Saturday, September 15, 2018

The Club - Meeting #267 - Après Spanking


"Immorality: the morality of those who are having a better time." - H. L. Mencken

Hello all. Welcome back to the Disciplinary Couples Club.  Our weekly gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, Domestic Discipline or Female Led relationships.

I hope you had a good week.  Mine was pretty decent, right up until last night.  It sometimes seems like self-control is a finite resource, and once it is used up over the course of a few days, it's just gone and the pendulum swings dramatically in the other direction.  Very disappointing.  A line from the movie Tombstone keeps playing in my head.  "My dear, it appears we may need to re-define the nature of our association."  But, it's not easy re-defining oneself, is it?  As Oscar Wilde observed, "But, then one regrets the loss even of one's worst habits.  Perhaps one regrets them the most. They are such an essential part of one's personality."  

This week's topic is, as  promised, an extension of a discussion kicked off by Alan.  In discussing the role sex plays--or does not play--in his disciplinary arrangement, he observed:

[E]arlier I did experience lovemaking immediately after spanking which I remember as a passionate and intimate experience. My wife feels strongly about this, believing that sex works against the disciplinary effects of a spanking and so I am unlikely to change her mind. But it would be interesting in this community to know how much or little lovemaking is allowed by our wives and girlfriends. From reading I have the impression my situation is pretty common and Helen’s rare, but could be wrong.

 I honestly don't know which approach to sex after a spanking is common and which is rare. I definitely appreciate the view that discipline should be separated from sex, in order to make the discipline more effective and to make sure that discipline really is, well, discipline.

Many men who are attracted to this lifestyle seem to crave "authenticity."  They need it to be real.  Real discipline for real offenses. It's why there really is a danger of "be careful what you wish for; you might get it."  Some wives, like Alan's, decide that there really does need to be a clear separation between discipline and sex.  As I recall, Anna and Peter also fall into that camp.

Although I appreciate the logic of that position and intellectually it makes perfect sense to me, our practice is different.  We almost always do have sex after a disciplinary session, though we seem to be drifting a little in the opposite direction.  It hasn't been so much a conscious choice and, like so many other things in our life, our practice in this area may have been influenced by the presence or absence of children.   I suspect that we often had sex after discipline sessions not because the two were linked together in our minds, but because there were limited times when we were (a) both physically present; (b) not working or occupied with other things; and (c) kids were in bed or gone.  So, both sex and spanking happened on those rare occasions when the stars aligned on all three of those factors.  Now, with longer periods in which the kids are not around, she is free to "take care of business" when the need arises, and it isn't followed by sex as often.  And, like Alan, I do get very into my wife's power and authority after a spanking and feel a strong need to express that with real intimacy.

There also seemed to be a current in the comments last week of some women simply not being turned on after a spanking.  Quite the opposite.  His behavior has pissed her off, the spanking is serious business, so sex is simply not an option for her at that time.

And, then there are those women who flat-out get aroused by the whole thing, whether by the actual act of punishing their husband in this undoubtedly intimate way or by exercising their own power.

Which approach to sex governs your relationship?
 


80 comments:

  1. In our case, I'm less likely to want sex after punishment. A disciplinary spanking leaves me unaroused. My wife, if she wants to edge me that night, will spank me early in the evening to allow me time to recover so she can play with me.

    She isn't interested in sex for herself. Nothing arouses her. It's been this way for many years. But she likes being sexual with me. Almost every night she will edge me several times. About once a week she will let me ejaculate.

    She has never been willing to use sex as either a reward for good behavior, or withholding it as part of punishing me for bad behavior. So, whether or not I am teased or allowed an orgasm is absolutely independent of punishment.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Interesting. Right after a spanking I am not "aroused" per se, but I do become very loving and want to be with her.

      Delete
  2. After a spanking session, I'm swimming in a sea of appreciation and adoration, and yes, endorphins, all focused on my spectacular bride. But I admit it does take a little while before I'm 'good to go' sexually. On the best nights, I can thank her in a very intimate (oral) way for her disciplinary efforts.
    CrimsonKing

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks, CK. Totally understand the sea of appreciation and adoration.

      Delete
  3. Coming from the more vanilla end of your contributors Dan I tend to think it is impossible to disconnect sex mentally from spanking (me and Mrs GL don't have sex after my bottom is smacked but that is more about her being perimenaphosal). It is true from my experience that the more professional and harder the spanking the less erection is an issue, and yet anytime I read about F/M, DD or FLR chastisement that induces arousal. So when Mrs GL spanks me I have a full hard on (as we say in tbe UK) but when a disciplinarian is involved I have no such issues. My perfect world involves me getting harder and longer sessions over the knee but then making love, however I accept I am a mildly kinky romanic dreamer fool. Cheers GLM

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's interesting that you get turned on by reading about DD, but when going to a pro.

