Maintaining the DD and FLR Spanking Dynamic With Kids, Social Commitments, Travel and Other Distractions (Meeting 523)

“A man who can't bear to share his habits is a man who needs to quit them.” ― Stephen King, The Dark Tower

Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club.  Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.

 

I hope you all had a great week.  Mine was kind of a mess.  I was supposed to be adventuring on my motorcycle for the better part of a week.  Unfortunately, the trip came to a sudden and unanticipated end when I ran into some mechanical difficulty in a very inopportune place. It took about a day to get it fixed, which turned into a fiasco in its own right.  There was enough trip left that I probably could have caught up with the group I had been riding with, but I had also banged myself up a bit, and the entire trip felt cursed.  So, I gave up and rode several uneventful hours back to homebase.

 

 Oh well . . . I keep telling myself that the whole point of adventuring is to put oneself in uncomfortable and potentially painful situations.  Sounds a bit like Domestic Discipline, doesn’t it?

 

A couple of weeks ago, when Anne and I were out on a more sedate adventure, MissE left this topic suggestion:

 

I was reading back over the comments posted on last week’s post and wanted to throw this out there for possible future discussion - Dan, you mentioned that the DD front has been quiet for you both as you’re currently traveling and staying in other people’s homes. How does everyone handle keeping at least the dynamic and accountability alive when staying or being around others for extended periods of time, especially if spanking is not necessarily an option?

 

For instance, my husband and I are in the home stretch to buying a home, so in a few months we are going to go live with my family for a year to save the last bit needed. Obviously, this will provide new challenges, especially regarding our DD. But even aside from that, those of you with children too, or an active social life with your community, how do you reinforce her authority when alone time is limited?

 

We’ve talked a lot about maintaining a Domestic Discipline lifestyle with kids in the house.  Much of that conversation has centered on what kids should know and when, and I think making a conscious decision about that is probably necessary if one of your goals is keeping up a consistent DD dynamic, because I’m not sure there really is a way to do that without being somewhat open to, well, openness.

 

Now, in offering that opinion, I’m definitely in “do what I say, not what I do” territory.  Anne and I were NOT open about the DD aspects of our relationship when we had kids in the house.  But, our paranoia about others knowing, including our now adult children, is something that, with the benefit of hindsight, I see as a mistake.   

 

It led us to accept inconsistency as the price of parenting while in a DD relationship, and I now believe the trade-off was more voluntary and, perhaps, more unnecessary than it felt at the time.

 

I also often wonder whether it may have been pointless.  Kids know more than we think they do, and I have a hard time believing that neither of our kids put two and two together.

 

In fact, I know one of them did draw some conclusions about the overall power dynamic, because once she became an adult and was out of the house, she did ask Anne some probing questions about the fact that Anne seemed to have taken on more decision-making authority.  That was the result of Anne getting somewhat more comfortable with displaying her authority, but it was still pretty subtle.

 

It was a lesson that I could have learned a few years earlier from a commenter named Holly, who had these observations based on her own childhood in a household headed by her disciplinary mother:

 

“Kids know or suspect if you are in a serious disciplinary relationship, even if no spanking is involved, and for sure if regular spanking occurs. Living in the same house you cannot not know a spanking is being administered or that one has been administered. Even if you don't hear it you know from the way everyone acts. (I will admit boys are a little dense about this, as I knew well before my brothers did.) My mother was probably more open than most women and probably spanked more often than most. But ALL spankings were in private and as far as I know she never talked about it until well after we were grown. Before my marriage in my case and after marriage in the cases of my brothers and their wives.

 

As you have described your wife, she actively uses her authority, gives you orders, expects to be obeyed, and more and more acts in charge. A woman is not a disciplinarian only when she is holding a strap. Your kids are aware of that relationship between you even if they are not aware that you are punished with spanking. She is in charge. I grew up knowing that and believe I chose a husband who allowed me to behave much as my mother. (Actually, he chose me, but knowing my mother spanked made a big impression on him.) Your wife may be correct that the kids don't know about the spanking. But the physical discipline is only part of "passing it on." It’s the presence or absence of real DD in the relationship. My three brothers also chose women who controlled them. Two of them are spanked by their wives, while I am not sure about the third. But they are all happy (so are their wives)."

 

We did manage to keep our DD going despite not being consciously open about it, but it did come at the price of both consistency and her inability to fully explore and display her authority.

 

Both our kids were young when we started DD, which allowed Anne to conduct sessions in the basement after they were asleep.  In the teen years, they stayed up later than we did, so DD sessions had to be relegated to times they were both out of the house. Often, working sessions into a hectic, unpredictable schedule meant taking the rare opportunities whenever they presented themselves.

Another option is to deliver a quick session with an especially quiet instrument.  Though, I still have a hard time believing that kids won’t put two and two together if mom is frequently calling dad to the bedroom for a quick “discussion”.

 

 

There were also a few times when I would be called home from work for a spanking while the kids were in school. Or, work schedules allowing, an early morning spanking once the kids were off to school might be workable.

