Saturday, May 18, 2024

The Club - Meeting 477 - Domestic Discipline and BDSM

“Men always remember a woman who caused them concern and uneasiness.” —  Coco Chanel

 

Hello all.  Welcome back to the Disciplinary Couples Club.  Our weekly meeting of men and women who are in, or interested in being in, Domestic Discipline and/or Female Led (FLR) relationships.

 

Once again, before we get started, I would like to extend a specific invitation to our female readers to move from “lurker” to “commenter” status. We miss having you around.

 

I hope you all had a great week.  Mine again felt important with respect to Anne slowly getting more and more comfortable with exercising a new level of strictness. 

 

As is far too often the case, I went out with a friend and had too many beers. As is even more often the case, after I got home I decided it was a fine night to watch movies until late enough that it virtually guaranteed a bad morning.  But, this time, instead of letting that happen, Anne walked into my home office less than an hour after our normal bedtime and told me it was time to get wrap it up and get ready for bed.

 

Now, in the past, that kind of order often led to some resentment and outward shows of resistance.  This time, however, I complied without arguing, which is notable in and of itself.  The next morning, I was actually feeling a little proud of myself for this somewhat atypical instance of obedience in that particular context, but Anne greeted me in the kitchen with, “I guess you know what will be happening to you this afternoon?" 

 

I objected, “But, I obeyed when you told me to come to bed last night.”  Her response? “That's why you are getting one spanking instead of two.”

 


 

This all follows on a recent conversation we had; one that began while I was over her knee.  She was lecturing me during short breaks between volleys of swats and asked—somewhat rhetorically—“You’ve been spanked for this before. Do I just need to spank you more often to get through to you?”  Given that she was at that very moment wearing out my bottom with her bath brush, I found it difficult to agree, so I blurted out something very equivocal, like “Maybe, Ma’am.” 

 

Later, in bed, I was more honest, admitting candidly that there are things that DD hasn’t been that effective at eradicating and, yes, I think frequency and consistency, or lack thereof, are part of the problem.  It wasn’t an easy thing to admit, knowing that it was the equivalent of affirmatively asking for her to spank me more often. But, I also felt like her rhetorical question was right on the money regarding aspects of our dynamic that aren’t where they should be if actual, longer-term behavior change is the goal.

 

 

But, more on that in a later post.

 

Things were a little slow here on the blog last week, but we did get a few interesting responses to Alan’s topic about intimacy from DD.  I especially liked this from TB:

 

There is no question for me that spanking creates increased intimacy but it is in many ways an unbalanced intimacy in that I am fully exposed physically & emotionally. My journals, mostly daily, are very open. I am obviously very exposed during spanking and I almost always feel ‘reset’ after. It is very much ‘me focussed time’ and my wife is very happy & supportive of this element of our relationship. She has her, completely different needs which often create a similar intimacy.

 

Something about his “unbalanced intimacy” characterization seems spot on.

 

Alan summarized the responses to the topic as a whole this way:

 

“The comments above are especially rich in their resonance to my spanking-related sense of intimacy. Searching for a phrase or two that sums it up, I think vulnerability and openness come close: Spanking reduces or removes my ego and defensiveness, which otherwise gets in the way of connecting on a deep level with her.

 

As someone pointed out, there is an imbalance in this in the sense that I am the one who gets taken down (literally, in the case of my pants), and she is in control. But I think my openness brought about by being spanked acts to allow her to also open up, and intimacy between us can be the result.”

 

Although I don’t feel a sense of intimacy immediately before or during a spanking, I get what he means about how a spanking reduces or removes ego and defensiveness, which in turn leads to more open and fully honest conversations about needs and desires.

 

Also, in the spirit of welcoming more women to the discussion, I want to think Norton’s partner, A.J., for participating.  She provided a nice summary of benefits she and Norton get from DD respectively, many of which would be generally applicable to couples in these relationships:

 

My experience is that DD enhances intimacy in a variety of ways. For Norton, it grounds him, provides a form of reparenting or balances and compensates for his experiences during childhood. The focused loving attention, clear direct communication, clear consequences, and strong physical sensation of spanking, sometimes being held and reassured afterward, are in direct contrast to his childhood. It helps with his PTSD. This is a way to re-set his nervous system, and it works to ground him. For me, it challenges and compels me to consciously resist my familial and cultural conditioning by taking risks, asserting myself clearly, directly, and physically, and centering my experience and needs. I also really need to attend to whether or not I'm in the state of mind and at an energy level that allows me to be fully present for the encounter. We spend time talking about our feelings and observations as part of our DD in preparation for Discipline or maintenance spanking. The focused time we set aside for our regular sessions creates consistency, builds trust, and so fosters intimacy, sometimes without spanking, usually with.

 

With that recap, let’s move on to one of the other topics you all suggested a couple of weeks ago.  Antonio had this suggestion:

 

“I would be interested to know for how many couples DD goes beyond spanking and uses other avenues. I know our DD grew out of a BDSM situation so there are other things used as discipline in our relationship that others may not use. I would be curious to know about the different flavors of DD others have.”

 

Al followed up with:

 

“The discussion of DD as related to BDSM is certainly an idea. Did any of us come to DD from BDSM? Or did instituting DD lead to an exploration of other areas of BDSM, Femdom in particular (pegging, butt plugs, enemas, chastity devices, feminization, cuckolding)? However - Dan may not want to go there - it does venture outside the focus of his blog and perhaps risks casting DD unfavorably. Back in the day, when the DWC was a real club with a private Yahoo group, Aunt Kay absolutely did not allow any discussion of sex or BDSM in the group - and if we had all been local instead of virtual, she probably would have spanked anyone who brought it up."

 

Although I have said that this blog isn’t about Femdom or BDSM, I am not quite as rigid about the separation as it sounds like Aunt Kay was.  (As an aside, Al’s reference to Aunt Kay spanking the other men is something I have to admit I can’t help but feeling some regret at never experiencing.  Not because I think it would be fundamentally different from what Anne delivered but because I know it did happen, and her husband Jerry has even told me that if we had ever met in person, it almost certainly would have happened.  She had such a profound impact (no pun intended) on my life, I can’t help but think I missed something by not making that in-person connection, even if it would have ended quite painfully.)

 

I should say in advance, although I believe that DD and BDSM are very different things, I do think they have overlapping practices that make it hard sometimes to distinguish between the two.  Al’s comment indicates Aunt Kay lumped sex and BDSM together, and I do think the sexual context is different in DD and BDSM, respectively.  It’s not that I don’t think DD has strong erotic undertones, but I think they are undertones, while with BDSM they are almost the whole ballgame.  I see sexual energy and eroticism as a byproduct of DD, or sometimes a means that leads to other goals.  On the other hand, in a sense BDSM is sex, regardless of whether it culminates in intercourse.

 

I also believe the underlying motivations are very different.  I’ve always believed that if there is little or no emphasis on accountability, penance, and behavior modification, then whatever the couple is doing isn’t really DD. The word discipline in DD inherently defines and sets boundaries on the lifestyle is about. BDSM, on other hand, may have no behavioral modification or real punishment element.  That’s not to say that some BDSM practices might not be linked to things like accountability and penance, but those are not inherent in and necessary to BDSM in the way they are part and parcel of DD.

