There's
something so special about a woman who dominates in a man's world. It takes a
certain grace, strength, intelligence, fearlessness, and the nerve to never
take no for an answer." —Rihanna
Hello all. Welcome back to The Forum. Our weekly gathering of men and women who are in, or interested in being in, a Domestic Discipline or Female Led Relationship. I hope you all had a good week.
I feel some slight stirrings of my DD interest, though it's not back even close to where it was. But, that's OK for now. Honestly, it was starting to consume too much time anyway, during a period when I don't have a lot of time to spare. Also, I haven't been in a very submissive headspace. To the contrary, I have been in a very dominant headspace and, unfortunately, it's kind of a necessity for me right now given some happenings at work. I'm sure it will all sort itself out over time.
A few weeks ago, we talked about humbling him. This week, let's talk about the converse -- how to empower her. Some women are born empowered. Others have to learn it. While people may be born with, or quickly socialized into, different levels of confidence and different senses of themselves and their inner strength, I do believe that leadership is a skill that can be learned and power can grow over time. But, it takes work and practice.
As I've said before, my wife is not a naturally dominant person. Between the two of us, my personality is by far the more brash and aggressive. But, largely because of our domestic discipline relationship, her confidence in herself and comfort level with her own power have grown and developed over time. But, it's also something we've worked on. To some extent, submitting to her disciplinary spankings is a virtuous circle. As she spanks more often and sees me always submit to them, even when I may not want one or may disagree regarding whether one has really been earned, her confidence in her own authority builds. In exercising more power, she grows more powerful.
As I said, it has been a work in progress for several years. Very early on, we implemented one process that helped her quickly get comfortable with giving real disciplinary spankings. We had agreed that certain offenses would earn a spanking, and we agreed that each such offense would earn a certain number of swats with the paddle. Regardless of how many it was, we both knew she was to give at least that many. For the first several weeks, the number of swats was around 6 at the low-end to 20 at the high. Then, I had one especially bad week. I swallowed hard as I tallied up that week's offenses and realized it came to 60! I told her that I wasn't sure I could take that many, and without missing a beat, she replied, "Then, I guess you shouldn't have acted that badly. You will take every single swat you have coming." And, she delivered. By building some non-discretionary rules into the process, she was freed to grow into her own sense of power and authority such that the rules became superfluous to her.
On a less spanking-oriented front, I've tried to find ways of mitigating her tendency to seek affirmation instead of just saying and doing what she wants. Sometimes, it's little things. In restaurants, she always wants to know what I am going to order before she decides what she wants. I often just won't tell her. She shouldn't need to know what I am going to do before she decides on something consistent with her own preferences. On a larger scale, a couple of years ago she needed a new car. She knew what she wanted, but she expected me to go with her to bargain for and buy it. She was not very happy when I refused, but I did. I made her to to the dealer, choose the car she wanted, bargain for it, buy it and drive it home. She ended up driving a much harder bargain than I ever would have done, and I think that incident really did help her learn that she didn't need a man for most things.
How about you? What ways have you found to empower your disciplinary partner and help them feel empowered and strong?
I hope you have a great week.
Hello all. Welcome back to The Forum. Our weekly gathering of men and women who are in, or interested in being in, a Domestic Discipline or Female Led Relationship. I hope you all had a good week.
I feel some slight stirrings of my DD interest, though it's not back even close to where it was. But, that's OK for now. Honestly, it was starting to consume too much time anyway, during a period when I don't have a lot of time to spare. Also, I haven't been in a very submissive headspace. To the contrary, I have been in a very dominant headspace and, unfortunately, it's kind of a necessity for me right now given some happenings at work. I'm sure it will all sort itself out over time.
A few weeks ago, we talked about humbling him. This week, let's talk about the converse -- how to empower her. Some women are born empowered. Others have to learn it. While people may be born with, or quickly socialized into, different levels of confidence and different senses of themselves and their inner strength, I do believe that leadership is a skill that can be learned and power can grow over time. But, it takes work and practice.