 

Honestly, I wish I had better advice for maintaining the dynamic with kids around but, apart from being OK with a greater degree of openness about it around the house, I really don’t. The fact is, it was hard to maintain any regular DD dynamic.

 

Our social life has not been a big impediment to reinforcing her authority.  In fact, in one limited instance, it’s allowed her to more openly display that authority. I’ve talked a few times about an incident that occurred a year or so ago, in which we were out to dinner with another couple, and Anne believed I was dominating the conversation and behaving boorishly.  When the husband and I stepped away from the table for a few minutes, Anne told the wife—a mutual friend who is the only person I’ve told about our DD lifestyle—that she intended to spank me.  I’m sure it reinforced her sense of her own authority, and it humbled and embarrassed me, which further reinforced our dynamic and our respective roles in it.

 

But, again, the only reason the dynamic was reinforced was because we had opened up to someone about it. In order to really grow the dynamic, I think we would have to explore other opportunities for her to more openly display her power.  

 

I’m always fascinated by the story our former (and hopefully future) commenter KOJ has told about his wife become much more openly assertive once they retired, and how that culminated with her spanking him at a party taking place in another’s home:

 

“The "anywhere, anytime, for any reason" grew out of our shared belief that the best way to break bad habits is with immediate consequences -- similar to the gentleman who got spanked in front of the light switch he forgot to turn off. For years those immediate consequences happened only when we were alone, but as I have mentioned she became much more brazen after our retirements, including threats in front of just about anyone and punishment in earshot of others. She never invited witnesses but there was one accidental witness, a story I will tell someday.”

 

"Then came the shock of my life that I have previously mentioned when she took me upstairs during a party and set me on fire with a hairbrush that could be clearly heard, and then we returned to the party. Now that was a surprise! But I must say that it dramatically improved my behavior out in public because I did not want a repeat of the embarrassment."

 

Another small step toward maintaining the dynamic while socializing has been warning me, while out socially, about what will await me if I don’t toe the line.  There have been many occasions when my behavior was starting to drift and Anne would whisper a reminder to behave and a threat of what would happen if I didn’t or would pantomime a spanking motion while others weren’t looking.  

 

 

Couples might also choose to use their social calendar to reinforce the dynamic by incorporating “preventative” spankings into their preparation for social events. Although Anne hasn't done this often, she has a few times, and I can attest it kept me thinking about our dynamic throughout the event.

MissE also asked about maintaining consistency while traveling.  We have not done a good job of that. I usually bring an innocuous “pervertable” item that can be used for spanking—such as a heavy leather belt—when we travel together.  But, it rarely sees the outside of my suitcase.  Although she has used it a few times, it’s very apparent that she is squeamish about other guests overhearing.

 

Also, given that our roadtrips are often in a van, there is very little real excuse for not simply pulling over somewhere convenient to take care of attitude and other problems on the spot.

 

 So, I’m clearly not the best person to talk about how to maintain and foster the DD dynamic in the face of kids, social, work, and other distractions.  Hopefully some of the rest of you can give MissE some concrete advice. 

 

In light of her upcoming move back into the parent’s house, and the references in this post to being spanked at a party, I’m also curious whether any of you have been spanked in another person’s home.  If so, I hope you’ll share some details.

 

 

Have a great week!

 

 

 

 

 

What If You No Longer "Needed" Disciplinary Spankings? (Meeting 522)

“Have no fear of perfection - you'll never reach it.” - Salvador Dali

Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club.  Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.

 

I hope you all had a great week. Or two.

 

It’s been a while since we had a real post, and I almost canceled this one.  We were on the road for about 10 days, staying with friends for a few nights, and the rest living out of van and hotels with two adults and two dogs.  In temperatures capping out well over 100 degrees. 

 

I was more than ready to get home. But, after a couple of days sleeping in my own bed, I’ll be off on a motorcycle adventure for a week starting this weekend. 

 

As an introvert, I hate feeling over-scheduled, even when it is fun stuff and by choice.  I’m hoping that the last part of the summer is more settled than the first.

 

As for the trip we just returned from, it was generally good, even if it involved too much time on the actual road. Anne and I got along better than we usually do when traveling, possibly because my attitude was a bit better than usual.  But, it’s all relative.  I have definitely had my moments of temper vis-à-vis other drivers.  And, although I always feel justified when I get into a bad mood when traveling, in retrospect I also almost always recognize that some of it was childish and merits a childish punishment.  So, if she decides to spank for it, it’s more than warranted.

 

Since I am going to be out again and unable to respond promptly to any comments or requests to release captive mis-identified spam, I decided to post this one a little early, and it will have to be sufficient for probably another 10 days or so.