 

I also think there is an element of fantasy and intentional exploration of something “unreal” in BDSM that is almost the opposite of DD.  In fact, I once saw a comment from someone who was into comparing the two: “They do scenes.  We do life.”

 

 

With that long introduction, let’s talk about the topic of BDSM as suggested by Antonio and expanded upon by Al. 

 

Did you come to DD from BDSM?  Or, perhaps it was the other way around and you started with DD but later added BDSM elements?

 

Or, maybe you don’t think there are any overlaps between DD as you practice it and BDSM as you conceive of it?

 

For us, I guess you could say that we very briefly experimented with BDSM, though I didn’t label it that way at the time.  As I have said many times before, I discovered adult spanking via a segment on the old HBO series Real Sex. I don’t recall much about how I introduced it to Anne, but shortly after seeing it I bought a flimsy leather paddle at an adult “novelty” store. Our experiments didn’t last long, but it all reduced to a kind of foreplay, with scenes in which she pretended to be punishing me, but there was nothing “real” about it.  That phase was so short and so surface-level that I don’t really think about it as the beginning point for our DD, except in the limited sense that I’m sure that Real Sex segment was what stimulated enough interest on my part that I explored the subject of F/m spanking on the internet and stumbled on the DWC.

 

How about some of the specific practices Al associates with BDSM?  I’ll go through each of them and comment on whether it’s ever been a “thing” for us.

 


Pegging and butt plugs?  Am I wrong in believing that those are right up there with spanking in the extent to which they are pretty commonly experimented with among even fairly vanilla couples?  It’s something we tried a few times, several years ago.  The fact that we don’t today isn’t, I think, because either of us had an aversion to it.  It was just one of those kinky experiments that may not have generated enough interest to keep it up. That said, Anne has gained a huge amount of confidence in the intervening years, and I wonder whether she would be more dominant and aggressive with a strap-on today, such that it might feel like real punishment and/or a conscious means of establishing the hierarchy with her on top.

 


Enemas?  Not something we’ve ever done for sexual or disciplinary purposes.

 

Chastity devices?  This has never been my thing, though I do get the impression that they have some appeal for many wives who start exploring the FLR side of a disciplinary relationship. But, I don’t have many examples to point to in support of that proposition.

 


Feminization? This isn’t something Anne has shown any interest in, and my own interest is pretty limited.  At one point, I bought some male “panties,” which I wore not so much for sexual stimulation as because they kept my mind very focused on my ass, either before a spanking or after.  To me, it was almost like another kind of penance or accountability, which kept my mind on the prospect of a spanking or the after-effects of one.  Wearing them also was embarrassing enough--even though I was the only one who saw me in them--that it added some additional humbling to the experience.

 


Cuckolding and hot-wifing?  Anne has always had a problem with bringing third-parties into the relationship in any sexual way.  She admits to being very jealous by nature.  There are times that I find the concept of a “hot wife” or cuckolding relationship attractive, but mostly only as a fantasy.  I don’t think I’m as jealous as Anne, but I have a feeling that if anything like that ever became a reality, I would have a very hard time handling her having a relationship with another man. Though, perhaps interestingly, I don't find the prospect of her spanking another man disturbing at all.


As I said, while I don't think it would ever happen, I do sometimes fantasize about it or about scenarios that combine cuckolding and DD.  I also have some ongoing fantasies about Anne forcing a cuckolding relationship on me or ordering me to take a spanking from another man. I’m very confident it’s nothing we will ever explore in reality, but given how deeply rooted the idea of imposed discipline is in my DD motivations, I don’t think it’s surprising that having a M/m dynamic imposed on me has some theoretical appeal.

 

I know this subject is probably embarrassing for many of us, but since none of us are using our real identities, I hope you will feel free to open up a bit.  And, please, no judgey comments.

I’ll close with this somewhat funny coincidence, in light of this week’s topic.  As many of you know, I’m big into motorcycles.  A while back, I bought a collection of old editions of a magazine that was once popular in the biker community. Kind of a biker Penthouse, with pictorials of customized bikes adorned with semi-naked women.  Given the “macho” biker ethos, it was about the last place I expected to find a very Femdom-ish reference, yet here was this motorcycle advertisement on the back cover:

 

 

Have a great week.

53 comments:

  1. Interesting topic Dan, I have no BDSM vibes at all in our relationship. I’ve never liked the idea of leather, whips, chain, ect. I don’t like to experience pain for the sake of pain and our thing is the complete opposite of BDSM. I have been restrained a few times during a strapping. I’m sure we have all been tied up once or twice in our time. As far as the other topics, pegging or butt plugs. My wife has never pegged me per se with a strap on. A few times she has used her dildo lightly on me. A few times she’s anally massaged me while playing with me. I’ve thought a few times about pegging and discipline but we never pursued it. Would I be open to it? Probably not, as there could be complications that go along with it. I will say prostate massages while orgasming are on a different level. I have zero desire for an enema. Punishment or not.
    As far as feminization goes, I would wear a pair of my wife’s panties if she ordered me too around the house. I have jokingly put a pair on my head before. I have had fantasies about being spanked by my wife in front of her best friend. Her friends husband can use a good thrashing.i think it would improve their relationship. As far as cuck holding sexually and hot wifing. We have zero desire for that. As I have zero desire to see my wife spank another man. We are close in our values and morals. I couldn’t bring anyone else into our thing. As far as being locked in a cage. I’m on the fence about this. I thought long and hard about asking my wife if she would be interested in this. The problem I had was it was BDSM related and my job itself would pose a problem wearing this daily. It would then defeat the purpose just to wear it on the weekend. I like the idea of being caged. I believe it would ensure punishment is for punishment. Being locked, there is nothing erotic about the thrashing you are about to receive. You cannot get an erection. It is much too painful. Being locked probably could help a bunch of us out.
    T


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    1. "I’ve never liked the idea of leather, whips, chain, etc." Yeah, that look has never appealed to me either.

      "Her friend's husband can use a good thrashing.i think it would improve their relationship." I'm usually not someone who cares much about whether DD expands as a cultural thing, and I kind of like it being an "exclusive club" of sorts. But, I do sometimes wish I was open enough to let friends who clearly could use it know about it. I had a friend for a long time who severely needed some boundaries. Looking back, I wish I would have brought it up to him, even if he rejected it. That was many years ago, and I really don't know whether I've grown enough that today I would feel OK raising it with someone like him.

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  2. Dan, it is safe to say that our spanking roots are not in BDSM. I love seeing my wife in lingerie and she has some nice pieces, but none of it is in leather or anything even close to that style. It just isn't something that either of us fantasizes about. Whips and bondage would be a complete nonstarter in our bedroom.

    For me, spanking is more about discipline being carried out by a woman who has her life together and knows how to be stern with me when my own life isn't so together. We don't enter into real role playing, but there is a distinctly maternal feel when she is dealing with me. It also helps that I am married to an elementary school teacher, as she has the look and demeanor that goes with that position.

    Neither of us has any interest in anal play, so that isn't part of the picture. I have to confess that for me, putting on a pair of panties could be a turn on, especially before going over my wife's knee. The shaming would be an attraction for me, but not at all for Beth, so I don't go there.

    Withholding sex after a spanking is a power thing for Beth and reinforces that I still have to work my way back into her good graces.