      Delete
    2. I think its the emotional connection that is the difference. Reading about couples/family spanking is reading about something I can do with someone I love (Mrs GL). When I do to a pro it matters not how considerate of my needs they are in the end I am their for a level of chastisement I can't get at home and thus it is more clinical. Does that make sence?

      Delete
    3. Yes, it does make sense. Thanks for clarifying.

      Delete
  4. My simple-minded view about sex after spanking.

    Intimate sex is wonderful, life is short, don't miss out on any due to head trips.

    ReplyDelete
  5. All spankings given here are not disciplinary. They all hurt but it depends on the infraction and implement used. Since she reads these posts frequently she has picked up several tips. She’s been giving maintenance spankings for about a year. Dev has given several where she was in a good mood before and during the session. She says it’s just a chore that needs done from time to time. Afterwards things got even more enjoyable.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I can understand how it could become chore-like from their perspective.

      Delete
  6. We go both ways, and I guess it depends on how bad I have been behaving and how my wife feels. I would say I perform oral on her the majority of the time, and I'm actually craving it after being punished. Half of the time I'm released from chastity and the other half, I stay locked as part of the punishment. These are difficult times since I'm very excited before and after a spanking and satisfying my wife.

    John

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I just read last week comments and my wife believes the same as Alan's that I'm a different person after I climax. Here’s the simple explanation: What goes up must come down—and then drop lower than it was before. That is, when we perform these highly pleasurable activities, the brain floods with dopamine. Then, when those activities stop, so does the dopamine flow.

      Moreover, those dopamine spikes (during highly rewarding activities) can result in a tamping down of the dopamine system altogether. Think of it as the brain’s effort to stay balanced.

      For some people, a similar phenomenon presents around sex—at least the kind that involves orgasm. There’s even a term for it: Post-coital tristesse (PCT), or after-sex sadness.

      Keep in mind: “sadness” or “depression” manifests in some people as irritability, perhaps especially men.

      This why my wife keeps me in chastity and when allowed a release it is usually ruined, which doesn't cause me to get irritable.

      John

      Delete
    2. I understand how it could work that way where an erotic spanking is concerned, but I definitely don't count disciplinary spankings as "highly pleasurable."

      Delete
  7. Dan
    Between last week's comments and this week's I think it is safe to say we are a very much like our views of politics. Varied, and what a joy to have a place where we can all relate and discuss our differences as well as
    what brings us together.
    When I say if Peter is aroused at the start of discipline i will milk him and then spank. It is what we do. I choose this behavior because to me I only spank for behavior that almost ended our marriage. I dont believe in intercourse after but at the same time there is a lovely state after, when Peter crawls under my arm and
    I comfort him, kiss his forehead as he drifts off to sleep and he whispers " I love you". Heaven for me!
    This is what works for us. Sex the next morning or the next night I will say is always the best !

    At the same time I love that we all can share this topic and our differences in a way that would never
    happen with friends over cocktails. Again Thanks to you and all my fellow travelers!

    anna

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi Anna. I definitely understand that "lovely state" you describe.

      Delete
  8. I have to agree with Anna. After a disciplinary paddling Dev will not ever consider sex. There must be a minimum of 24 hrs then all is good again. JR

    ReplyDelete
  9. So we evolve on this one.
    But generally we do not have sex after a punishment spanking. In fact, part of the punishment is we don't even hug afterwards till we are ready for bed. She is neutral to leaning never after a punishment and for now I asked we don't even entertain it as we work through some specific items I am being spanked for.
    We will about 25 percent of the time have sex after a reset/maintenace/preventative type spanking. These are not as hard and we hold each other afterwards...and we'll since we have privacy why not!!? Not directly related to the spanking but we both do feel closer in that moment...have not psycoanalyzed too much.
    I travel alot for work and the two days prior we have sex and spank but on differant nights. One time in a pinch we only had one night but she did not want to spank first for various reasons...so she said sex first and spank about 15 minutes after. I normally can hold still and take a hard spanking...not that night I was moving and jumping and about to lose my mind...and she was holding back. Amazing what hormones do.

    Disclaimer: this could change as we don't have any long term rules on this subject.

    ReplyDelete
  10. As ever an interesting & thought provoking topic. In our house if there is misbehaviour to be addressed then the order of events is normally that I am ordered to undress and get into position after getting the implements out, there is a long telling off, my agreement is 'sought' for the upcoming punishment which then takes place.

    She will be fully dressed, her preference is for me to be fully undressed. I am always very keen to be close and make love after - she will almost always bat away such requests with the promise of intimacy 'later or tomorrow' assuming I am very well behaved.

    It is delightfully frustrating and I am sure (although she has denied) that this is an essential party of her controlling me. Delightful in that it makes the eventual coming together (no pun!) & release exceptionally satisfying. Frustrating in that having had my punishment I am always very keen to show my love & get us back 'normal' balance.

    Occasionally she will deliver a lighter strapping by way of a 'reminder' - on those rare events we may morph into lovemaking but as ever now completely on her terms.