 

Norton has brought it up a couple of times, though last week it was introduced with this anonymous comment:

 

As a possible future or sub-topic I’m curious what happens in a DD relationship when the reasons for punishment disappear or are eradicated? I have been punished on average I estimate every 10 days since we started many years ago. Sometimes more frequently, occasionally less. Recently we seem to be in complete harmony and even when we are not, I have controlled my usual irritations, sarcasm and/or rudeness. My wife has even commented how pleased she is that there have been no reasons for a session.

 

How long this will go on I don’t know… I’m curious about other people’s experiences or thoughts?

 

Norton responded:

 

There were several comments r.e. what happens to your DD if you become a changed man, and the need to be spanked largely disappears? My current experience is much the same as the first commenter's, as I said in the last post. Of course, I still have fantasies about being spanked, and they seem to be a core part of my sexuality. However, for the last 6 weeks, I haven't felt the need for a spanking, and have been very careful to not do anything to earn one. We continue to have a check in every week, but it no longer includes a spanking, which it has every week for the last 5 years. She still has the authority to spank for any reason, and that could even include stress relief for her. I could also ask her for a spanking, and will do so, if I realized I needed one. She enjoys being spanked foreplay, which is a turn on for me, but she doesn't want it to be the least bit real. She doesn't get turned on by spanking me, but she does enjoy some of the other benefits, such as having a better behaved, more vulnerable, partner, and having more power in the relationship. It seems like this may be a relevant topic to explore, since three of us have commented on it already in this post.

 

Alan illustrated how his DD relationship has developed over time with respect to how often he needs—or, how often his wife decides he needs—a spanking.

 

Every couple probably carves out their own timetable for “how long it takes” to get to that point where the need for spanking is extinguished or sharply diminished. But I expect that most couples experience a gradual decrease in the use of punishment spanking over time, not a full cessation of spanking: it always remains a part of a relationship. My wife has said she expects always to need to spank me at least occasionally. For us, disciplinary spanking frequency reached its initial maximum within about two years and stabilized there for several years. Somewhere around six or seven years, she tightened the boundaries on a lot of things I was doing (not doing actually), and the frequency of spanking shot up again for several years. Somewhere between our 12th and 15th year of DD, it gradually declined again to what became our long-term “norm”. (3-5 spankings a year).

 

That norm can fluctuate a lot from year to year. So, until last year, I had been getting 3-5 punishment spankings a year for several years, but last year I probably got more than one a month on average. But during the pandemic, I went over a year without being spanked, so there was a lot of fluctuation.

 

So that’s the big picture. Within that big frame, however, there were phases. One phase, still operating with us, is that the scope of her standards and expectations kept enlarging. Chores and responsibilities around the house kept increasing (not unreasonably), and strictness in enforcing rules tightened up. Things become “spankable” that originally were minor offenses or not even within the scope of discipline. Some once minor spankings became major ones, and so on.

 

A separate phase was the rebellions I put on when she tightened the screws on me or clipped my wings in some way. These bothered her initially, but she learned to expect them (and how to deal with them). We both consider those “mini” rebellions part of a healthy dynamic, although very early on, they did put a hit on her confidence (as well as my ass).

 

I also tend to “get in trouble” in bunches. Historically, the winter holidays have been a very dangerous period for that, and multi-day travel by car is similar. Interestingly, these instances of high risk have gone down over time as she has handled them more decisively, but they still do occur

 

So “what happens when there seems no need to spank …)? Each couple must work that out –no cookie-cutter formula exists for it. Apparently, some couples use maintenance spanking or (as my wife has done) increase the use of “preventive spanking.” These can fill that void while keeping things on an even keel. In any event, if we were at a point where we were missing the absence of spanking, I hope we would sit down and decide together if that was a problem and, if so, what to do about it. What can help heaps is a wife or GF just expressing pleasure at your good behavior and maybe including an implied threat about the consequences if that behavior doesn’t continue.

 

I admit I haven’t thought a lot about what would happen if I suddenly no longer deserved spankings periodically?  It’s because I don’t really foresee that happening.  Or, I don’t see it happening until I’m old enough that it will be more about lack of energy than about a fully reformed character. 

 

That’s why I led with the quote at the top of this post.  I know myself well enough that I seriously doubt that I will reach a point where I don’t do stupid, imprudent things.

 

And don’t lose my temper when driving, especially on long, hot trips.

 

Or, do careless things that result in wasted time and diminished bank balances. Or any of the myriad of other things I do that push or buttons or have a tangible negative impact on one of our lives.

Now, the question of whether a time will come when I don’t deserve spankings is different from the question of whether I might reach a point where I don’t feel like I need that part of our life anymore.  But, the two issues are intertwined. 

 

There have been times when I thought maybe I had matured to such a point that I no longer needed imposed boundaries and guardrails. Then, as if merely by having that thought I jinxed my own development, I would always do something that reinforced that no, I had not reached some new pinnacle of personal development that made DD unnecessary in my life.

 

Norton’s question is, in some ways, probably a litmus test regarding our respective primary motivations for wanting this kind of relationship in the first place.  Is it about the accountability?  The need for penance?  The need for boundaries and limits?