    It's uncomfortable talking about the roots of my desire to be a spanked husband, but I'm fortunate to have a patient and non-judgmental wife. I am a very guarded person and this openness has been a real revelation for me.
    Kevin

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    1. Our relationship dynamic is a lot like your second paragraph.

      "It's uncomfortable talking about the roots of my desire to be a spanked husband, but I'm fortunate to have a patient and non-judgmental wife." For me, it's not so much uncomfortable as that I don't always have a lot of visibility into those roots.

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  3. Because BDSM includes such a wide array of sexual interests, there are usually a few things most of us would be interested in trying, and a whole lot we would want nothing to do with. Domestic Discipline covers a much narrower range of activities, and the main goal is changing behavior, as opposed to explisit sexual pleasure. However, I definitely do get a strong sexual experience through spanking, and F/M spanking is a fundamental part of my sexual makeup. We may have a fantasy of what a disciplinary spanking will be like, but it is often quite a shock to finally experience one, so we try to avoid getting them. DD includes much more real life reality, and can have a very maternal vibe, which BDSM usually does not. Most of us want our wives to hold us accountable and be consistent and strict. There are some other punishments included in DD, such as corner time and line writing, but spanking is far and away the main event. It seems there is some crossover between DD and BDSM, in that both include dominance and submission. There are a few things we have tried that would fall into the BDSM category. It is embarrassing to be wearing panties, and I have enjoyed being told to put them on, especially when ordered in the corner before a spanking. Also, is hard to forget you have them on. The same is true for wearing a butt plug, and we have had some fun with that. I did finally buy a remote control vibrating one that was big enough to not fall out. Sometimes she will have me be her sissy maid to do housework, wearing only panties and an apron. That is about the extent of BDSM activity we have explored, and we have no interest in the any of the other stuff. Sometimes I will spank her , and do some role play with me being dominant. Unlike our DD, it is only for her pleasure, though I also enjoy it. She has no desire to be held accountable, like I do. It is an appealing idea to me for her to try a strap on, but she isn't interested, so it probably won't happen. Whatever we do, she needs to enjoy it also. I really appreciate her ongoing consistency with spanking me for stress reduction and occassional discipline. It has made a huge difference in my life.

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    1. "It is embarrassing to be wearing panties, and I have enjoyed being told to put them on, especially when ordered in the corner before a spanking. Also, is hard to forget you have them on."

      That was my experience with the "pouch panties."

      Since I was wearing them either when I knew I was going to receive a spanking soon or had recently received one, they definitely kept me more focused on that part of my anatomy. The fact that I never really brought them up with Anne or exhibited them to her while wearing them demonstrates how embarrassing I find them. (Though, I'm very confident she knows I have them.)

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    2. Feminization as part of the dynamic doesn’t appeal to either of us. But somewhat paradoxically, my wearing her panties does in certain contexts, mainly as ordered after a serious spanking for a set number of days (usually three, to be hand washed every day until she gives explicit permission to wear my own shorts again.

      Wearing her panties does produce some humbling because she is emphasizing that my behavior has cost me the privilege of wearing male underwear until she decides differently -and putting them on and taking them off every day is a sharp reminder that I was spanked and why. For us, I think it is effective because she doesn’t use it often, and the duration of panty-wearing is never very long.

      But I don’t feel women are in any way diminished by wearing panties, so why does being ordered by my wife to do it have a disciplinary effect? It is probably because she stresses that my failure to behave has cost me the privilege of wearing male underwear. I internalize that as both a reinforcement of the spanking and a message from her that she wants to see “adult” behavior from me; I know I do think when wearing her panties that I am owning back her approval and the right to wear male underwear.

      Alan

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    3. That actually makes sense to me, because I didn't really feel like I was "feminizing" when wearing pouch panties. They were very uncomfortable, and it felt more like an additional physical punishment than some kind of gender ID switching.

      I don't think either gender is necessarily "diminished" by wearing clothing associated with the other gender. It's more like, the status quo is being shaken up, perhaps involuntarily, and maybe in a way that is so outside societal conventions that it is unsettling to be subject to it. I doubt my wife would like it she were told she couldn't wear anything but boxers, Levis, polo shirts and combat boots for a week.

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    4. “ It's more like, the status quo is being shaken up, perhaps involuntarily, and maybe in a way that is so outside societal conventions that it is unsettling to be subject to it”

      This nails it. Feminization practices such as made-to-wear panties as part of discipline provide tangible evidence of the power shift happening, as in “You wear the panties, and I am the one who takes those panties down.” It would be nice to have the female perspective on this

      Alan

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    5. Right, Alan. It's evidence of the power shift. Very similar to the way you described pegging. Also, both practices are transgressive (though probably much less so today than just a few years ago), which to me means they put you uncomfortably outside societal expectations. And, while I do think cross-dressing and trans acceptance might make panty-wearing more common today, it's still nowhere close to the norm, at least based on my informal survey of the guys dressing in my gym. I think one time I have seen a guy in there wearing even a male thong-like thing, and that definitely got some stares. Though, my gym does trend toward older, professional, suburban men.

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  4. PEGGING -
    I am unsure that pegging is an integral part of BDSM. But based on sex toy marketing and random discussions on the internet, I suspect that pegging is something many couples try. My wife has a strap-on (two), and she has used it, but not lately and not often; it is an occasional thing for us. Given our DD dynamic, it has been a disciplinary tool ( I note this only because it seems likely that couples practice pegging outside any disciplinary purpose, too. In fact, it is probably used not mainly as discipline, although to me, there is an inherent humbling effect in it for males.)

    As a discipline, it is a unique experience for me: there is no real pain, no experience of being punished, no chores or duties to perform, and no real embarrassment. But it does have a deep and lasting effect on our power balance. It takes me down “a peg” (pun intended) And illustrates her control very physically. But I don’t feel I am being punished as much as she is mastering me, teaching me obedience, and demonstrating her power – but not in a severe or punitive way, but very quietly, confidently, and lovingly.

    When she did it, she considered it discipline because of its effect on my attitude and behavior afterward, and I still do think it is discipline. But it is discipline without punishment. And I won’t even try to explain the contradiction in that.

    Alan

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    1. "But I don’t feel I am being punished as much as she is mastering me, teaching me obedience, and demonstrating her power – but not in a severe or punitive way, but very quietly, confidently, and lovingly."

      Alan, it has been many years since we tried pegging. At that time, I think Anne was a lot less confident in the lead role than she is today. This last year (her second since retirement), she has *really* started stepping up in confidence and control. Back then, I don't think she had the confidence to "master me" and "teach me obedience", and I probably had too many ego barriers, to get to the dynamic you are describing, but I think we might be there now.