    I cannot imagine what being spanked after sex would be like - I am sure it would be extremely painful and instinctively feels like the wrong way around!

    TB

    ReplyDelete
  11. With many wives partially or wholly forbidding lovemaking after punishment I would love to hear from Helen and any other wife who believes lovemaking can be an important part of discipline.It is clear that there are differences of opinion on this and a topic worth exploring. As I stated earlier my wife and I disagree on this with her vote the only one that counts. We discussed it over the weekend ( again) and she elaborated her view that sex after punishment will make me associate punishment with pleasure. I countered that earlier we had ( usually) made love after a spanking and she admits that but believes that the more serious she got about discipline the less interested she was in love making. The two are separate for her. So for her the issue is closed. But she has promised to read this weeks blog although we will be traveling ,so I am hoping for some support.
    Alan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I am very much of two minds on this. On the one hand, as I've said, for us the pattern for so long has been that we have discipline and then we have sex, I would by lying if I said there wasn't a connection between the two in my mind. Though, also as noted in my post, to some extent I think sex has followed spankings simply because both happened at times kids weren't around, so it was "killing two birds with one stone," if you will. Also, as I said, after a spanking, I do crave intimacy, in much the way Anna describes, and I think that like Helen my wife gets off on the power exchange.

      All that said, I also very much understand your wife's perspective that her interest in sex after spanking diminished the more serious she got about discipline. In fact, that I *want* intimacy after a spanking could be one reason not to give it to me, i.e. if it really is disciplinary then should she be giving me something I want? I don't deny that the whole scenario might be more plainly about discipline and punishment if all prospect of sex were removed from it. I'm not suggesting that my wife do that, btw. :-) But, I would understand if that were her philosophy, and logically it makes a lot of sense.

      Delete
  12. I seem to recall this topic from before, but I'll still join in. We embrace a duality when it comes to punishment: no sex for me and maybe sex for her if the spanking gets her excited....punishment or not. It is a toss up as to how a punishment is going to affect Rosa. It can be a 'clear the air' with no ill feelings after and maybe a turn-on in-between.....or it can be serious enough where even afterwards she is still a little reluctant to engage in anything sexual. For me ......since I don't get o's frequently anyway, even under the best of circumstances, I am definitely not going to get one immediately after earning and receiving a punishment.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It does make sense that if the wife really is pissed off about something, sex is less likely to be in the picture even after the spanking.

      Delete
    2. Thanks Kd
      That difference matters in the context of this conversation.My former girlfriend was known to reach for a vibrator after a spanking while I did corner time or was just dismissed and I have read other accounts describing a similar experience. No sex can mean no sex for the punished husband while a wife imposes no such restrictions on herself.
      Alan

      Delete
  13. KD,
    Without becoming too graphic does "sex for her" involve you or exclude you?.It is a distinction with a difference
    Alan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It involves me. And by merely saying that as my answer, I don't think we've ventured into graphic territory at all.

      Delete
  14. For Andy and me, spanking and sex are our two most intimate interactions. And so it just feels natural for us for sex to follow spanking. But I certainly understand the wives who do not feel that way. They certainly are not going to be interested in sex if they believe that the pleasure received by the husband is going to distract from the punishment. Or if they think that the husband is going to be less calm and less helpful and loving. Or if they were particularly irritated with their husband when they punishing him. Or if they think that the punishment is a chore. None of these things are true for us.

    I have found that after a punishment followed by intercourse and orgasm for both of us, that we feel closer then at any other time. And that Andy is more loving, more attentive, more calm, and more obedient. In fact sometimes his behavior is just about perfect for several days after I have spanked him and we have had sex.

    I also must admit, as I have mentioned before, that I get aroused by the power exchange inherent in spanking my husband. So I personally want to have sex, whether it is oral service by my husband or intercourse. And that is the only time in our relationship where I am completely in control of the sexual interaction. At other times it is consensual and mutual. And that is another point, that we are not in an FLR relationship. And he has his areas of authority and I have mine, and so it is not a case of me dictating our sexual interaction at all times.

    I also want to mention that our religious beliefs lead us to believe that the only time Andy should ejaculate is inside of me. So we do not practice milking or ruined orgasms, as mentioned by other wives.

    If I could make one suggestion to other disciplinary wives, it might be this: If you think you want to try sex after spanking and see whether the effects are positive or negative, then discuss it with your husband. Tell him that you will be watching and that your expectation is that his behavior would be even better than his behavior after a spanking alone. And certainly that if his behavior is worse, that the sex would not continue in the future.

    I do feel passionately that following punishment with sex creates an intimacy unlike no other that I or Andy have ever experienced, and I would hope that other couples might have a similar experience.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks, Helen. Your first three sentences kind of sum up my own feelings.

      Delete
    2. You are very wise Helen. You enjoy the intimacy of spanking which is very important. We have sexual rules as well. My wife is not comfortable with oral but she is with spanking. As with you we are not in a FLR marriage.