As I've said before, my wife is not a naturally dominant person. Between the two of us, my personality is by far the more brash and aggressive. But, largely because of our domestic discipline relationship, her confidence in herself and comfort level with her own power have grown and developed over time. But, it's also something we've worked on. To some extent, submitting to her disciplinary spankings is a virtuous circle. As she spanks more often and sees me always submit to them, even when I may not want one or may disagree regarding whether one has really been earned, her confidence in her own authority builds. In exercising more power, she grows more powerful.
As I said, it has been a work in progress for several years. Very early on, we implemented one process that helped her quickly get comfortable with giving real disciplinary spankings. We had agreed that certain offenses would earn a spanking, and we agreed that each such offense would earn a certain number of swats with the paddle. Regardless of how many it was, we both knew she was to give at least that many. For the first several weeks, the number of swats was around 6 at the low-end to 20 at the high. Then, I had one especially bad week. I swallowed hard as I tallied up that week's offenses and realized it came to 60! I told her that I wasn't sure I could take that many, and without missing a beat, she replied, "Then, I guess you shouldn't have acted that badly. You will take every single swat you have coming." And, she delivered. By building some non-discretionary rules into the process, she was freed to grow into her own sense of power and authority such that the rules became superfluous to her.
On a less spanking-oriented front, I've tried to find ways of mitigating her tendency to seek affirmation instead of just saying and doing what she wants. Sometimes, it's little things. In restaurants, she always wants to know what I am going to order before she decides what she wants. I often just won't tell her. She shouldn't need to know what I am going to do before she decides on something consistent with her own preferences. On a larger scale, a couple of years ago she needed a new car. She knew what she wanted, but she expected me to go with her to bargain for and buy it. She was not very happy when I refused, but I did. I made her to to the dealer, choose the car she wanted, bargain for it, buy it and drive it home. She ended up driving a much harder bargain than I ever would have done, and I think that incident really did help her learn that she didn't need a man for most things.
How about you? What ways have you found to empower your disciplinary partner and help them feel empowered and strong?
I hope you have a great week.
I agree with this. Unquestioning obedience to her when she is punishing plus lots of reassurance and repentance after ward. My wife has told me that she was very surprised when I obeyed her for those first spankings and that gave her confidence. I think as men we don't understand how difficult for many women to administer punishment in the beginning, but once they are n sure it is going to be accepted and appreciated they are unleashed and god help you if you find out it wasn't what you wanted after all.
ReplyDeleteEd
Hi Ed. I agree totally on the "god help you" point. My wife has told me that watching me submit when she tells me to bend over or take whatever position she has ordered is extremely empowering.
DeleteHello Dan!
ReplyDeleteShilo and myself are on our long-awaited honeymoon (4 years!) and I believe I mentioned that we're been in a relationship rut when it comes to sex and FLR-DD. As we were driving to the place we planned on having him watch the OU (Sooners) game and then have dinner, I noticed that he didn't signal when he changed lanes.
I figured it was my chance to bring up what's been heavy on my mind. I told him that I was thinking about reinstating some of our old rules into our relationship and then I asked for his opinion on it. Now before any purists object, l always ask for his feedback or opinion on things so I can figure out his headspace. It doesn't mean that I do what he wants, but I can build a better idea using his feedback and combining it with mine. He asked for an example, and I told him about the lack of using a turn signal. He quickly objected, saying that he nearly always uses the turn signal, and I agreed, and added that it was an example.
When he asked why (more of a logic question than an objection) I told him that I missed the structure. He agreed, and added that it would be nice. I consider that a win for my side. When we return, I will go over our oldest agreements and take the best of those rules to make a set of rules that will allow our relationship to flourish and put me firmly in charge.
He's even stated that he doesn't want to make all the decisions and I reminded him that I like his feedback but the decision is mine. I'm pleased to share that my hopes for this weekend have come to pass. Now let's hope it sticks.
💜
Merry
That's really great Merry. Funny how just a little separation from your day-to-day and a little change of scenery can sometimes make a big difference.