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  5. We originally met online through a spanking website before meeting online was a thing. This expanded into a broader BDSM lifestyle before we adopted DD, so I guess you could say that to some extent at least, BDSM led to DD. Unfortunately we discovered the DWC too late, probably sometime around 2001. We read about recent gatherings they had had and expressed interest in joining the next one - but it never happened. We did go to get-togethers of a local spanking group for some time, but it was not DD-focused. However we do therefore have some experience of spanking with other people, albeit quite a long time ago. I find the dynamic possibilities of others in a DD context interesting, whether I’m being spanked by someone else (at my wife’s direction) or seeing her spanking someone else, and would certainly be up for trying it if the opportunity arose. We really haven’t done much in the BDSM sphere for some years but did experiment with various types of activity. She had always liked using a strap-on but it really doesn’t work for me, I find it a very painful experience - and not remotely in a good way. We had more success with some bondage and general submission. We did briefly dabble in feminization but quickly abandoned it. While I admit I find it an emotionally interesting idea, we came to the conclusion that the basic concept of feminization was flawed in that if it somehow reduces a man by making him simulate a woman in clothing or whatever, then that implies that women are implicitly inferior to men which is firstly directly at odds with the whole idea of F/m BDSM and secondly, now that we’ve finally reached a point in society where women are no longer viewed as generally subservient to men, I think the last thing we want to do is anything that perpetuates the older attitude. TG

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    1. I think we discovered the DWC around 2003 or 2004. I think it was still minimally going back then, but winding way down. I really do regret that we didn't find it earlier, but it's also the case that I was so paranoid about my anonymity back then that I probably would not have taken advantage of it anyway.

      I'm not as convinced that feminization inherently diminishes women. See my comments to Alan above. But, I do see how it could be taken that way.

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  6. Although my fascination with the idea of F/M DD began at puberty - almost certainly the result of an otk hairbrushing by an attractive aunt a year or two earlier - I never really gave much thought to the other aspects of F/M discipline (or femdom). None of these other aspects that Dan quoted from the list I posted a couple of weeks ago seemed to have any innate appeal. This began to change somewhat when I began to read the numerous spanking stories that began to appear when the public Internet went online in then 90’s. A number of these stories incorporated various combinations of these alternative disciplinary elements into the story – and I found a bit of fascination with some of them as they related to spanking.

    While the first couple of spankings that my wife administered were sexually playful in nature – the result of us swapping fantasies over too much wine one evening when the kids were spending the night with friends – the very next day it became apparent that she was very fascinated with the idea of spanking me. So, I took the leap of faith to show her the DWC website – and thus began our DWC lifestyle 20+ years ago.

    As my wife did her own reading on this lifestyle she also encountered these other ideas – primarily on the Elise Sutton site, a fairly major femdom site of the time that incorporated F/M DD, FLR, the theme of female superiority into a femdom lifestyle philosophy of “loving female authority” that, in practice, incorporated the complete gamut of practices that we are discussing. This led to our discussing what, if any, of these practices that we should consider as part of our F/M DD lifestyle.

    And we discovered that we were mostly on the same page. Neither of had any interest at all in chastity devices or orgasm control – and neither of us had any real interest in feminization. Although neither of were taken with the classic BDSM stereotype of whips, chains, and leather, my wife did find the idea of bondage somewhat fascinating – but I have a complete aversion to being restrained in any way (for whatever reason) which my wife respected, so that was also out of the picture. (Apparently I have such an aversion that I realized that I unconsciously did not even include it in the list of practices that I came up with).

    Susan did find that she had a pronounced fascination with the idea of “anal discipline” – and, while wary, I was tentatively receptive to the idea. And was soon being pegged fairly regularly with a variety of different strap-on dildos – as well as being required to have a butt plug inserted for disciplinary purposes – almost always after a spanking. “Disciplinary enemas” have also been used on occasion – given otk from an old fashioned “big red bag” with an extra large tip. She employed these various anal disciplines quite often in the beginning. They are much less frequent now – but still utilized on occasion.

    Alan’s previous post in this thread on pegging sums up the power exchange dynamic quite nicely. While (with caution), pegging is not painful, it is a very humbling experience – and, in that sense, similar in dynamic to being spanked. Both result in a changed attitude – especially so as a spanking almost always precedes the pegging in our marriage.

    --al


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    1. "This began to change somewhat when I began to read the numerous spanking stories that began to appear when the public Internet went online in the 90’s. A number of these stories incorporated various combinations of these alternative disciplinary elements into the story – and I found a bit of fascination with some of them as they related to spanking."

      I remember some of the old Usenet stories, though I discovered them at about the time they were being supplanted by actual internet content like the DWC.

      I also think a lot of my exposure to various kinks was through publications like Penthouse's "Variations." I remember a few spanking letters, but for some reason I recall quite a few letters and stories that focused on enemas, including enemas used for punishment.

      I don't recall the Elise Sutton website, but I feel like we are moving closer and closer to a broader "life philosophy" of "loving female authority" as you describe it, after close to two decades of a much narrower DD focus.

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    2. "Loving female authority" was actually Ms. Sutton's "catch phrase" for her vision of the FLR lifestyle. She has several books available on Amazon (although I was not able to quickly determine if she is still alive) and at least some of her website has been archived on Scribd. A Google search of "Elise Sutton" and "femdom" should take you to the Scribd archive of her site - for any who may be interested. --al

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    3. Yes, Ms. Sutton's website had a lot of material, mostly dealing with various levels of FLR's, ranging from very mild to extreme FemDom.

      She slowly wound down her website and magazine publishing through the mid 20-teens, finally closing her two (mirrored) websites in late 2019.

      I remember reading most of her website, particularly the "Real Life Experiences" and "Question and Answer" forums (updated monthly) between roughly 2000 and 2010. I was reading Ms. Sutton's website in parallel to Aunt Kay's DWC website. It was around the start of this period that I met my wife, and I decided that I was personally much more "attuned" to Aunt Kay's perspective, and that my wife might be most open to learning about and accepting a more "real" and "performance-improvement-based" lifestyle between us.

      It appeared that around 2011-2012, Ms. Sutton may have begun experiencing other "life events" that significantly limited her participation (and updating) of the websites. Around 2012, Ms. Sutton began recycling her older "Real Life Experiences" and "Q&A" columns from eight years earlier (2004). She continued this practice for the next seven years until the website closed. (All "Real Life Experience" and "Q&A" columns between 2013 and 2019 were simply "recycled/relabeled copies" of columns from eight years previously.

      All of her material is still available on the Internet Archive.

      The last main entry page is located at:

      web.archive.org/web/2019/elisesutton.homestead.com/main.html

      The last "Real Life Experiences" and "QA" columns are located at:

      web.archive.org/web/2019/elisesutton.homestead.com/realstories.html

      and,

      web.archive.org/web/2019/elisesutton.homestead.com/QuestionForum.html

      By using the Internet Archive's "year slider" to examine those pages from previous years, going back to ca. 2001, you can access the fresh content for each month between 2001 and 2012 -- quite a bit of material, and therefrom learn of Ms. Sutton's philosophy, as reflected in her comments and answers to men's and women's submissions to those columns.

      (As it turned out, after a few years, my wife became self-interested in more of FemDom activities of Ms. Sutton than I initially believed possible, provided they resulted in (1) behavioral improvements on my part, and (2) an easier and more pleasurable life for herself. Eroticism and sexual adventurism for myself was never among my wife's goals.)

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    4. Donn - thanks for the additional info! I recall reading the sections you mention as well on occasion. I read it regularly for a while - maybe a year or two in the early 2000's - but it got repetitive after a bit and eventually it just faded from my immediate interest. I recall looking a couple of years ago to see if it was still there - and noting that it was not - wondered what happened. I thought perhaps she might have passed away. Do you know if she still alive now? (Just curious)....
      --al

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  7. We've done a lot of traditional BDSM: tying hands, blindfolding, spanking for fun, giving commands. We would, and still do, go both ways with that. Our practice of discipline spanking grew out of bedroom spanking. I suppose we are like many in that the bedroom is both an escape from reality and a microcosm to nurture dynamics before we try them in reality.