 

Or, is it just a spanking fetish?  If our behavior improves to the extent that we don’t “need” a spanking in the sense of deserving one and profiting from the boundaries one imposes, would we still “need” one in the sense of desiring it even if consequences were not at issue.

 

For me, that’s a tough one. A few years ago, I probably would have said that my desire was so inextricably tied to the need for accountability that spanking without that element would have no attraction.

 

I think that’s still mostly true, but I think over the last few years I’ve also come to appreciate how much my need for accountability is intertwined with a need to be under someone’s authority and to experience the vulnerability that entails. 

 

Moreover, even if my behavior did improve by leaps and bounds, I suspect the goalposts would keep getting moved, either in the sense of her getting more consistent and strict in punishing agreed upon behavior or in coming up with entirely new areas to address.   

 

 

And, in my opinion, that’s how it should be.  I don’t think there will ever be a point where I’m wholly satisfied with my behavior and accomplishments, and I doubt a time will come when I don’t want my wife to have the power to push me along.

 

Although our DD relationship began at my request, over the years she's reached a point where she enjoys her control and authority, both in terms of its effect on my behavior, and also for its own sake.  Therefore, I don't foresee a time in which she suddenly decides that she has the perfect husband and, therefore, she no longer feels a need to exercise control - regardless of how I assess my own level of reformation.

I’m reminded of a couple of comments left by KOJ (I hope this is just one of his periodic long absences and that he comes back around soon).

 

“Here's a paradox. In the first years of our DD (until I was well-trained), the better I responded to my wife's spankings, the more spankings I got!

 

Why? Two reasons.  One, she saw that they worked to improve my attitude and subdue my male ego, but I still had a long way to go in her eyes. Two, she saw that spankings worked, so she kept adding issues covered by DD. 

 

 

First it was all about respecting her. Then she added treating the kids better. Then she added respecting others. Then she added punctuality. Then she added my drinking. Then she added picking up after myself. Then she added actual chores. Then she added procrastination. On and on -- a seemingly receding horizon of new issues that guaranteed me an almost constant sore backside for a decade.  And she was right about every single issue.” – KOJ

 

“I think one of the reasons that our DD really took off is that my wife truly did have goals for me; it wasn't me asking her to hold me accountable for goals I was setting. She decided the goals, and she enforced them with hairbrush and bath brush. I knew these goals were good for me, or for our marriage, so I did not object.

 

She would just announce them: ‘You're going to lose 20 pounds over the next three months. You're going to start exercising five times a week. You're going to stop saying the F-word. You're going to ask permission before you have a third drink. You're going to call me when you have to stay at work late.” On and on and on.

 

She always had at least one goal for me in addition to frequent ‘attitude adjustments.’ When I developed one habit she wanted, she would start on a new one. It became a challenge for me; a game but a real one -- to achieve the goals she set. When I got lazy or forgetful, my butt got the reminder. It worked for us!”

 

In terms of frequency, ours is roughly similar to Alan’s, with probably about 5-6 spankings a year, though it fluctuates a lot.  Where we may or may not differ is that I see that average as less than ideal. That level of frequency is more closely tied to our challenges with consistency than to my actual behavior.  In other words, the fact that I get spanked only a half-dozen times a year or so does not mean that I don’t deserve to be spanked way more often than that, and it definitely doesn’t mean that a half-dozen times a year is sufficient to address all the areas she has indicated she’d like to change.

 

For us, the ideal is probably something much closer to what KOJ describes – escalating levels of control on her part, more frequent spankings to reflect her desires for my behavioral change, and a generally heightened inclination on her part to use the power that I know she has come to enjoy.

 

How about you?  What do you think would happen to the DD aspect of your relationship if the behavioral changes you both initially wanted to address were fulfilled?  Do you think that’s even likely? In the possibly unlikely event that it did happen, would she simply move the goalposts?  Is that something you would want?  Or, would the spanking aspect of the relationship continue but without the linkage to behavior correction and being held accountable?

 

Have a great week-to-10 days.

Taking Some (More) Time Off - Happy 4th.

 

Happy Independence Day for those of you in the United States.  We're still on the road, so I won't be posting this week (again).  Enjoy the holiday and be safe.

Taking Some Time Off - Happy (Advance) Independence Day

Happy Saturday.  I hope you all are enjoying your weekend.  We are heading out on a trip this weekend.  We're playing our return by ear, but it will be sometime after the July 4th holiday here in the U.S.  

Everything has been pretty dead here anyway.  Maybe a couple of weeks without a topic to address will give everyone a chance to recharge their interest in all things Domestic Discipline.  I hope you're all getting to spend some of the summer relaxing with family and friends, and I hope all of you in the U.S. get a long weekend off.  Behave yourselves and be safe.

No Post This Week, But Feel Free to Comment on This

Happy Saturday to you all.  

I'm taking a small trip over the weekend with an indeterminate end date.  So, I won't be posting this week.

