Saturday, November 2, 2019

Club Meeting 318 - How Long?

“I met an old lady once, almost a hundred years old, and she told me, 'There are only two questions that human beings have ever fought over, all through history. How much do you love me? And Who's in charge?” ― Elizabeth Gilbert, Eat, Pray, Love

Hello all. Welcome back to The Disciplinary Couple’s Club.  Our weekly on-line gathering of men and women who are in, or would like to be in, a Domestic Discipline relationship.  I hope you all had a great week.

It was an interesting one, on multiple levels.  Belle’s question about why an “alpha” male would want to be the recipient in a Domestic Relationship ended up covering a lot of ground: young men and their ability to grow up, or lack thereof; spanking fetishes versus balancing power and giving up control; female empowerment and its possible impact on that female’s desire; Domestic Discipline’s ability to “fix” problematic relationships or lack thereof; preserving  male “swagger” while punishing arrogance; parenting philosophies as applied to 30 year-old daughters; and, of course, the need for a better label than “Alpha” to identify men who with dominant or aggressive personality traits.

Lost in all that was an uptick in our number of female commenters, in addition to Belle. Liz, thanks for dropping by again. Lola and Drew, welcome.

Coincidentally, as our efforts to answer Belle’s questions about female empowerment in the context of bad experiences with an immature spouse were playing out here on the blog, a political situation with some parallels was playing out in the press.  Katie Hill, a Democratic congresswoman from California and the first openly bisexual member of Congress resigned after someone, probably her jealous ex-spouse, leaked naked pictures of Ms. Hill participating in a threesome.   


From the reports in the press, it sounds like Ms. Hill’s high school boyfriend/spouse was upset that she outgrew him, went on to bigger and better things, and became a very empowered young woman. While he was living with mom and griping that his estranged wife wouldn’t pay him spousal support, Ms. Hill was embracing her power, sleeping with staffers and casting votes to impeach the most powerful man in the world.  So, estranged husband apparently got some revenge. Some of the same right-wing press that forgave non-consensual grabbing of women by their pussies got very moralistic about consensual relationships between a congressional candidate and her same-sex staffer.  In the era of #MeToo, that was enough to sink her career.  In her parting speech, she bemoaned the “double standard” applied to women in power.  While I sympathize with her and really hope the person who leaked the photos is prosecuted for “revenge porn,” I don’t think the “double standard” label fits the facts.  Senator Al Franken was driven from office for conduct that was arguably way less problematic than sex with a subordinate, so the Democratic leadership actually couldn’t support Ms. Hill without engaging in the kind of double standard she is now condemning.  Their previous treatment of men in power kind of put them in a box.  So, to me the issue isn’t about “double standards.” Rather it’s about how far we take a movement that has done good things but when applied blindly risks denying the reality that human relationships always have, and probably always will, revolve around sex and power.

Fortunately, here at the Disciplinary Couples Club, we openly celebrate the complex blending of power relationships and sexual attraction!  If that puts me at odds with our current puritanical bent and faux egalitarianism in all aspects of our complicated lives, so be it.  Also, I'm struggling with one of the most obvious lessons of Ms. Hill’s plight, namely: “Don’t let anyone photograph you naked.” Yet, at around the same time Ms. Hill was resigning from Congress, I was posting on KD’s blog about how much I like pictures of women “flashing” in public and how I wish I could entice my wife to join in.

Now, on to this week’s topic, which I will try to keep a little tighter than last week’s meandering, as interesting as some of it was.  Near the end of last week’s discussion, Belle, Alan and I got into some exchanges about the mechanics of delivering a real disciplinary spanking, including the tools she should use, what a hard adult spanking entails, etc.  In the course of that conversation, Alan observed:

“I don't know of your guy has had a real spanking as an adult. If not, he is going to be shocked at how much it hurts and how bad he wants it to stop. Be prepared for that and making sure he has that experience and understand it is definitely part of DD. You will see a pretty radical transformation just from that –and if he doesn’t submit to it, you will know early that it’s not going to work. Tough love maybe but very important.”