      Delete
  15. Hi Dan,
    I expect that on this topic, my wife and I are probably a bit out of the ordinary. Of course, I really don't know what “normal” is, so I am just guessing. Considering that I am 51 and she is 10 years my junior, and considering that other than during her period, we make love at least once a day, missing only a couple of days per month, I think we are pretty sexual.

    As far as after punishment, she doesn't have any aversion or objection to us making love right after a punishment, the exercise of power turns her on quite a bit, and the times that we have made love right after punishment have left us with an unbelievable sense of intimacy. However, it happens very rarely primarily because of logistics. Since we get little quality time alone, when we do find ourselves alone for an evening or weekend, she doesn't usually want to punish me, but rather we try to enjoy the time. So punishments are generally fit into the small times here and there during the day when we know that we are going to be alone for the next hour or so.

    Maybe this will change with time, but most likely not until we are true empty-nesters.

    -ZM

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yeah, if you are doing it once a day, you probably *don't* realize what "normal" is. :-)

      Delete
  16. I am sort of leaning towards Helen's side.

    Sex for us is always preceded by me being spanked. We don't go for the disconnect that many people here have mentioned for a couple of reasons: -
    1) The spanking turns both of us on, in spite of (or maybe because of?) the pain caused to me. Initially, my wife was reluctant, but I gradually won her over to the idea that a wife hurting her husband like this is completely natural when he has committed infractions.
    2) The spanking should draw a line under things. If the wife is still feeling sore about something and is inclined to deny her husband sex as a result, the full punishment has not been given and she should continue spanking until it has. Sometimes, I have sensed that the spanking has not continued as long as it should have, so it was necessary to encourage her to continue.

    ReplyDelete
  17. Here's a possible solution. Making love afterwards is common and quite understandable. However, when it follows a disciplinary spanking, it does have a bit of a mixed message. In the case of a disciplinary spanking followed by sex, I've committed to my wife that I will be willing to take a dozen (or more, if she likes) strokes of the cane within a few minutes afterwards if she deems it necessary. Only occurred a handful of times, but it really drives the disciplinary point home to the benefit of both parties!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I have no problem with additional punishment after love-making, or even during. Back in the day, before Andy was as well trained as he is now, we had occasion for that to happen. One time he was late doing the dishes and I spanked him for it, with the clear promise that he would do the dishes as soon as we were done. But we proceeded to love making. Afterwards we were cuddling, and like many men he was getting very sleepy. I told him to go do the dishes as he had promised, and he moaned and groaned and said that he needed a nap. I immediately got up and spanked him hard and made him go do the dishes. As others have mentioned, the pain is more intense after orgasm.

      After that when we faced a similar situation, I would make him complete the chore before intercourse. After I rolled him off my lap I would have him service me orally, as frankly I could not wait. Then he would go do the chore, and if he did it well and quickly we would proceed to making love. I was quite entertained by watching him do the dishes with a raging hard-on which was bumping against the cabinet as he tried to lean over the sink!

      Now I can trust him to not engage in such shenanigans, and after a spanking and love-making he will get up and go do the chore as he has promised.

      Delete
    2. Helen,
      We are both interested in this "solution" as Wallace describes it above but may I ask how often you need to spank him today after lovemaking, not earlier before he was in your colorful phrase "hairbrush trained" but recently. I don't think it would happen with us ever but my wife thinks it would not be rare based on certain post intercourse behavior she has seen. I don't want to get into a situation where I am seen as challenging her authority ( resisting) while at the same time regular post ejaculation spankings would make lovemaking a lot less attractive. We have had a working agreement for many years that she would only administer these if I masturbated without permission and that otherwise I would never be spanked after a recent climax.Thanks for all your valuable insights
      Alan

      Delete
    3. Alan, you bring up a point that I thought about putting in the post but neglected to do so, i.e. is there a danger in linking sex to discipline that doesn't involve making discipline less effective but, rather, makes sex less attractive? Our spankings are disciplinary, and if in order to have sex I had to be spanked first, I know I would very quickly lose interest in having sex. A few years ago, I as in a Yahoo group dedicated to DD. There was one guy whose wife had, over the years, begun to link spanking and sex to such an extent that she spanked him before sex every time. And, it was plain from his comments that that he was not digging on this. Frankly, to me, it went over the line into abuse. But, even if not carried out as far as it went for that couple, I think that if the spankings being delivered really are disciplinary and not "funishment," linking DD and sex too closely could have an adverse impact on the sex and the relationship.

      Delete
    4. Alan, your post intercourse behavior is crucial in this situation. You have to do better if you want any chance of making love! As I mentioned previously, Andy's post intercourse behavior is usually exemplary. Even before he was fully hairbrush trained, it was rare that I had to spank him after love-making.

      In response to Dan's comment, I spank Andy an average of once a week and we almost always make love afterwards. We make love 4 to 5 times a week without punishment first. So at least 80% of the time, the sex occurs without discipline. Thus there is no problem with Andy thinking that he has to be punished first before getting sex.