When I don't post, I usually feel a bit guilty for slacking, but if last week's comments were any indication, maybe everyone needs a break anyway.  Man, was it ever quiet.  I don't remember the last time I've gone a full day, and then some, without a single comment.  

Thank you to those of you who did weigh in on a topic that clearly wasn't seen as compelling by enough people to get much of a conversation going.

Instead of just going silent for the week though, I thought it might be an opportunity to post this sequence of AI-generated memes I saw a few days ago on this Tumblr.  I'm not sure which AI platform he's using, but it could definitely use a spellchecker.  Still, I liked the scenario he came up with.

The last frame doesn't resonate for me, as it plays into too many concerns some have about what might happen if kids, including adult kids, were to find about the parents' DD relationship.  I'm all for mixing up hierarchies, but adult kids getting the full visual crosses some visceral lines for me.

I do, however, have a strong positive reaction to the wife's straightforward, business-like declaration: "I paddled him for not doing his chores."

I also like her explanation in the penultimate frame: "This is his idea. Dad needs accountability when he messes up. He expects me to discipline him."  I like it because, unlike so many spanking memes, it's true to how most of these relationships work in real life.  He brings her the idea because he feels like he needs imposed accountability, and she at worst accommodates and at best actively embraces it.

Anne had one conversation with our adult daughters that was a much less direct version of the above.  One day out of the blue, one of them made a comment about how Anne seemed to increasingly be "wearing the pants" vis-a-vis her relationship with me.  Anne replied with something to the effect that it was what I wanted; that I had a job that required me to always be in control and make all the decisions, and that I didn't want that at home and, in fact, kind of wanted the opposite.  As I said, it was much more vague than the scenario above, but somewhat parallel and basically true even if some important parts were omitted.

Anyway, I guess I kind of ended up writing a post, didn't I?  Feel free to post about the memes above and any thoughts/feelings the scenario raises for you, or feel free to continue the conversation about last week's post.

Have a great week.  FYI, there is some chance I may need to do something like this again next week, as Anne and I are going on a roadtrip that may cover a couple of weekends.

After the Spanking and the Strictness -- Seeing Her in a Different Light (Meeting 521)

 “A lot of people would say 'sexy' is about the body. But to me, 'sexy' is a woman with confidence. I admire women who have very little fear.” - Allegra Versace

 Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club.  Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.

 

I thought I wouldn't be posting this weekend but ended up having more time than I anticipated today.  I'd pre-drafted a couple of posts, so I decided to go ahead and this one out.

 

I hope you all had a great week. We had a special family event, which was great, but I'm now totally exhausted. 

I’ve been getting a lot of mileage out of a single comment from a few weeks ago, but here is another snippet from a commenter going by “DD”, which I’ll use to introduce this week’s topic.  He left it when we were talking about “zero tolerance”.

 

“My wife was the one who was very strict out of the gate and she has continued to be strict. I get spanked somewhat less often only because I am better behaved. I would never try to force my wife to enforce a zero tolerance policy but she is that way on her own. It took some adjustment initially and it certainly changed our relationship dynamic to something more FLR, and I see her differently than I used to. I have a new/different respect for her and see her as the authority in the relationship. She says she still sees me the same but she does treat me differently in her role."

 

The highlighted portion of DD’s comment resonated with me, for a couple of reasons.  

 

First, in our discussion regarding “zero tolerance”, we talked about one of the ironies of many DD relationships: The wives may be concerned that being strict or showing her authority strongly will be perceived as being “bitchy” or overly controlling, yet many of the husbands fantasize about a wife who exercises that sort of strictness and displays a dominant kind of confidence.

 

Second, I feel like after so many years of doing this, Anne and I are again on the threshold of a step-change in her exercise of authority and the strictness with which she approaches disciplining me.

 

DD’s wife apparently came to strictness naturally, though it also seems that being subjected to it over time has increased, or changed the nature of, his respect for her, culminating in him seeing her as “the authority in the relationship.”

 

That’s what Anne and I are expressly aiming for; a relationship in which we both see her as “the” authority in the relationship.  She's been carrying through with it lately, and it definitely has me feeling a different level of respect.  Not that I haven't respected her over the years. But, this feels . . . different.

 

We’ve talked about it many times over the years, but it’s never quite seemed to gel.

 

That’s not to say that she hasn’t gotten more confident in exercising authority over the years.  She has. But, it’s been incremental and inconsistent.

 

Some women are born empowered and dominant. It sounds like DD’s wife may be one of them. I’ve had female bosses, and female executives as clients, who exuded power and authority. It seemed to come naturally to them.

 

On the other hand, others must learn it.  And, I do believe that confidence can be learned, authority can be taken up as opportunities arise, and a taste for power can be acquired. 

 

As I've said before, my wife is not a naturally dominant person.  Between the two of us, my personality is by far the more brash and aggressive. 

 

But, largely because of our domestic discipline relationship, her confidence in herself and comfort level with her own power have grown and developed over time. 