At around that same time, I had an email exchange with Caged Lion, who suggested the following topic (here in abbreviated form):

“I have an idea you may want to use for a topic. It may not be quite whatyou like because it does tend to attract the BDSM crowd, but it's an issue that's been bothering both of us. My wife keeps expressing concern about how long and how hard a spanking should be. I don't have any suggestion for her because I have no idea how other people in disciplinary relationships manage this. Do spankings always produce bruises? How long do they typically last?  Like almost every other guy in a DD relationship, you and I asked our wives to punish us. On your site any mention of a spanking might include whether or not it ended in tears but doesn't talk about how it was administered and for how long. I know would be helpful to us if we could find out how other couples handle this.”


I actually disagree about whether we’ve addressed “how long and how hard” on this blog.  I’ve posted some variation on that question multiple times.  But, it never really seems to draw much in the way of helpful, concrete responses.  And, it often isn’t participation by the BDSM crew that cuts off the discussion but, rather, those who weigh in strongly against any kind of formula or slogan, including any along the lines of this one:

In order to avoid that sideshow this time, and recognizing that we do all have differing pain thresholds and different abilities for absorbing well-earned lessons, let’s focus on the more concrete question of how long your own spankings typically take, whether measured in time or number of swats or some other metric.

I don’t have a lot of guidance to give on this one, because when I am being spanked I typically am looking at the floor and not at a clock. And, time spent in that position is, well, a bit relative.  When I am bent over the chair or ottoman and taking a very hard paddling or strapping, it seems to take forever.  But, in reality I am sure the whole thing takes well under 10 minutes.  Probably more like six or seven minutes.  For the most part, I haven't timed them. We did inject a time element into a few spankings earlier this year, however.  Following up on a suggestion from Helen or Elizabeth (I forget which), I suggested that my wife ensure that each offense is dealt with separately.  My thinking was that by separating each spanking into a separate mini-session, I would always have an incentive to behave better even if I had already earned a spanking that week.  So, the plan we came up with is that each offense would get at least 5 minutes of actual spanking time, as measured with an hourglass, with intervening sessions of corner time to let my butt recover and to get rid of most of the numbness. We only used that approach two or three times, with the longest resulting in about 15 minutes of actual spanking time.

When we were first getting into Domestic Discipline, we implemented a system that focused more on the number of swats than the temporal duration of the spanking.  Under our system, each agreed-upon offense was assigned a certain minimum number of swats. I don’t recall the details at this point, but it went something like this:  We had agreed the binge drinking was a problem that needed to be addressed.  We set a limit on the total number of drinks I was allowed to have (two or three, as I recall).  Exceeding that limit resulted in a baseline of 10 swats with a heavy “school”-style paddle plus five swats for each drink over the agreed-upon limit.  So, even one drink over the limit resulted in 15 hard swats. There were other offenses too, most with presumptive swats in the range of 5 to 10.  I still  recall vividly a session during our first few months of DD in which I had been particularly bad. When I tallied up the number of swats, it came to 65. Now, today, that is a fairly small fraction of the number of swats she gives me during a robust session, but at the time it was far more than I had ever taken.  I told her that I wasn’t sure I should take that many.  Without skipping a beat, she told me, “Then, I guess you should have behaved better.  You’re getting 65.”  Thus, a true Disciplinary Wife was born.

Over the last few years, I have become convinced that my lack of tears will never be solved by increasing severity, in terms of the kind of implement or the strength of the swat.  If anything, it works the opposite.  If the tool is just “too much” (thick rubber straps and some paddles qualify), I cannot prevent myself from going into “resistance mode” in which I can’t avoid just trying to gut it out.  But, I’m not as sure that the same thing holds with respect to duration. I have always wondered whether a longer spanking would result in me finally breaking down, if it just kept going on and on with no relief in sight.  I’m hoping ZM will weigh in on this one in particular, as he did reach a point of real tears last year and I recall him saying it was because his wife basically decided it would keep going until he did.  I would love to hear more details about what that actually looked like.