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    1. "Our practice of discipline spanking grew out of bedroom spanking."

      As I described, ours sort of did, though the erotic spanking phase was very short, to the point that I think of it as leading to discipline spankings only in the sense that it was interesting enough to me to lead me to look for F/m spanking content on the 'net, which led me to discover the DWC.

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  8. I recall you haven't historically liked it when people seem to be going into this subject. Before I answer, what are the limits of this question?

    J

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    1. J, not sure what to tell you beyond what I wrote in the post itself.

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    2. I ask because some things I might say under some circumstances go beyond the more conventional BDSM things mentioned above.

      J

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  9. I have enjoyed reading the comments of others. For us BDSM was the gateway to DD/FLM.

    There are many flavors of BDSM so you can't lump them all together. Our practice was used as discipline, although we didn't understand it at first, and as a way to switch the power dynamic from the traditional. She took on the role of dominate and I the submissive. It was during that time that she introduced spanking as an easy go to form of discipline.

    Other practices we use that originated in our BDSM relationship are now part of our routine DD. Pegging is used to reinforce the power swap. Like the meme Dan had in the post, it is hard to think you are the head of the house when you are bent over getting pegged and swatted with a riding crop. It is definitely discipline and humiliation. I do enjoy it, sometimes more than others. Domino has an assortment of dildos that she uses on me depending on the effect she wants at that time. Some are more pleasurable to me than others. Sometimes it needs to be about establishing her dominance over me. Other times it is reinforcing that she is in charge of my pleasure and chooses when I get the more pleasurable pegging.

    She will occasionally make me wear a butt plug when we go out in public to keep it in the forefront of my mind that she is in control. It helps to keep me from acting out and watching what I say. My mouth is my biggest enemy.

    O denial and edging are used routinely. When she has an O and then will edge me to the brink and then stop and deny me an O it does something amazing I can't explain. She loves getting me to the edge and then saying "NO". I have described it before, so I won't go into it in detail, but it makes me feel very owned and I just want to worship her and attend to her needs. For me, getting an O is a reward for good behavior over days in a row. I usually get one about every 6 or 8 times we have sex. Her having control over when I get to O is a major power shift. Also, sex is not always penetrative. Two thirds of the time it is me just pleasing her in a variety of ways. She will then edge me in whatever way appeals to her at the time, or if I have been good an O. The traditional dynamic of "sex is over when the man has an O" is completely destroyed. This is a big part of the FLM part of DD. Sex is great fun whether you get to have a O or not. Other times after being edged she will make me bend over and take a thrashing that I have coming while every nerve in my body is on high alert. These are the most painful thrashings ever. The total opposite of being disciplined after an O. Usually this involves also wearing a collar on my neck and balls. It makes me easy to control and easy or her to get to them if she thinks I need additional correction with a ball thrashing.

    We don't do feminization, no point in our minds, but she will exercise her authority occasionally and make me do the dishes or help clean house naked so she can swat me as she desires. while I work.

    If we are in public and she thinks I need correction that can't wait a bite on the neck or shoulders is always an option in her mind.

    Much of this is BDSM but it is being used as discipline and FLM not just an enjoyment of inflicting or receiving pain. This sort of outlines our basic dynamic. Feel free to ask questions if you want.

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    1. Antonio spoke of physical pleasure in being pegged. As I discussed earlier in my comment, my wife has pegged me many times over the years (although less frequently as the years have gone - but still on occasion). When it was agreed early on in our DWC relationship that pegging would be used as discipline to augment spanking, I did not really expect it to hurt. We both knew all about lubes and taking it easy with anal sex and it had been part of sexual repertoire all along - but with me as the top. Now the roles were reversed - and with the necessary cautions it did not hurt, although it could be somewhat uncomfortable at times - depending on the size of the dildo and the force of the thrusts. What I did not expect, however was to find the experience physically pleasurable - but I found that, at times, I did - more often than not. This probably should not have come as a complete surprise - I knew that many gay and bisexual men enjoyed being penetrated as a result of the stimulation of the prostate. But - nevertheless I found it disturbing. Did this mean that I was latently gay? Rationality reminded me that no - I had no desire for the real thing attached to the male of our species - and that I was still interacting with a woman regardless of the toys employed. And - certainly many us of have enjoyed receiving oral sex with a finger simultaneously inserted. Still - while I knew it did not mean I was gay - I did find the entire dynamic of finding pleasure in being pegged with a strap on genuinely disturbing. She was enforcing her disciplinary authority through a sexual role reversal - certainly a very humbling experience, and yet being made to physically enjoy being pegged in this submissive role - which made the power exchange of the role reversal so much more daunting. And yet made her so much more powerful. An interesting dynamic indeed - that I still sometimes find disturbing. --al

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    2. "She was enforcing her disciplinary authority through a sexual role reversal - certainly a very humbling experience, and yet being made to physically enjoy being pegged in this submissive role - which made the power exchange of the role reversal so much more daunting."

      It's interesting (to me) that you found it disturbing, but I guess part of me finds almost *any* instance of Anne really embracing her power and authority disturbing. But, for me, "disturbing" has a bit too much of a negative connotation. "Unsettling" feels closer. Her embracing her power in a way that signals to me that the relationship is increasingly not about just accommodating my disciplinary needs but also about her actually taking control and imposing it always shakes me up a little. Ultimately, in a good way, but it stirs up some unsettling emotions.

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    3. Antonio said: "She will occasionally make me wear a butt plug when we go out in public to keep it in the forefront of my mind that she is in control. It helps to keep me from acting out and watching what I say. My mouth is my biggest enemy."

      In the past, we've talked about "preventative" spankings filling that role. I can see how something like a butt plug or being forced to wear panties could fill a very similar role. "My mouth is my biggest enemy." Same here.

      "Much of this is BDSM but it is being used as discipline and FLM not just an enjoyment of inflicting or receiving pain." I think your examples illustrate that what separates BDSM and DD/FLR isn't the specific practices involved, but the intentions and goals.

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    4. al,
      As you have figured out, having an interest in butt play does not make you gay. The anus is a very sensitive densely packed with nerve endings - and that is just the physical side of it. Add to that the psycho/sexual aspect of this being the most private part of your body (IMHO). So on top of the physical sensations add a big heaping helping of embarrassment (LOL).

      I have always thought of TTWD (this thing we do) to be a confluence of many different factors - sex, sexuality, eroticism, psychology, sociology, punishment, discipline, domination, gender identity, gender roles, etc. I think most of us start out on the kinky side as a sexual play thing and then gravitate to the discipline side on a 24/7 real life basis. Along those lines, I have always found BDSM to be theater, whereas DD is real life (whether FemDom or MaleDom). Like “T” said (and Dan quoted) about BDSM: "I’ve never liked the idea of leather, whips, chain, etc." A bull whip that a leather clad dominatrix COULD take off your skin with seems to be the ultimate BDSM prop, but it is never actually used as such, as it is part of the performance. Contrast this with the housewife/teacher/nurse/woman next door type who REALLY will wear out your behind with a stout wooden paddle.