 

However, because “getting in my face” doesn’t come naturally to her, we’ve had to try to create the right conditions and “permission structures”, if you will, to drill it deeply into her heart and soul that I really do want her to be more strict and powerful in dealing with me.  We've talked a lot about how she needs to make herself "expect respect."  And make my bottom pay the price if I revert to form and fail to respect her place in the hierarchy.

Submitting to her disciplinary spankings is a virtuous circle.  As she orders spankings more often, and sees me submit to those orders over and over again, her confidence in her own authority builds. In exercising power, she grows more powerful, and she learns to enjoy exercising that power. More precisely, she starts acknowledging to herself, and to me, that she enjoys power and being in charge.

 

Including exercising more and more power vis-à-vis me.

 

 

As I said, it has been a work in progress for several years. Paradoxically, one way she gained confidence early on entailed limiting her discretion temporarily. We were brand new to disciplinary spankings, and neither of us had any real feel for our limits or, despite the descriptions on the DWC website, what a severe spanking really entailed. 

 

So, we agreed to non-discretionary rules.  Certain offenses would earn a spanking, and we each such offense would earn a certain minimum number of swats with the fraternity paddle. She could give more, but not less.  For the first several weeks, the number of swats was around 6 at the low-end to 20 at the high end.  Though, given that it was a heavy fraternity paddle, twenty was not trivial.

 

Then, I had one especially bad week.  I swallowed hard as I tallied up that week's offenses and realized it came to 60!  I told her that I wasn't sure I could take that many.  The previous weeks of practice had apparently hardened her resolve.  Without missing a beat, she replied, "Then, I guess you shouldn't have behaved so badly.  You will take every single swat you have coming."  And, she delivered. 

 

I still recall that spanking, and I remember having a disquieting feeling as I pulled my pants up over my bruised bottom.  It was the first time I had felt the implications of the fact that, under the sort of DD arrangement we had adopted, the nature or our relationship had, in fact, changed.  

 

She had been empowered, and I had been disempowered.  Given the radical change in the dynamic, I could not help but see her—and myself—in a different light after that spanking.

 

There were other incidents in which I was confronted—via a sore and blistered bottom—that she was changing and was becoming much more willing to enforce her will over me. I recall vividly one time that she spanked me very, very hard for what I saw as a minor issue. I don’t remember the spanking itself very well. What I remember is that I was surprised at how hard she had spanked me and, again, feeling unsteady physically and emotionally as I pulled my pants up, like the ground had shifted under me. 

 

In both those instances, feeling so concretely one’s own disempowerment and loss of autonomy wasn’t pleasant. “Disquieting” is the best word I can come up with, though “humbled” would also be part of it.

 

 

However, that feeling of disquiet was, in the coming days, enhanced—not replaced—with an increased admiration and respect for her personal power and authority.

 

I felt a deference to her that I sure as hell never felt for any boss at work, and it had something to do with her expressing her power regardless of how I felt about it.  

 

Yet, a few nights ago, as we had a discussion about what increased “strictness” would look like, the archetype that seemed to resonate for both of us was that of a boss. 

 

Bosses don’t need to be mean or nasty. But, good ones have a confident demeanor that lets everyone know they are in charge.  They set the rules and can be rigorous in enforcing them.  They know that sometimes an employee needs to be kept on a tight leash and subjected to progressive discipline until they get their act together. They can, and at times should, make an employee nervous, or at least very conscious of their place.

I could give her concrete examples of being strict but, in the end, it wasn’t easy to articulate because so much of it is about attitude.

 

I want her to treat me in a way that displays that she believes to her core that she is in charge of my discipline and that, while we may make major decisions together, she has unlimited authority where my behavior is concerned.  It’s about not just exercising power, but knowing inside that she has it, to such an extent that it kind of radiates.

 

It's about both of us accepting that she is the authority in the relationship, as DD put it. 

 

That’s how “seeing her in a new or different light” plays out for us and what we are consciously trying to grow and reinforce.

 

How about you?  Has the DD relationship as a whole, or some particularly strong show of authority or especially painful spanking, caused you to see her in a different light?  Has she come to see herself in a different light? How so?

 

I hope you have a great week.

Warnings and Threats to Head Off a Spanking (Meeting 522)

“In spite of warnings, change rarely occurs until the status quo becomes more painful than change.” - Ralph Waldo Emerson

Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club.  Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.

 

I hope you all had a good week. Mine was fairly tame, other than another damn injury that required another trip to the doctor’s office.  I feel like I’m living in that place these days. I remember with fondness when I used to bounce rather than break.  

 

We had a good discussion last week about being spanked for attitude.  It seems to be a major reason many of you get disciplined.

I’m mostly in Alan’s camp, believing that it should be a significant part of our DD relationship but recognizing that, at least for issues related to temper, a “cooling off” period may be important. However, I think it's also important for Anne to maintain the position that even if I'm right to be angry about something, I better not direct that anger at her, or there will be consequences.

