanks to Dan.
ReplyDeleteIt has really been bothering me that my sister's knowledge that I spank Frank has changed my husband's interaction with her. He used to be affable and friendly around her. Now he is deferential and politely distant. He basically does not interact with her at all.
This is a problem because we see my sister and her husband a lot. It isn't strained, really, and Frank is friends with her husband (who doesn't know ... yet, though Frank knows that he spanks my sister).
But I have decided that Frank's lack of interaction with my sister is a problem. Sunday night I spoke to her about it on the phone, and she said she was sad that she and Frank aren't friends. After all, she said, they have being spanked in common! She said she liked it better before she knew, that back then the two couples had better times together.
Last night I presented this issue to Frank. Though I have allowed his behavior toward my sister for several years, I told him it is no longer acceptable. I explained my reasons why and what my sister said. And he agrees that his supposedly polite non-interaction has actually bordered on rude (if not crossed the line). So we will address his behavior Friday night in our session.
Then I called my sister and she spoke with her husband and they are coming over for dinner on Saturday. And all four of us together are going to discuss domestic discipline, clear the air, remove the secrets, and enable my sister and Frank to have a real relationship.
Frank is very nervous about this upcoming meeting, but he understands that it needs to happen, and we will address his attitude about it in Friday's session.
Wish us luck!
Elizabeth
I wish you all the best luck with this. I have to admit that I don't understand Frank's reluctance. If this was me, I'd welcome a 'fellow traveler' in the family.
DeleteHopefully the dinner will help. I have found being open makes everyone more comfortable. One thing I would suggest is that you and your Brother-in-Law reassure Frank and your sister that their more vulnerable position in no way diminishes them. In fact, in the past, when Rosa would praise my compliance as something she appreciated and admittedly would be averse to doing herself, it made me feel like an equally important half of a power-imbalanced coin.
Having a DD arrangement can result in a lot of harmony as you yourself have said in the past. But to have that harmony you need two willing participants. Devalue either, and it falls apart. One thing I have seen with the dominant parties I know is a certain casual "this is what it is/you want it and need it" attitude that comes with the confidence of being the one in charge and not being the one who gets punished. And while we submissive halves admit wanting or needing the discipline, it isn't always easy. It hurts and it's embarrassing. Tops see that as part and parcel of the arrangement......and it is.....but while you dominant folks enjoy praise for your fairness, strictness, and confidence, a little praise for the submissive having the courage to take their punishments willingly can go a long way too. Just something to think about when you all sit down together.......especially since Frank will be sitting less comfortably than the rest of you but is just as important.
All the best!
BTW, Elizabeth, I would like to take this opportunity to offer a public apology to you for some past interactions here that were less than polite. I had my reasons at the time but have recently come to look at things differently. So please accept my sincere apology and promise to be considerably more friendly going forward.
DeleteGood luck! It sounds like an interesting air clearing session is forthcoming. Have you also thought about having Frank and your sister go out for a drink or dinner together, but without the "tops"? It might be easier for them to share thoughts about this if it is two "subs" (for lack of a better word) exchanging views, experiences, etc.
DeleteI'm fine with Frank and my sister talking together whenever they feel comfortable doing so. I imagine my sister's husband and I could exchange some DD wisdom as well.
DeleteI spoke with my sister again last night and she said her husband told her that she best behave herself in our meeting, control her saucy mouth and not give Frank too hard a time for acting distant, or there would be "consequences."
Well, well, well. Last night I got a call from my sister's husband, who wanted to discuss our upcoming meeting. He suggested that each of us answer the question, "How does domestic discipline benefit my marriage?" And he offered to go first, since he feels little stress about the question. He suggested my sister go next, then Frank, and let me go last and kind of sum up.
DeleteI said that sounded good and that then we could have an open and freewheeling conversation as needed. We agreed that we should loosen up with a little alcohol before the meeting, and have dinner afterwards (since Frank can't eat when he is nervous).
My sister's husband also said that he had "addressed" with my sister the issue of her teasing Frank when she came to visit me and realized he was in position to be spanked in the next room. Her husband said he thought such teasing might be ok once we all have discussed DD, but that Frank obviously felt embarrassed at that first revelation and the teasing contributed to him being distant ever since.
While I agreed that could be so, I expressed the opinion that Frank overreacted, and that I would be "addressing" that issue with him. And that Frank definitely owes her an apology, and I would be "addressing" that as well.
My sister's husband laughed and said his wife also owed Frank an apology and that he planned to "properly prepare" my sister's attitude for the meeting.