      Earlier in our relationship, there was more punishment without sex. It basically was me who pushed for the love-making afterwards because I am so turned on by the power exchange.

      Delete
    5. Dan
      I agree with you and the example you use amounts to being punished as a pre-condition to having sex. That is not healthy and sure isn’t relationship building. As I understand Helen she allows sex after punishing him both because she is turned on by the discipline (power exchange) and he has shown remorse about his behavior However Helen is correct that my wife sometimes is displeased with my behavior and attitude after lovemaking and ejaculation But we have a long standing agreement that I will not be spanked after a physical climax unless I have masturbated in private without her permission. This works for us because it really motivates me to avoid a behavior she hates and she has limited post orgasm spankings to only that behavior. But now my wife is saying in effect that we can make love after a spanking sometimes but if we do I will be liable for a second spanking after ejaculation if she feels it necessary ( the way she puts it is there will be no limits on her authority). This is really a double edged sword for me because I want the love-making but not the possibility of punishment afterward. I may be over thinking this because I know some husbands are milked or made to masturbate before every spanking. But even strong advocate of FEMDOM like Elise Sutton advise against the practice Helen believes my behavior is the problem and may be right but I don’t want to be liable to a spanking after intercourse and I am afraid my wife is only to willing to deliver those kind of spankings
      Alan

      Delete
    6. Alan, I always want to make sure that Andy doesn't feel any resentment about punishment. It seems like you're feeling resentful even before the punishment happens! My understanding of the way to avoid resentment is to have lots of trust and lots of communication. I always make sure Andy understands why I think he needs to be punished, and he almost always agrees. It seems to me like you and your wife need to communicate more so that you know why she might possibly spank you after love making and you agree with those reasons.

      Delete
    7. Hi Helen
      This is not so much about a specific behavior although like your Andy my behavior can slip sometimes quickly and orgasm can bring on temporary moodiness. But we have communicated on this quite a bit and communication doesn’t always produce agreement. I think spanking after orgasm especially after intercourse is extreme punishment and in our relationship reserved for one behavior only. She agreed to this several years ago and it has worked for us. But now (actually for some time) she feels our agreement is a limitation on her authority and if there is any resentment it is coming from her on that issue. Basically she is saying we can make love after a punishment but if we do there will be no limit on her authority (which she feels now exists) So I can easily imagine cuddling after making love and her suddenly hearing something in my voice or attitude and sending me for her brush. So I guess I do have some resentment about that because a post orgasm spanking is not a fair or proportionate punishment for what amounts to sarcasm and moodiness. So we are communicating but we disagree. Being able to disagree openly is actually healthy so I understand her better and her point of view.
      Alan

      Delete
    8. I spanked sarcasm out of Andy a long time ago. It seems to me like you don't want to be punished for your sarcasm and moodiness. If you agree to be punished, then you need to accept what your disciplinary wife feels is appropriate. And WHEN it happens, like after love making, is irrelevant. If Andy talks to me sarcastically, he is going to get the brush as soon as possible, regardless of what has just transpired, love making or not. If you don't trust her to punish you appropriately for your sarcasm and moodiness, then I guess that's another issue. It's not really connected to love making.

      Delete
    9. Helen
      I admire your frankness and appreciate your sharing with us the wisdom and experience you have gained as a loving but firm disciplinarian. I think I need a little of that firmness from my wife right now. I actually agree with you that I am wrong to resist this and almost wish she would just grab a hold of it and say she will no longer accept any limitations on her authority. We are long past the point where I would be able to resist that or defy her. That would solve the dilemma. But I know if we open that door and post orgasm spanking becomes just another option she will use if because of its effect on me that she saw firsthand stopping cold a destructive porn and masturbation behavior. You say I don’t trust her but I do. It is just that I don’t want to be punished that way and I fear it would happen regularly even though at the same time I wish she would just assert the authority she has and make the decision that she really wants to make in the first place. I am conflicted
      Alan

      Delete
    10. Have her read what you just wrote. You wont be conflicted any more but you might be in pain.

      Delete
    11. Thank you. I know I need to do this but need to find the right moment. She is going to be angry and I am already in trouble. But it needs to be done. Andy is very fortunate to be in love with a women who is not afraid to use her authority even at difficult times. I love my wife and she is a wonderful sometimes almost magical women but there are times I need firmness from her or paralysis sets in. Wish me luck
      Alan

      Delete
  18. It all depends on why J. feels that I should be spanked or whipped. If she is angry because of the way I (mis)behaved, sex (as a "reward") may be out of the question, but if she decides to spank or whip me simply because she feels like it (and, yes, she does enjoy it!) "lovemaking" is the usual aftermath!
    L.