Though, too much cooling off and it’s one of those things that is likely to be dropped entirely.  After alluding to my attitude issues on the recent motorcycle trip, I had strongly considered going beyond blogging about it and, instead, suggesting to Anne that a spanking for it would be appropriate. I really was angry about my anger. It felt like something that needed to be corrected. But, I waited too long, and the moment seemed to pass.  

 

Yet, here it is, a couple of weeks later, and I do still see the behavior itself as a problem. In the post, I think I referred to it as juvenile.  In a comment on the post Norton used the word “childish” to describe similar behavior on his part:

 

My GF has not had to deal with me being snippy with her, as it just doesn't happen. We haven't argued much, and she has learned to stop any argument simply by saying "Are you arguing with me?" By asking me that, she is letting me know that if I persist, I am in for an immediate spanking. The main issue I had was, when I lost things, I would get irrational, which falls into the category of childish behavior. She soon learned that by giving me a hard spanking, I would calm down. These days I go slower, and don't tend to lose things as often. When I do, I try not to react immediately, and it helps knowing that if I do, I absolutely will get a spanking . . .. After losing my wallet a few times, she told me I would get a disciplinary spanking if I lost it again, which I never did. To me, it seems that an immediate spanking is appropriate for any childish behavior. This plays into the maternal aspects of spanking and F/M DD.

 

Merk Smith responded:

 

In our rather lax DD relationship, I get "do you need a spanking?" far more often than I'm actually spanked. There is something deeply ingrained in my pysche which means that those words basically act like a Hard Reset on a computer... I stop what I'm doing immediately. Sometimes I'm spanked later for it, but I never say yes, and I never continue with the behaviour that prompted the question. I'd like to check if she would by continuing sometimes, but I just can't do it (and I'm sure that she would actually spank...).

 

Alan picked up this refrain regarding intervening “threats” versus immediate spankings:

 

Thinking about these “threats”, it's surprising we have not discussed them more. They probably comprise a high proportion of discipline in the average DD relationship, more than a few years old. I am estimating about this, but I do estimate that for every punishment spanking I receive, there are at least five or six threats or warnings. And they do work. Other than temper, discussed earlier, she can back me down almost every time by the proverbial “do you need a spanking or do I need to text Ann (her sister).” These warnings from her are credible - she rarely threatens without backing it up. And they have the effect on me of eroticizing discipline without the physical and emotional turmoil of actually being spanked. My premise is that most women in a DD relationship have found out how effective spanking can be -but would rather not need to spank if she can achieve her objective (obedience and harmony) without spanking. Hence, the frequency of threats and warnings. Am I right about this, or is my experience not the norm?

 

I really don’t know whether a large ratio of threatened spankings to actual ones is the norm or whether wives often prefer the threat to the real thing. Hence, this week’s topic.

 

Alan is right that we don’t talk about this one a lot.  I think I’ve done threats/warnings as a full topic only a couple of times in 10+ years, the most recent about two years ago.  That topic also was initiated by a reader comment, from some anonymous someone raising points similar to Alan’s:

 

Dan, something I am curious about is the role of warnings and spanking threats in DD relationships. My wife threatens spankings more often than she actually gives them. I guess that’s because she has found that just threatening or warning me has the effect that she desires, so she doesn’t have to follow through. I haven’t seen much discussion from other guys about warnings and threats, so I wonder whether that is a unique feature of DD at our house. Maybe I am more responsive to threats than most guys?

 

It is kind of surprising that it doesn’t come up more often.  So many of us began our journey into DD with the Disciplinary Wives Club, and one of the most memorably pictures from the website involved an unheeded warning resulting in a spanking.

 

 

Yet, for us warnings have not played a big role, though that may be changing.  What has been more typical for us is she would announce a spanking was in my future but, for one reason or another, it wouldn’t actually happen.  I don’t really see those as “warnings” or “threats” properly understood, however, even if they may have a similar impact in terms of bringing me up short and reminding me of possible consequences.

 

Things may be changing on that front, however, and in a way that is a bit different from the typical situation in which some small bad behavior is observed and then the wife tries to head it off or keep it from escalating. 

 

 

A couple of weeks ago, Anne called out of the blue to tell me about an issue one of our adult kids needed help with and was kind of upset about.  Anne told me expressly that, because the kid was already upset, I should be sure to be constructive and measured in my response . . . or I could expect a spanking.

 

Now, this was a pretty pedestrian situation and not one where there was any reason to think I wouldn’t behave constructively. So, I was a little offended at first.  Yet, I kind of get it.  I’ve learned from feedback at work that I can sometimes come off as more gruff than I intend, and it sometimes intimidates people even when that’s not at all how I perceived my words or demeanor.

 

And, although part of me was slightly offended, another part of me was turned on by her taking control like that.  In fact, I think it was more of a turn-on because there was so little objective basis for the warning.  Rather, she subjectively determined that there might be an issue, and she proactively threatened a spanking to make sure she got me aligned with her concern.