I get the feeling that she and Frank may be standing up for much of the night!
Elizabeth
I notice Frank has been a little silent through all this. Does *he* think the reason he became distant was your sister teasing him a little? Just speaking for myself, I probably would welcome someone in my position to talk to in real life.
DeleteThis is Elizabeth's Frank. I am going to respond to Dan's question by responding to the Stephen King quote that opens this discussion. For 40 years I had a "habit," that I would call an obsession, that I shared with no one. As Stephen King says, that is probably a bad idea. Then I shared it with the one person I needed to share it with, my wife, and our lives changed significantly for the better. I have no desire or need to share it with anyone else. And I am not at all looking forward to doing so this evening. I do not need a fellow spankee to talk with. I just need and want a DD marriage, and that's what I have.
DeleteApology accepted. Submissives, and spankees who are not true submissives (like my husband), tend to be much better (and more experienced) at apologizing than those of us on the other side of the paddle!
ReplyDeleteAnd your comments about the spankers needing to appreciate the spankees are well taken.
Elizabeth
Thank you.
DeleteAnd you make an interesting and, in my experience, accurate observation on apologies. Those subject to consequences for behavior have two factors that encourage freer apologies: one is the innate desire to please which probably leads to a more deferential personality in the first place and why we are in our roles to begin with.....and, lol, the physical 'encouragement' we get from you more dominant types to make amends. At least in this case I am probably getting off more easily than if I was Frank.....or...lol if my rudeness had been directed at someone in my circle. lol
Back in January I intentionally but playfully bratted a friend who has 'spanking authority' and after securing my wife's consent and encouragement, she gave me a darned good spanking for it. Initially I just assumed it was going to be more of a playful thing, but she soon started to genuinely scold me for challenging her in her own home and then reprimanded me for something else I had nearly forgotten. The fun spanking adventure I had sought with my bratting soon became a real spanking from someone now looking to teach me a lesson in manners and obedience. And whereas I probably never would have thought an apology would be necessary for either 'offense', now I found myself desperately apologizing like crazy! So...yes....we on the receiving end do get more experience and encouragement to say "I'm sorry". lol
I must be an exception. I find apologizing to be WAY harder than getting spanked. I do it, and I recognize the value in it, both socially and in terms of humbling my ego. But, it is damn hard.
DeleteDan: I only find it difficult if I don't think I did anything wrong. Then someone can paddle the skin off me and they're not going to get me to back down. But if I know I'm wrong, and caught, and the smacks start landing with force and scolding? Then even if I hadn't thought an apology was necessary, it's "Sorry, sorry, sorry" like when I was a kid over my mother's lap! LOL
DeleteIf I really don't think I did anything wrong, there is very little chance I am going to apologize. But, the truth is, usually when I have something to apologize for it is because of my temper, and while there may have been something that set me off, the over-the-top reaction is still usually apology-worthy even if I think the situation is nuanced in terms of who started it, whether the other guy was being unreasonable or stupid and, in being unreasonable or stupid provoked me, etc. The hard examples are ones like I recounted here before in which the other person really is a dick, but in that particular instance didn't deserved whatever I did. That apology involved something in which I really probably was in the wrong, but the way I reacted was a function of really not liking the other person. In other words, I wasn't wrong about that person being a dick, but me believing he was a dick led to be attributing something to him that would have been perfectly in character but that I happened to be mistaken about in that one instance. But, even there, I can separate out the substance underlying the response from the form my response took and say that I just need to learn to hold my tongue and tamp down my temper, and having to apologize to someone I really don't like was more effective at helping me do that than any spanking ever could have been.
DeleteFrank is more like Dan (definitely not a submissive personality) than KD (a self-identified submissive). Frank, like lots of prideful men, does not like apologizing and is hesitant to do so on his own. But the paddle does wonders for removing that pride and eliciting "I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm SORRY!"
DeleteI quite believe there will be an apology to my sister in our Saturday meeting ...
Elizabeth
In your case, I'm pretty sure "believing will be seeing".
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ReplyDeleteSorry Well. Come back after one less bowl and try it again. In the meantime, not going to do the meandering stream of semi-consciousness thing in which you sort of remember responding to a similar topic somewhere some time ago . . .
DeleteHey, I don't know who you were talking to. But "one more bowl" sounds great to me.
DeleteYeah, it can definitely be a good thing, but not when it results in a rambling, incoherent comment. Blogging and baking don't mix!
DeleteReally? Hmmm. What were we talking about? I forget. But I really have a craving for asparagus. Man, isn't that caterpillar cool?
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ReplyDelete