DeleteIn the beginning as I was began introducing this to my wife, I was kind of worried about how I might empower her. However, she has taken to it much better than I ever dreamed she might and seems to very much get into providing me discipline when needed.
ReplyDeleteBasically, to make her feel empowered from the beginning, we agreed that she alone decides why, when, how, and how much I am to be punished. In the talk leading up to a punishment, I of course have a chance to explain my actions, and generally she really wants me to explain so we can fully understand why things went wrong. But in the end, the punishment to be administered is her decision alone and I have no input. Essentially, my bottom is hers…
I had to be especially careful at first because all this was very new to her, while I had been thinking about it and reading about it for much of my life. Consequently, it was a fine line between giving her pointers so she would learn how to safely and effectively discipline me, but at the same time not making her feel disempowered or micromanaged. But in the end, I think we have very successfully navigated that period and she feels very much in control and she doesn’t hesitate to exercise her authority.
Relating to the topic last week, right now we happen to be in a very active stage with regard to discipline. We had quite a long lull in things mostly because of family logistics that simply never gave us any opportunities to do anything for a number of months. However, since school and college have started back up, we now find ourselves alone a lot more, and I am paying the price.
We were visiting the USA in August, and while there we ordered some amazingly effective by horribly painful canes (including one made from delrin and one made from lexan) as well as a “Curse of Dana” rubber strap which just burns beyond belief.
Upon returning to eastern Europe (where we live) we immediately tried all the new tools out in a roleplay scenario, which was fun albeit painful. Then a week or two later, my wife discovered a Facebook message which was not all that bad in and of itself, but certainly left the door more open to being misinterpreted so I ended up receiving my first punishment spanking with the new tools and that made a real impression on me. No sooner did the marks leave from the punishment than it was my birthday, and for that we had a just incredible “funishment” session! And now my kinky wife has informed me that I have another punishment coming (I am not sure what it is for) and that tomorrow she is going to completely wax by bottom both so I can experience the pain of wax hair removal for the first and hopefully only time in my life, and so that my bottom will be more sensitive for the punishment that I have earned. So, risking a pun, I guess that right now our DD lifestyle is very much in a “waxing” (not waning) stage, and I feel quite certain that my wife is feeling very, very empowered.
-ZM
Hi ZM. I'm very glad someone took my waxing metaphor so literally!
DeleteI totally understand the delicate balance referred to in your second paragraph, and one my most beloved commenters pointed out that my own references to restaurant and car-buying behavior would be interpreted by some as "topping from the bottom." As I've said many times before, I see that as a concept that probably has an important role in BDSM but in DD likely causes way, way more mischief than it justifies. Your reference to how you thought about and read about DD for most of your life and she didn't illustrate the crux of the problem. For whatever reason, men seem to be more drawn to this and more focused on it than their partners, and I personally don't see any problem in actively bringing up our ideas for making things work better. In fact, I think it's critical. If anyone doubts the dynamic you bring up, take a look at the poll on the right side of this blog. Almost 90% of the time, these relationships are initiated by the man, which means you have a guy who has probably thought a lot about what he thinks he needs, and a woman who may have never thought about it at all.
OUCH!A bottom waxing before a spanking.....that's gotta hurt too much to even think about.
DeleteI had no problem with Rosa feeling comfortable with power initially. So I can't really offer anything on this. She just took to it very naturally on her own and all I had to do was make the offer.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, it has been very difficult getting back to where we were after the long period of stress from which we are still recovering financially. We both have so much anger (not towards each other) that it has been very uneven and slow going.
Sorry to hear the after-effects still haven't resolved.
ReplyDeleteTwo items/methods have proven empowering to put the female in charge from both a psychological and physical standpoint:
ReplyDeletePsychological: This involves complete nudity of the male for ANY punishment, not just spanking, but for corner time, writing lines, doing chores (where practical), mouth soaping and the like - and not just taking his pants down, but complete nudity - not even socks his are to stay on during the entire punishment session. When he is being punished, he should be buck naked, while the female remains fully clothed. It is this CFNM situation that tips the balance of power.