      But let’s just simplify it down to one axis: discipline v domination. In the FemDom DD world, I would classify several of our varied activities on a sliding scale as follows:

      Spanking Enema Pegging
      Discipline 90% 50% 10%
      Dominance 10% 50% 90%

      Just my thoughts - TTWD is like ice cream - you are entitled to your own favorite flavor, as there is no such thing as bad ice cream.

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    5. "A bull whip that a leather clad dominatrix COULD take off your skin with seems to be the ultimate BDSM prop, but it is never actually used as such, as it is part of the performance. Contrast this with the housewife/teacher/nurse/woman next door type who REALLY will wear out your behind with a stout wooden paddle."

      Love that comparison!

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  10. Good topic. Long time reader but first time commenter. Married 30+ years. I’ve always had fantasies about being held accountable and being spanked dating back to childhood. My wife has always been accepting but did not really understand it. We’ve managed through the years with her becoming more comfortable with my inclinations and slightly more participatory over time.

    My interests expanded from spanking to broader humiliation including feminization, chastity, cuckolding and pegging. She has embraced some elements as natural extensions of her power but it is not her natural state so some elements ( like cuckolding) will most likely always stay as fantasy.

    I too have the fantasy of being spanked by one of her lovers and she will verbally play with this but I doubt it would ever move past the play stage.

    I think there is a natural overlap with DD and these other expressions of power….as does my wife who is not natively wired for a power dynamic as a central feature of a relationship. She has come to embrace some of it because she sees the power it has over me and how it has been used to enhance our relationship over time.

    FF

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    1. Hi FF. Thanks for joining in. I hope we'll hear more from you in the future.

      "I too have the fantasy of being spanked by one of her lovers and she will verbally play with this but I doubt it would ever move past the play stage."

      For me, the M/m fantasy doesn't center on lovers (probably because even my fantasies acknowledge that "hot wife" or cuckolding scenarios are almost certainly never going to be a reality for us) but, rather, on the husbands in couples who (in my fantasies) know about our DD lifestyle and are into it themselves. It's much like some of the stories from the DWC about being taken or sent to another DWC wife for a spanking, but in the fantasy it is the husband who delivers it.

      Your description of how things have developed with your wife seems very close to our trajectory. I think there are many things that always stay fantasies, but in the last year or two she has started getting into the power dynamic more and more, to such an extent that it feels like a real step-change compared to the last 20 years. Once the desire for power is accepted and embraced, it's hard to predict where it goes from there.

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  11. Hi Dan, due to some very unexpected happenings in the past 5 weeks, I haven’t had a lot of chance to contribute on the blog – or for that matter even to read very much.

    This week’s topic is an interesting one. I am surprised it has drawn so little response, but maybe that is more a reflection on the time of the year and so on.

    “Did you come to DD from BDSM? Or, perhaps it was the other way around and you started with DD but later added BDSM elements?” – For me, it has sort of went back and forth and they have sort of fed each other, with even the divide between them fluctuating between very clear and pretty blurred. At a young age, I was fixated on punishment spankings at school (never experienced) and at home (seldom experienced). Then in my teenage years, I discovered femdom in the pages of Penthouse. I remember barely being able to breathe. For the next many years, I looked mostly at femdom magazines and then sites on the internet, but I was totally turned off by the whole “whips and chains” thing, and mostly just liked things showing plainly dressed women and so on. And then the DWC came along, and I finally saw pretty much exactly what I wanted, but my wife for many years (before and after I found DWC) was totally turned off by anything even remotely kinky. We divorced later for completely unrelated reasons, and when I began going out with my current wife, I quickly introduced her to the whole concept and she latched onto it from the start. However, she also really got into some of the more femdom themes, especially dressing certain ways, because just by donning the right clothes, it is easy for her to “feel” the part and to assert herself. Because of her and her interest in more kinky BDSM things, I have also shifted so now I am more turned on by more BDSM things as well (more activity than dress), but with a twist. For me, it still has to have some air of authenticity to it to have much power.

    “Or, maybe you don’t think there are any overlaps between DD as you practice it and BDSM as you conceive of it?” – for me, there are huge overlaps between DD and BDSM, as I will detail in a separate post for the activites. But the overlaps are all about the practices and not at all about the underlying reason or even consent structures. Because DD and exercised authority are the real hot buttons for me, my interest in BDSM activities is almost solely usings BDSM equipment and activities for punishments within the context of a DD relationship.

    -ZM

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    1. Welcome back. I've missed having you around.

      "Then in my teenage years, I discovered femdom in the pages of Penthouse. I remember barely being able to breathe."

      This may be one of the few areas where you and are different. I probably also discovered Femdom through Penthouse. Though, probably since I've always been more oriented toward words than visuals, a lot of my sexual discoveries came through Penthouse's "Variations" publication, and not the glossy magazine. (Not that I didn't like the magazine, too.) I don't recall having much of a reaction to Femdom, other than over time I developed the same "turnoff" you experienced where the whole whips-and-chains scene was concerned.

      Oddly, when I think back to it, the first time I remember gravitating toward anything that at the time was seen as truly kinky was when I found some magazines in our local bookstore--which had a tiny "adults only" section in the back--that were devoted to swinging. This was before the internet was a thing, and it was probably my first visual exposure to the swinging lifestyle, complete with pictures. I think what got me was the very explicit pictures of "real wives," as opposed to airbrushed Playboy and Penthouse models, and the heavy transgression involved in spouses opening up their marriages. Ultimately, that kink itself wasn't anything I had a strong interest in pursuing, but it was sort of like a "gateway drug" for expanding my sexual interests beyond my very conventional, small-town upbringing. It woke me up to the fact that there was way more out there than I had really appreciated.

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    2. Have no doubt, as soon as I discovered femdom in Penthouse, I quickly found Penthouse letters, because I too am much more driven by words than images. Maybe that is why I so love captioned photos even now, because my imagination fills in most of the details? And then once I discovered Penthouse Letters, I then went on to find Penthouse Variations, which was much more in line with my interests, since they didn't waste all the space on other (more vanilla) things that I didn't care about.

      -ZM

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    3. I'd almost forgotten about the Letters section of Penthouse even though you're right, it was one of my biggest reasons for reading the magazine.

      Wouldn't it be nice to be able to go back and discover the wonders of porn--visual and literary--for the first time? It is so readily available today, that it's easy to get very jaded.

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  12. A possible future topic: The before and after of disciplinary spanking.
    Context- Before and After studies are practically a fixture of any new product, process, behavior, or phenomenon. Spanking isn’t new, but its impact (pun noted) on both the spanked and the spanker is a bit of an unknown.

    My former girlfriend told me that there was a direct line between my bum and my brain. That may be more than a metaphor. Recent neurological research has been discussing a “second brain,” not quite in the glutes but in the bottom, adjacent to the intestinal system. That’s close enough for me.

    Several commentators on this blog have noted how their wives have changed their minds or views in the aftermath of a spanking. I have experienced this personally -being spanked when I thought she was wrong but feeling very differently when the spanking was over.

    So, it might be interesting to ask for descriptions of the difference, if any, in the way a male under female discipline feels before he is spanked compared to after he is spanked. Equally interesting would be the difference, if any a female disciplinarian feels before and after.