    ReplyDelete
  19. I have never spanked my husband after sex or felt the need to. But I sure would if he earned it. Maybe once in our time together has he put himself in danger of a second dose of my paddle and a stern warning backed him down pretty quickly. The notion that a man is immune to discipline just because he has cum is nuts. He knows if he acts up at any time his ass is mine. I also don’t forbid him to masturbate or punish him for doing it. All men masturbate sometimes and it’s silly to pretend they don’t or punish them for it. Domestic discipline as I see it is mostly about establishing firm boundaries for him and equally strong consequences if he violates those boundaries. I do allow sex occasionally after discipline but I think the more punishment is kept separate from sex the better it works in the long run
    Judy Z

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks, Judy. These thoughts echo my own. Though, I have been surprised at the extent to which enforcing some kind of orgasm control or denial seems to be a "go to" move for Disciplinary Wives. I'm not sure why they see it as an issue or why that particular aspect of control seems so attractive to them, but it does seem to be so.

      Delete
    2. While I obviously am not a disciplinary wife I think orgasm control provides a pretty straightforward way to control male behavior and probably especially appeals to woman who prefer it to frequent spanking

      Alan

      Delete
  20. Thank you. I know I need to do this but need to find the right moment. She is going to be angry and I am already in trouble. But it needs to be done. Andy is very fortunate to be in love with a women who is not afraid to use her authority even at difficult times. I love my wife and she is a wonderful sometimes almost magical women but there are times I need firmness from her or paralysis sets in. Wish me luck
    Alan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I'm happy to delete the entire string of comments if it will literally save your ass, Alan. ;-)

      Delete
    2. Too late! ( and Helen's advice and not so gentle prompting) was spot on Like you, I don't particularly enjoy the religious allusions but that lady is the real thing.
      Alan

      Delete
  21. Helen
    I am a "recovering Catholic". I know "lapsed is the proper term but recovering does it better for me. I understand your beliefs (long immersion in parochial school) and I respect them without sharing them. I missed most of the alluded exchange between you and Kd last week and so cannot express an opinion. But I see nothing wrong in discussing your DD philosophy and methods in the framework of your religious beliefs. I think evangelizing and posturing do turn off many people but I have not seen you do that. I hope you stay on this forum because you are contributing a critical thoughtful and experienced voice to the ongoing discussions. I suspect not just the males but many other wives using discipline are learning from your no nonsense approach.
    Alan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Alan: I am not sure what all the consternation is over last week's "exchange". "Exchange"? I went online to tease Dan about this week's captioned photo.....which I later did anyway via email, and when I saw his rebuke on the "normal Christian" thread, I wrote (on Sept. 18th) to HIM that I was glad I saw his rebuke before posting my joke over his caption since he seemed "feisty". I went on to suggest to him a humorous scenario based on his oft-repeated and accurate claim that Jesus rarely if ever spoke of sexuality. I joked that maybe he did and it ended up edited by the Council of Trent. Now mind you it is obvious by how I began that this entire post was directed TO DAN.

      Later I saw a short post from Helen saying my example wasn't funny. And I suppose that is a matter of opinion, but my reply to her is that I was curious as to what was so objectionable and pointed out that nothing I said was directed at her.

      So......if that's seen as some kind of major confrontation, I fear for the world.

      Delete
  22. Perhaps we can all agree, that when a couple choosers or explores DD, it is a mishmash of many ideas and influences that have colored our opinions. Anna and I came to an agreement about how I needed a reminder of what she and I agreed to several years ago. It works for us. If now and then Anna reveals details that are helpful to another couple great! If not that is fine also.
    I say all of this after being caned. That is now her choice of instruments often, but after breaking one of Anna's
    cardinal rules" NO DRIVING WHILE INTOXICATED" I deserved all 25 with that cane. I confess I was in tears
    when she stopped and as she held me, i curled up in her arms and knew I was forgiven. I write this as Anna
    bathes in a tub. She will be down in a bit and I will have her breakfast ready. She will hug me thank me and then with a sly smile tell me that after breakfast, she expects me to be ready for make up sex.
    Anna's Peter

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. We did some experimenting ourselves with her new canes. Interesting experience, which I'll save for a future post.

      Delete
  23. Friends,
    We have had a somewhat tumultuous week. Both the cause and solution seem clear to me. In this relatively small community of folks mostly committed if not dedicated to exploring female led male discipline, we have stumbled into one of the most toxic topics dividing our society: Religion (the other one is politics). Some of us are passionate about both topics, others perhaps only one, but few escape strong feeling about one or the other. I myself have been guilty about inserting politics into the dialogue because I feel passionately and deeply about it as I am sure many feel about religion. For my part I won’t do it again particularly on this forum because it simply doesn’t belong here and incites intense conflict among people who are lucky enough to share an interest in a life style ( DD) that needs and deserves all the attention we can give it without the distractions of either politics or religion. My appeal to everyone is to eschew these toxic subjects as much as you can and save them for other forums and circumstances. Our much larger purpose here is to understand and discuss loving discipline in a female centered home. Let’s avoid these things that prevent us from continuing to do so
    Alan

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Alan, well said.