Physical: This involves restraining the male’s wrists, thereby neutralizing his superior upper body strength. Metal handcuffs are recommended, but we have found a 12" chain between the cuffs makes it easier on both parties, rather than the standard issue handcuffs. Once the restraints are in place, the female is able to place and maintain the male in the proper position for his complete punishment - as she sees fit to deliver. And that is the key, because if male has the ability to stop his punishment (even if he does not), the female is not fully in control.
Ideally, the male should be trained to immediately perform the “3 S” command when told to by his disciplinary female:
1) Shut Up - Do not talk or even utter a sound until Nos 2 & 3 are complete (which should be within 2 minutes of being told);
2) Strip - Remove all clothing except his underwear (she may want to remove these herself); and
3) Shackle - Place custody grade shackles upon his wrists so that he is physically incapable of resisting his female’s efforts.
However, the “3 S” command is not used just for punishment sessions. More often that not, it is used because the female decides to perform a hand job, blow job or other reward - the “rub” is that the male doesn’t know until after he is immobilized. Other times, she uses “3S” just to have a conversation with his full undivided attention guaranteed.
If you think this is "topping from the bottom", just try it. You may find that you have given the female a PhD in domestic discipline - as in "Paddle his Derriere".
Carl H
Thanks, Carl.
DeleteLuckily, I did not have to empower my Dominant. She was in the lifestyle and when we decided to enter into a DD agreement she had no problem with administering discipline. We wrote a list of infractions complete with a 3 level punishment for each specifying the implements and number of strokes. We also agreed the I was to be totally nude for all spankings at home and at least bare ass for spankings anywhere else. She has complete control over deciding when a punishment is needed. She can also change the discipline or the implements or the number of strokes. I have no say or can contest the decision to punish. I can only accept. It has been this way from the beginning over 10 years ago and it is still working very well.
ReplyDeleteAn already empowered Dominant would definitely make things easier!
DeleteThis is a very interesting topic Dan.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you that when it comes to DD there is a fine line between empowering her and 'topping from the bottom'.
I find women like to be empowered , or empower themselves , in areas where they feel strongly about and wish to be in charge of .
In our case a good example is the kitchen. Even though we both cook and work in the kitchen almost equally from the start my wife is fully empowered there .Often I complain that she had rearranged things or made changed without being consulted and her response is always along the lines of "Yes I did.What is your problem?"
So I certainly empower her in that domain by accepting it.
Another area is in the garden .Once again we both enjoy it and participate equally but she likes to make all the decisions while I can make suggestions for her ultimate approval.
So by allowing her to call the shots I am empowering her.
When it comes to areas like Finances and the car , I am the lead although she does get more involved in these areas now that she used to but always defers to me for advice and decisions.
Some of the more 'heated' discussions we have had in these areas have ended in me earning a spanking for stepping over that empowerment line.
In most of these cases I was rude or disrespectful during the discussion and the paddling was more for that than for challenging her authority in the areas she considers her domain.
Like you , when we purchased a new car for her recently I let her take the lead and actually quite enjoyed it and in the end made a great deal.
I believe this success gave her the confidence to be more empowered in other areas of our life where she previously deferred to me.
When it comes to DD she is slowly becoming more confident but does tend to be lenient and let me off the hook a lot more often than I would like , but it is a work in progress.
"I find women like to be empowered , or empower themselves , in areas where they feel strongly about and wish to be in charge of."
DeleteI think that's a great point, and maybe also ties into your last sentence? It's always easier to get a wife in a disciplinary mood when the offense was one that *she* actually cares about.