    The underlying topic here is the effect on the male of receiving a disciplinary spanking from a female. This question is distinct from the cumulative effect of multiple spankings over an interval of time. This might be an interesting topic, but it's not what I am proposing now.

    Alan

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    1. I''ll add that to the list, and I get the distinction you make in the last paragraph.

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  14. - continued -
    Pegging and butt plugs? – I think you are spot on about pegging and butt plugs being right up there with spanking with regard to experimenting by even quite vanilla couples, and considering pegging is something done to the guy by the girl, the better comparison would be to F/M spanking, in which case I would bet that experimentation with pegging is more common than female/male spanking.

    As far as experience goes, she has used pegging only a few times, and always in a roleplay scene, rather than as part of a real punishment, though she has expressed many times that she wants to and is going to, but so far it just hasn’t happened. Also, we have acquired quite a number of dildos, most of which are still waiting to be used. We live outside the country but have bought virtually every kinky thing we have in the USA, so what tends to happen is while we are visiting there, we buy a whole bunch of things, but when we get back on this side, we are too busy to even try them out. Because she has said many times that she wants to use pegging either as part of a whole punishment or possibly as a whole punishment, I expect this will happen at some time. I too am curious just what it might be like if she really used it to make reinforce the hierarchy in our relationship. My wife also has made a lot of references to making me wear a butt plug in a public place, so maybe that is in the future as well.

    Enemas? We have never used them, even for medical purposes. Having said that, we do have an enema bag and a couple of years ago, we even bought a few more things like a pump bulb, and like pegging, my wife has said that at sometime she is thinking to use it as part of a punishment, so we will see. I think her lack of knowledge and familiarity on the topic has made her reluctant, but I think she really likes the idea of me having to experience strong cramps so I better understand what she has had to endure for years.

    Chastity devices? Like most of the other things listed here, we haven’t done anything with chastity, though we do have an inexpensive CB3000 (as I remember). I can certainly see where enforced chastity would be impactful, even just the psychological aspect of knowing that you can’t, even if you wanted to. If we were to ever do anything with this, I see it more being like for a short time like 24 or 48 hours, and as a punishment. Alternately, I can see her integrating it into some sort of service domination play (which she really likes), or as some sort of game where I have to “earn” the key back.

    Feminization? This one my wife likes a lot, though again we haven’t really done much with it. And as you said, it is embarrassing, even though I am the only one who sees it (and her of course). She loves to tease me by talking about making me dress as a maid and come into a room with several of her friends and serve them tea or something. This would be unlikely to happen, of course, since we haven’t even gone all that far down the witnessed spanking path, and this seems even more extreme. While I would probably almost die of embarrassment if she ever did do anything like this, the thought of it is certainly provocative…

    Cuckolding and hot-wifing? - Like Anne, my wife has always had a problem with bringing third-parties into the relationship, especially in any clearly sexual way (though she has talked a lot about witnesses and has even told several friends about our DD). This particular topic is one that I really wish I could experience and then forget, since I can imagine that the feelings of powerlessness that would come from this would be intense, but I wouldn’t want to remember seeing my wife with another man. A much better angle for me would be where my wife was playing with another woman while I was tied up and made to watch, and maybe both of them torment and tease me a bit. I think that would avoid most of the jealousy problem!

    -ZM

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    1. I bought chastity device at one point, tried it on once, and threw it away. It seems to have a big appeal for some in the DD community, but it does absolutely nothing for me.

      Maybe it's because I'm not that into feminization outside the context of something subtle like panty-wearing, but the prospect of coming into a room dressed as a maid and serving my wife's friends isn't something I have even a theoretical desire to do. Your reference did evoke a memory from shortly after college, however. I was working in a local bar as bouncer. (I was in decent shape back then, though kind of small for a bouncer.) It was an upper-end place (for a college town), and for one of their "Ladies Nights", they had all the male staff dress like Chippendales' dances, with black pants, bow ties, and no shirts. At midnight, we had to serve champagne to the ladies. I remember being very embarrassed, and that didn't even involve wearing a maid's uniform!

      Cuckolding and hot-wifing: "I can imagine that the feelings of powerlessness that would come from this would be intense." That's really where I am. I don't have any kind of distaste for the concept and, in fact, I've spent a fair amount of time reading stories about it. But, I think in the end the feelings of jealousy and powerlessness might be too much for me to get over. I know that for the men who are into it, that feeling--and the act of overcoming it--are probably part of the mystique. In general, I think a society less bound up in jealousy and less dictatorial about monogamy would probably be a good thing, but I'm not sure I could personally handle it.

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    2. FYI, we did hang out with a couple who we later found out were into swinging. The way I found out about it was the wife got drunk and propositioned me, asking whether Anne would ever want to swap!

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  15. Dan, did you know that you blog is mentioned in Rebecca Lawson's book "The Good Wife's Guide to Taking Charge"? I've looked at a couple of books recently and I think it was that one.

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    1. Yeah, I actually did. I read that book several years and got to the end and saw that reference. Huge surprise!

      I had a somewhat similar experience recently. Aunt Kay's husband sent me a draft she had been working on of the history of the DWC. She had a paragraph talking about how she was arranging to hand the website off to a male blogger who she felt was living the spirit of the DWC. Based on what her husband had told me, it was clearly a reference to me and this blog. Unfortunately, the "hand-off" never really got as far as her draft indicated.

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  16. I realized that I had forgotten to mention that Domino tried chastity cages with me and still uses them occasionally but she has gotten into Shibari over the last 6 months or so and trying me up has become something she does occasionally and then administers discipline when I am unable to move. Total power loss. She has also used it to tie up my genitals and make me stay that way through the day or evening as a form of dominance. It is much better than a cage in my opinion. Easier to hide under clothes and more comfortable.

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  17. Well, since we are reaching the end of the week, and Antonio has already "jumped into the deep end," and "J" is somewhat hesitant and still debating, let me move this subject along . . .

    Before my wife and I met, I was personally interested in BDSM, and was even a member of a female led group of dommes and subs. At that time, I did not actually participate in any activities, as I have always considered my personal orientation to be "non-play," but rather "serious, psychologically intimate, monogamous" relations.

    However, I did periodically serve as a DM (BDSM "Safety Officer") for club gatherings and smaller get-togethers at peoples' home.

    I don't fully agree with Don that most BDSM activity is sexually oriented or motivated, as I learned of a great many quite varied reasons different people participated. However, I do agree that actual "punishment" towards "behavior modification" was very rare, in my experience. (However, I'm sure some to the couples did use some BSDM practices and methods in their private lives for DD purposes, but that was not something one would see at semi-public or smaller social events.)

    I was moving away from these "scenes" about the time I met my wife. When I first brought up the subject of DD, she was certain that BDSM was what I really talking about. It took a while to convince her that DD is NOT "play" or "scening", but quite serious, true, "punishment" to improve my behavior and our relationship.

    We had been developing our DD practices, mostly thrashing of the buttocks and thighs for about one year, when I purchased a leather tawse for her. Apparently she investigated on the internet the historic uses of tawses (Scottish "belts"): Buttocks, thighs AND "palms of hands." Kind of a case of "be careful what gift's you give," as she wanted to experiment. Frankly, she was not impressed with the effectiveness of the tawse on my palms, and kind of teased me that in her family's home country, Turkey, they knew the most effective place for such "leathering:" the soles of the feet (Falaka). She insisted that I try some light falaka, to best understand what "real punishment" could be. I have never felt anything so intense, with no sexual or erotic component to smooth-out the sensations. She was barely swinging the tawse and I could not keep my feet in place; it took tremendous will-power to return my feet to position for each successive stroke. Definitely a case of of "be careful what gift's you give," and "allowing your wife to use 'never-fetishized' methods of corporal punishment."