So, for the group, how long do your spankings usually take?  Have you ever timed one?  Is there a goal for it to last a certain amount of time? Does that vary depending on the offense? Or, Ladies, are you looking for some particular indication (tears, begging, etc.) 

By the way, regarding Caged Lion's specific question about bruising, I used to bruise regularly and fairly easily.  After the first couple of tries after we discovered DD and after she laid down the hairbrush in favor of an actual paddle, I bruised pretty much every time.  Now it is the reverse; regardless of the severity of the spanking, I very seldom bruise.  One exception was a few months ago when she experimented with some synthetic cane.  One of them wrapped around my butt and left very nasty bruises on my hips.  Honestly, I do miss bruising.  It was concrete evidence for her of a spanking well-given, and the need to cover up in the gym made the whole thing seem a bit more edgy.

62 comments:

  1. Joe2 here,

    There is a clock beside where I get spanked, so I do know how long my spankings last. They last between seven to fifteen minutes. A very few rare spankings last longer. According to my wife, the number of strikes are between 125 and 300.

    The length of the spanking is determined by when I go into sub-space. For me sub-space is when I feel the pain, but I don’t react; I just lay there like I am asleep. To get into sub-space, my wife has to spank hard. We use a color system: green (warm-up), yellow (it hurts, but it probably won’t get me into sub-space), amber (that is where it really hurts- biting into a towel, yelling, holding onto the mattress for dear life) and red (safe word- It has only been used once because I got a pinched nerve in my shoulder and the spanking was the least of my pain.) When I go into sub-space, the spanking is about half over.

    Spankings have always resulted in bruising. Interestingly, the bruises usually show up about a day after the spanking.

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  2. Thanks, Joe 2. Is the color system something you say outloud during the spanking?

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  3. Joe2 here,

    My wife asks me what my color is at various times during the spanking. Since my tolerance for pain varies and I need to be in amber to get into sub-space, she wants to know how hard to spank.

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  4. I've never really timed my spankings. My wife spanks me until she feels I got the message and feel remorse.

    My wife uses a paddle most of the time and it's over her knee. She will usually bring me to tears but not from the pain of the spanking. She brings me to tears from her scolding and lecturing. She very good at making me feel so guilty about what I did and it makes me cry. When I start to cry the spanking will get much harder and faster until I become limp over her knee crying and promising to be good.

    When it's over she will hug me and tell me she spanks me because she loves me. I get very emotional at that point.

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    1. Thanks, Dan. Scolding and lecturing are another "concrete" topic that I wish were subject to more specific details and tips.

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  5. How long (and how hard) J. spanks or whips me depends on what she thinks I deserve (and on what I did to deserve it !)... A "session" -as she likes to call it- may last from five to twenty minutes, depending on the "breach" of her rules... and of the "tool" she chooses to use... I, of course, have no other choice than to "take it" as best I can - and to remember to thank her for it...
    L.

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    1. L., of course, has no "choice" as to when, and how, I think he should (or needs to) be disciplined, and he knows better than to complain... except by yelping, crying or begging (which is exactly what I expect him to do!). And, yes, I expect (and require) him to thank me during and after he gets what I think he deserves...
      J.

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    2. I guess I should add that J. never says how long the "session" may last (it usually takes up to twenty minutes, but there have been occasions when it would run up to 45 ' -especially when he sister is around...)
      L.

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  6. Anywhere from 3 to 20 minutes. Then I'd put Shilo in the corner for 5, and re-start if there was more than disciplinary session necessary.

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    1. Thanks, Merry. It sounds similar to what we tried for a while, and probably need to restart. I do think it was a good system in that it kept me from thinking, "I already earned a spanking, so no point in resisting temptation on this other thing."

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    2. I used to laugh about "corner time" until I realized that I needed the time to clear MY head.