I've been logging our weekly sessions. She tells me about things around the house that she wants to see improved, like cleaning the sink out after I do the dishes and not leaving traces of drink powder on the fridge. If I'm too ego'y on the tennis court, she will say something to me. I write it down in my journal and bring it to our sessions. Sometimes, if there is something that I am struggling with, like too many risky behaviors or saying things sarcastically, i write them down and ask her to spank my soundly. We arrived at a weekly meeting format that works for us. She feels empowered more and more because I listen intently to her. The motivation for me is higher now to listen and take her seriously. Often in the past, I would deflect or minimize her fears/thoughts as a way of managing them. Like I was saying indirectly that it doesn't matter. Now, focused on how can i improve as a husband and energized by our weekly accountability sessions, I pay attention. She has gotten very good at physically spanking me so it has an impact. She also feels more empowered because i am actually helping her more with things around the house/family rental business. So, our weekly format feels very satisfying to us right now with her growing more assertive/powerful and me growing into being more attentive and less ego'y. - RCB
ReplyDeleteThat's great. May I ask how your weekly meeting format works?
DeleteSure, I send her a calendar invite, recurring meeting on Wednesday's at 4pm. She accepted, some weeks she moves it later based on demands on our time. We talk for like 45 minutes. Typically, I'm reading over the journal. I read the closed items from prior sessions. Items that are not closed I ask her if I can close them based on her observations. I ask her to sign the items that are closed. We agreed to target 5 open items in the journal, so things don't get out of control; we have some focus. When i repeat a bad behavior that was closed, like yesterday, I ask her to apply additional 5 spanks as a reminder. Basically, our rule of thumb is 5 spanks per item open or repeat item and 2-5 closing severe spanks. Sometimes (often) after we have talked about how things are going around the house and how I'm doing relative to the journal-ed items, I ask her to help me with some personal goal. I kind of set the tone as to be a session about her helping me improve as a man. She isn't pleased to be the one driving me to improve, but is very comfortable helping me reach my goals. There is some creativity to this as well as to the firmness, warmup and implement. But that's the general format. I thank her afterwards, we hug at least, sometimes sex follows but not usually. Sex for us is almost daily, so hugs are the only urgent matter after a sound spanking. thanks for asking.
DeleteSimilar to how we do things, though we tend to do this daily. Hugs come both before and after the spanking, with sex following afterwards. I consider these particularly important, as they show how much I appreciate her doing this. We have a custom that if she doesn't want to have sex because she is still unhappy with me for something, she needs to give me more strokes until she is satisfied that the matter has been fully dealt with. I find this a fantastic arrangements, as it means I get to have sex daily with all matters having been dealt with first, rather than lingering resentment where I am struggling to understand why she isn't talking to me.
DeleteI don't believe anything is more effective in empowering women to administer discipline then an attitude of obedience and cooperation as well as letting them know how much you both need and deserve their punishments and experience them as love and caring which in my experience without exception they are. When I first came under control I routinely did something that I did not then think of empowering but now realize was. That was to share with her the triggers that made me submissive.They in turn cause me to obey and submit when discipline is underway. I expect these vary much for every man but having my pants and shorts taken down decisively while forcing eye contact is one of the strongest. Being ear-marched to the place of punishment with pants and shorts around my ankles ( especially if there are steps involved) just takes all the resistance out of me. So strangely enough is being being hand spanked along the way or when I am placed in the corner. Also appearing unexpectedly with hairbrush or strap in hand puts me almost completely under control.And almost any serious scolding in conjunction with any of those things is also powerful. So if you want to empower her, demonstrate your obedience and acceptance of her authority and the best way to make sure that happens is let her know what makes your knees weak and want to submit to her
ReplyDeleteAlan
Great suggestions, Alan. While my wife doesn't do it, I totally get how being hand spanked along the way could do it.
DeleteAs I've said before, talking is a great tool for empowering Ann. Letting her know before and after that a spanking that makes me cry hard is what I want and need does more to encourage her than most anything.
ReplyDeleteAlso, as alpha as I am, Ann says that watching me pull down my underwear ( usually with trembling hands) or seeing me blush or hearing me give up control and start to sob all really make her feel powerful. But it took a lot of talking and her seeing that I would really submit.
DWC Fred