      The week also illustrates something I've groused about from time to time regarding my own dissatisfaction with this blog's topical format and wide open membership. In an ideal world, I would like to have some alternative format that was less topical and more amenable to the members taking the conversation in any direction, but also much, much smaller so that such discussions were confined to people who share enough common interest and approach in their comments to make it a fun time. In other words -- a real "club." I just can't figure out any real way to do it, especially since some of the people I would want in that club--like you and ZM--post anonymously, while pretty much every potential platform (Blogger, Yahoo groups, Facebook) requires some kind of email based account formation. Facebook is, in some ways, the best platform in terms of format, but they also make it damn near impossible to post anonymously.

      Delete
    2. Hi Alan,
      You nailed it. Exactly what you said. Let's focus on that which brings us together, which on this blog is domestic discipline of males by their partners and/or female led relationships. Even those topics cover a huge swath, since there are so many aspects of it.

      A few examples (most of which we have covered one or more times:
      - How it started for you... Who initiated? Why? How?
      - What constitutes spankable offenses?
      - Who makes the rules, if they are pre-agreed-upon?
      - How and when are punishments announced?
      - How and how severely are punishments given?
      - Corner time
      - Humiliations
      - Additional/alternative punishments
      - Consent... How does it work for you?
      - Tears... When? How? How frequently? Important?
      - Sex... pre-spanking, post-spanking, delayed?
      - Fairness or lack thereof
      - Resistance, objections, excuses
      - Decision making
      - Who else knows?
      - How to encourage partner to exert control more confidently
      - Attitudes before, during, and after punishment
      - Controlling demeanor... Why do we crave it? How to project it?

      This is but a VERY small list of topics about which I could write almost endlessly without ever mentioning my faith or political affiliation! Though and perhaps more importantly BECAUSE I have strong feelings and opinions about faith and politics, I try to avoid writing much about them.

      Dan, thank you for your kind comment. Though I do post anonymously, if needed I would of course take the 3 minutes to create a Blogger (or whatever platform) account since this blog has been and continues to be a tremendous resource for me. I have learned so much about myself from other's insightful comments as we journey together! THANK YOU Dan for all you do to facilitate and at times moderate our discussion!

      -ZM

      P.S. Of all platforms, I trust Facebook the least, especially since this topic is somewhat sensitive.

      Delete
    3. I generally agree on Facebook, though for slightly different reasons. First, as I said, they make it damn near impossible to open an account anonymously or to post anonymously. They sometimes ask you to submit a photo to prove who you are when opening the account, and if you sign on through Tor or a VPN, they will demand you verify your identity and almost instantly shut down the account. They also capriciously shut down "adult content." I'm fine with them keeping Facebook porn free. But, they just don't seem to have any standards for how they police that. I do like the fact that anyone can post any time after accepted into a group, and that you can make the group's private, but on balance, their hostility to privacy and anonymity just aren't workable.

      The challenge with the topics is that while the list *seems* large, after three or four years it's really not. Because the readers tend to cycle in and out, it may seem fresh to some of them, but for the blog administrator, it can become pretty tedious. But, that's exactly what has me thinking harder again about a "club"-focused platform of some sort, or a semi-private blog that is less topical. Not necessarily meaning this blog goes away. But, rather, an alternative platform in which the conversations can be more personal, more focused on the relationship issues, or work challenges, etc. Anyway, just kind of random noodling at this point . . .

      Delete
  24. Dan, I applaud your 'chairing' skills on your blog, given the propensity of many of the contributors try to take the discussion off into many unrelated areas! But equally I applaud your almost journalistic abilities to make and maintain multiple clear opinions! Well done!

    As I was raised Catholic & educated by 'men of the cloth' I am always fascinated by the introduction of religion into any discussion about crime, punishment and more recently DD. Not from a doctrinal perspective but more to acknowledge role that 'guilt' plays in all of these areas. Guilt, being made accountable for, cleaning the slate - all concepts that this community are very familiar with and use to explore creating better lives and relationships. As a youngster I had a strong sense of right & wrong, ethics and morals instilled in me (often ironically emphasised with corporal punishment). Guilt, often a delicious emotion, has been a constant barometer for me and the discovery of adult DD has allowed me to more fully explore the links between my behaviours and being held accountable. This has generally been very positive for my mental & emotional well-being and for my relationship (and I often see that theme in this blog and others).

    These feelings for me (and I suspect for many other people) have their roots in my religious biased upbringing and so have to be taking into account in any attempt at understanding motivations, desire to be held accountable and willingness to enter & maintain a DD relationship.

    But I agree that almost any contribution that opens with "As a Christian ..." loses my attention as I am more interested in what has influenced people to be how they are rather than the use of a set of beliefs to justify how they are or behave if that makes sense.