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    1. "However, I did periodically serve as a DM (BDSM "Safety Officer") for club gatherings and smaller get-togethers at peoples' home."

      Well, that sure sums up the difference between BDSM and DD, doesn't it?

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    2. Yes, but like with any group of people, there are extroverts and "party-people," and introverts who prefer a quieter, but not vanilla, home life.

      I was within such groups hoping to meet people, one "significant person" in particular, for a long-term relationship.

      My experience was that there simply were not enough people that fell within my general lived-life requirements in terms of education, life-goals, etc. to make searching "within the scene" worthwhile.

      I thought I would be much more likely to find someone compatible if I started with the basics, that make up +98% of life activities, and then possibly "corrupt" her. Well, I did! (Although I think she had strong inclinations she had "pushed down" into her psyche due to her conservative, extremely patriarchal family upbringing).

      After we married, we did visit some of the munches conducted by the FemDom group from my past. My wife found most of the people interesting, and she enjoyed the discussions and periodic instructional lectures and demonstrations. After a while, it seemed to get too repetitious, and we slowly disengaged. However, I think my wife came out of those munches with an acceptance of a wider range of activities (many of which she later initiated in our relationship), and also, particularly, a reduced inhibition to use more intense methods of punishment to achieve her goals.

      Again, it seems one needs to "be careful who you introduce your wife to" (some of those dommes were serious sadists).

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  18. In terms of the specific "BDSM Activities" that Dan asked about . . .

    Cuckolding and hot-wifeing? Nope; not going to happen! We are both very much opposed to bringing any third parties into our sexual relationship. However, we have discussed possible third party assistance to my wife for DD-purposes. My wife seems intrigued by the idea of retaining, and possibly directing, another woman (or man) to carry out certain punishments.

    Feminization? When my wife decides that I am "under discipline," to await a known future punishment, my wife will leave out a sealed letter, and a pair of pink, lacy female panties on our kitchen counter. It can be quite disconcerting to come home and find them awaiting me, particularly the details of my indictment: The transgression and how I will be punished. I must then wear the panties, except during punishments, until I am no longer "under discipline."

    Pegging and butt plugs? Not "pegging", but we have used anal tools, some similar to "butt plugs," for punishment and maintenance.

    Enemas? Only for actual cleaning, prior to using anal tools for punishment and maintenance.

    Orgasm Control ("Chastity") and Chastity Devices: Most definitely. My wife believes I am much better behaved and attentive to her needs when I am not allowed any regular orgasms.. Oftentimes, her control will entail me wearing some type of locked chastity cage. (We have never managed to find any such device that is truly compatible with riding a bicycle or a motorcycle, so use is often limited. I'm working on a suitable design; I do have a machine shop.) She does not use chastity as a form of punishment, per se; it is simply my "default condition." She does, however, use "chastity releases" as "rewards" for exceptional behavior, and I can usually expect a release every three to four weeks, unless I screw-up and am placed "under discipline," in which case the timing restarts once punishment is completed.

    There have been quite a few periods when I have been in chastity, and often "caged," for as long as three to six months. For health reasons, it is necessary to regularly drain my prostate of accumulated seminal fluid and cellular debris. (Keeps my prostate smaller, easing urination, and helps prevent any excessive "inflammation" from macrophages cleaning up dead spermatozoa.)

    My wife is not in the least interested in manually "milking" my prostate, or "edging" a "ruined orgasm" from me. She considers both to be too pleasurable and "rewarding," superseding the purpose of chastity: No "rewards" unless properly earned through good behavior. (To her, if I am still in chastity, it is obvious I have NOT earned any rewards.) So, she decided we'd use a variable-power "electro-extractor" with anal electrodes placed deep up against my prostate (equipment similar to that used to collect semen for use in "animal husbandry"). I have to be tightly restrained, and sometimes gagged. (While the process is very "uncomfortable," this is not truly "punishment," as the extractions are not intended to change any behavior. However, it is certainly motivating to not remain in chastity too long; if I am well-behaved, a chastity interval never lasts long enough to require such extractions.)

    Since my wife prefers me to remain chaste, and for her thus to reap the benefits of my increased submission and attention to her needs, for my most severe punishments she usually chooses to not have me orgasm. Instead, she will choose to use a non-sexualized corporal punishment. Sometimes this is falaka of my feet, which definitely requires that I be tightly restrained, particularly my legs and feet.

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  19. There are some other techniques (sometimes used in BDSM) that my wife uses as punishment. Most commonly, these are impositions of various "stress positions." Sometimes my wife imposes what she simply calls "wall time" . . .

    She'll have me stand naked, facing a wall, hands cuffed behind my back, with my feet forced back about one foot by an intervening box. She will then place a quarter-dollar coin on the wall and require me to hold it there with my nose. With the coin positioned low enough, I must half-bend my knees and lean-forward at the waist, causing me to arch my spine, thus extending and raising my buttocks. She has me "stand" there, not able to move up or down, back or forth, for at least thirty minutes. She usually turns-off the lights and leaves me, alone in the dark. It seems a simply enough position to hold, but after ten minutes my thighs will start to tremble and wobble; before long, it is all I can do to overcome the shaking in my legs.

    When my wife eventually returns, if she finds that the coin has dropped, she imposes penalties. Quite severe penalties, that escalate every subsequent time I fail to hold the coin for the interval. At minimum, the penalties require me to repeat the punishment period, correctly, without dropping the coin. For the first time dropping the coin, she will usually only impose "six of the best" with her delrin cane before I must resume the position. For a second coin drop, twelve with the cane, then . . .

    My wife says such simple "wall time" is great for punishment, and also instilling "obedience" and honing my "self-discipline."

    My wife sometimes imposes other "stress positions" when she feels I need more intense punishment; to teach me the seriousness of certain transgressions.

    Sometimes she makes me "Ride the Wooden Pony." With my hands cuffed to my collar, I'll be straddling a narrow beam of wood, straining on the tips of my toes to prevent the beam from pushing into my perineum. As time progresses, and my calves weaken, I can no longer hold myself above the beam, and my entire weight must "ride the pony." After about an hour, as I'm becoming desperate, she'll start questioning and lecturing me; making sure I understand how "I earned my ride," and that "I will certainly be riding again" when I next misbehave in a similar way. The only question is, "how long until I next ride?"

    Sometime she makes me "Ride the Rhino." Similar to the wooden pony, but with a foot-long conical "rhino horn," of silicone-rubber covered plastic. Once I'm squat-mounted onto the rhino horn, and my balls are chained to the floor to prevent me from climbing off, gravity and muscle fatigue in my thighs will ensure I'll soon be "riding the rhino," impatiently awaiting another of my wife's lectures.

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    1. Donn

      I heard someone speak of something similar once. If I may ask, I am assuming that the"rhino horn" is positioned at your anus. Is it lubed. Just curious how this works.

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    2. Wall time really looks serious. I need to introduce it to my wife

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