 

In fact, I told her later that I thought what she did fit perfectly with our recent discussions about me needing/wanting an elevated level of strictness. When we talked about what “stricter” looked like, I struggled a bit to define it. I fell back on certain archetypes of strictness, like teachers, principals and, of course, some mothers.   

 

That’s why, though Norton’s quote above talks about childish behavior deserving an immediate spanking, I was more intrigued by how a warning about what would happen if he lost his wallet again changed his behavior immediately.  That seemed very maternal to me.

 

I think I associate warnings with maternal discipline even more than I do spankings, because warnings were far more common than actual spanking growing up.  As I’ve said, my parents weren’t big on actual discipline of any sort, yet I distinctly remember many threats of being spanked.  It was a fairly regular occurrence.

 

It also wasn’t at all uncommon for parents to make those kinds of threats in public, and they were effective because everyone knew they were credible.

 

As an adult, that doesn’t seem to happen quite as openly, but I suspect many of you can share examples of not-so-veiled threats.

 

Aunt Kay’s husband has talked about how she would warn him in public that he was coming dangerously close to a spanking:

 

Often she would, if we were in public settings, subtly make a gesture on her palm indicating "that's one." It was her counting to "three," which was a definite point of no return. I didn't make a game of her getting to "two". But if she did, I was very vigilant to avoid "three."

 

Anne has, from time to time, pantomimed a spanking motion over a dinner table to warn me about behavior. But, it’s almost too light a warning to really get my attention. For me, to really get my attention, the warning needs to be verbal and explicit, preferably with a clear statement that unless I do, or stop doing, something a spanking will result. And, if I do choose to cross the line she set, she should leave me with a crystal clear understanding of what happens next.

The only other time I can think of Anne giving a warning that had those elements was during a Christmas brunch two or three years ago. She asked me to help with something and, having had a couple of glasses of champagne, instead of doing it I made some smart remark. She too had had a couple of glasses of champagne, which is probably why she felt comfortable responding with, “Or, I could just spank you and then you can do what I asked.”  I don’t think anyone overheard, but she said it loudly enough that it was certainly possible.

 

 

Personally, although I know I wouldn’t like it at the time, I would welcome Anne being more aggressive and proactive with warnings and threats.  Clearly, there are times when my behavior is trending in a bad direction, and a timely warning might nip that in the bud. 

 

Now, an obvious question is, even if warnings are effective at changing behavior, do they scratch the same itch for those of us who asked for DD relationships because we thought we needed actual spankings?  And, do they meet the wife's need to impose actual consequences for behavior she's seen way too many times?

 

Honestly, I’m not entirely sure. For me, warnings seem to scratch a separate but related itch.  I was drawn to the DWC and DD because of a need for accountability and boundaries.  For substantial bad behavior, i.e. something that causes me guilt or that I feel I need to change because it's having a negative impact on me or others, my need for accountability requires a spanking. 

 

But, my need for boundaries can be served, at least in part, by a warning that a spanking is coming if I continue my present course. A strong verbal warning serves as an imposed boundary, even if it isn't quite as solid a message as a spanking.  But, for it to be credible, the jump from warning to action can't be too uncertain or attenuated.

I’ve also come to appreciate that my need for DD spankings is an expression of my more fundamental need for imposed authority, especially female authority. Although a spanking is one (very painful) way of experiencing her exercise of such authority, a warning conveys a similar message and, given that warnings can happen more often and more openly, it serves to highlight that her authority is a daily reality as opposed to something exercised on a less frequent basis.

 

And, when the time comes for warnings to be replaced with a trip over her knee, the message conveyed by her bath brush might be enhanced by a strong verbal reminder that she did, in fact, warn me and, therefore, I got myself into this mess because of my behavior and because I ignored opportunities to straighten up before the spanking became necessary.  A pointed reminder along those lines would help me take responsibility on a deeper level and would reinforce that warnings and spankings aren't an either/or proposition. If the former happened, then the spanking should be especially hard, and I have no one to blame for that but myself.

 So, what role do threats and warnings play in your DD relationship?

 

Are they something the wives uses commonly?  If not, do you wish that were a bigger part of your dynamic?

 

Or, is it the converse – she warns too often and it would be better if she went for the immediate spanking instead?

 

If warnings are a part of your dynamic, does she ever warn you in public? Are those warnings more a coded signal, or something more explicit? Has she ever given you a warning that you are sure has been overheard by others? Was the warning obvious enough that others would understand exactly what was going to happen to you if you didn't toe the line?

 

For any wives who are lurking but would like to participate, do you commonly issue warnings or threats before resorting to an actual spanking?  If so, is it one warning then on to the spanking, or do you have a longer fuse than that?  Do you find the use of warnings and threats empowering or confidence-building? Are there different or more severe consequences for him ignoring a warning?

 

Before we go, one housekeeping matter: We are tied up next weekend, so there is a high probability I won’t be posting next week.

 

Have a great week.