    TB

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Hi TB. These are really helpful thoughts. I do think that many of the men who are into DD have a bigger than normal need for accountability and to pay some kind of real "penance" when they step outside the lines, regardless of what authority (legal, family, religious) drew those boundaries. I wouldn't be surprised if early exposure to any religion that emphasizes sin, guilt, penance, etc. might instill some of the mindset that makes DD attractive later in life.

      Though, there may be a chicken or the egg problem at work. Does exposure to religions that focus on punishment and accountability increase the odds someone will gravitate to DD later in life, or does the same personality type gravitate to both DD and religion? It's hard for me to say. I definitely do seem to have a stronger than normal need to be held accountable, and it was that aspect of DD that was so compelling to me when I first discovered it. But, whether that need was innate, or was put in place by early exposure to "fire and brimstone" religious imagery is hard to say.

      Delete
  25. So last time I checked this thread there were about 40 comments...now over 80. Imagine my thoughts of...what the??
    However, I found the discussion interesting. I am reluctant to add too much to the conversation since I am new and for respect of the blog owner but I have a few observations.

    When considering "Christianity" in the conversation you find issues when you don't define things. For example: There is a difference between those who practice DD because of their faith (CDD) and those who have faith and practice DD. The first group has to argue why/how the Christian faith fits (which they usually will take their beliefs and read into an interpretation - not look at their faith and build up from there). The second group only needs to make sure the practice and the details (boundaries) don't conflict with their faith (most of the DD community who are Christian). As soon as these groups have cross talk without recognizing this (or where they fit themselves) then issues happened fast. (For a non-DD example discuss "Salvation" with a Catholic and a protestant and realize they define the term different and cannot even talk about it till they define it).

    I take issue with most CDD arguments as not being complete or founded in faith but tweaking faith to fit the lifestyle (not the other way around). I also observe that most people "offended" or feel "judged" about this subject and how they practice have lingering doubts of it from neo-puritan backgrounds many US Christians were raised in. Even when judgement is not intended it is taken that way.

    I will say the only sect/branch of Christianity that has flushed out behavior, the body, and sexuality in a complete fashion is the catholic church (Helan has a lot to offer). But you must look at the Theology of the Body (as they call it) holistically and not a set of rules (which Helen comes off as)...that will make you hate it and not love it. See below for a way to contact me privately if you wish to discuss further on that subject.

    I will post no further items about this here. I do have a blog post here ( https://www.spankingneeds.com/board/index.php?/blogs/entry/8-upon-request-a-discussion-of-cdd-and-christianity/ ) if you are interested in the only argument I can make for CDD (actually practicing DD because your faith tells you). I will respond to comments or PMs on that website...but read their rules first since they have them too.


    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks. These are helpful distinction. Seems like there may actually be a three-way distinction among those who are practicing Christians and practicing DD.

      -- Those who practice DD "because of" their faith. Almost everyone I have engaged with who is in this camp is in a M/f dynamic. Though, see this, which I distributed some time back: http://www.ernestlmartin.com/marriage.htm.
      -- Those who practice DD in spite of their faith and/or believe there may be significant tension between the two.
      -- Those who practice DD and don't see any tension between it and their faith or just don't think their religion speaks to DD one way or another.

      Delete
    2. I would take issue with the assumption it is more m/f. I found many (not all) of those dynamics concerning...the "christian" justification is flimsy. But hey we will never since most of the community is likley silent and we don't really know how many.
      Your three distinctions are interesting and worth consideration.

      Delete
    3. Yes, though to be clear, while I think anytime religion is used to justify any kind of physical punishment, there should be cause for concern, that doesn't mean all those relationships are abusive. I think many women on the receiving end in DD relationships share the same motivations that I have --some deep need for accountability, penance, boundaries, etc. In other words, they WANT discipline, and happen to find a justification for it in their faith. The concern enters in if they do NOT really want that lifestyle but feel it is some kind of directive from God, or if their husband thinks so and imposes it even though she really isn't into it.

      Delete
  26. Another perspective, somewhat humorous many years later . I made fun of Sylvia’s
    mother’s deeply help religious convictions . She calmly explained how insensitive I was , then gave me as she promised a spanking I would never forget.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's funny how everything seems humorous . . . in retrospect! But, you're right, that is a pretty humorous spin given this week's conflagration.

      Delete
  27. Dan

    You make me smile! What a SAINT!!!

    anna

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If I'm a saint, man is the Catholic church in trouble! ;-)

      Delete
  28. Is it not already?

    anna

    ReplyDelete
  29. To your original question we rarely have sex after a punishment spanking, occasionally my wife will want something from me. The only exception is when I suffer through a spanking weekend which lasts from Friday night until Monday morning, this has me bottomless the whole time and is the closest we come to my being totally submissive. I'll get spanked because she feels like it or she'll ask me to spank her sometimes which almost always leads to sex.

    ReplyDelete

This blog is a curated resource for those genuinely and positively interested in DD and FLR lifestyles. Comments that are rude, uncivil, inconsistent with the blog's theme or off-topic may not be posted or may be removed.