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  7. My spankings are quick, five minutes or less. That is because I typically get between 20 and 40 swats. Doesn't seem like much compared to most of you. But my wife swings very hard with a paddle that is 2 feet long, 5 inches wide, and 3/4 inch thick (I made it). It packs a real wallop.
    She is very deliberate with her swats, with a pause of 5 to 10 seconds in between. That means my bottom never goes numb; I feel each one intensely.
    I also bruise, even through trousers. The bruises last a couple days.
    My wife often asks questions as she is paddling. If she doesn't like the answer, the paddling continues. She does not time it, nor does she count swats aloud. But it is never less than 20. The most I ever got was about 80, I think. I lost count from the pain.
    When she feels her point has been made, she tells me to stand up. I always thank her.
    Arthur

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    1. Hi Arthur. My wife doesn't really do that "deliberate pause" thing, but I do see how it could be very effective.

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  8. I guess we’re consistent with the rest. Average time over her knee is 10 minutes but a few have been 15 or more. I always “ try “ to count the swats but lose track quickly. Bruises are collateral damage. Sometimes can be felt for several days. We are on vacation now. She forgot to pack her paddle. Didn’t help much. She bought a spoon at Walmart yesterday. JR

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    1. I have had that same experience of trying to count swats, but it never works.

      One thing intended to add about bruising but forgot to put in the post -- at this point there is very little correlation between bruising and residual pain. While I very seldom bruise anymore, I may still be sore several days later.

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  9. My wife began with a certain number of spankings depending on what she felt I deserved. After doing this for a while we had a talk one day and realized after a long number of swats that how many was not the answer for us but the amount of time. For me it is a minimum of ten minutes. It has been as long as thirty minutes, maybe more. We bought her a purpleheart wood paddle, about ping pong paddle size. That thing lights my butt up with very light effort on her part (she REALLY loves her new paddle). With it she has only gone about ten minutes.

    Luvinhub

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    1. Thanks Luvinhub. Different kinds of wood definitely pack different amounts of wallop. She has one paddle that is relatively thin and relatively wide, but it has the thud of getting hit with a 2x4.

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  10. This one is pretty simple to answer - we have a large traditional egg timer which is inverted at the start and often again and sometimes again depending on how 'punished' she feels I need to be. So any time from a minimum 3 mins up in multiples of 3 mins.

    Unless of course she forgets to check if the timer has finished - happens a lot - in which case it can be open-ended. TB

    PS The timer is always on my bedside table as an interesting reminder ...

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    1. I do like the idea of the hourglass or egg timer. My only caveat is I do find myself kind of "waiting it out," knowing that a cutoff is probably approaching. It kind of gets in the way of "surrendering," not that I really get there often anyway.

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  11. Egg timer used here too. One timer per implement used. Repeated as often as necessary with corner time for her to rest. But typically the whole thing is about fifteen to twent minutes. CRM

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  12. Generally high double-digit number of swats, delivered fairly quickly, so not more than a few minutes. Sometimes stops to review redness and heat from the affected area.
    CrimsonKing

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    1. Thanks, CK. One advantage to "not more than a few minutes" is obviously that it doesn't take a lot of time out of the wife's day, which perhaps might result in more consistency over time.

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  13. I am not spanking my husband hard enough apparently because I am not getting the changes I need and I know part of it is my fault. I am not a spanko but a wife who want to learn how to be an effective disciplinarian and he is not much help. I need help. We have both agreed to see a counselor but don't have a clue how to find one that can help with a wife in charge DD. I am determined to make this work but becoming desperate. Does anyone have a recommendation. Many thanks
    Deb

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    1. Deb, I don't have much to add here. You may be able to find someone by Googling for "kink positive therapists." There are various listing services that include therapists that call themselves "kink positive." But, I think that is different than finding someone who would combine counseling with advice on how to use DD to help a marriage. I suspect you are far more likely to find pro dommes masquerading as therapists. But, I could be wrong.

      I've thought from time to time about whether "personal coaching" incorporating DD could be an alternative career for me after a glide path into retiring into my current career. Doubt it.

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    2. In the time I did do some business development consulting. I don't see the next Apple here but there is probably an excellent business opportunity for some retired ( or even active)pros or kink friendly therapists to offer marriage counseling to folks starting out with a DD. Communication and sometimes an imbalance in information is likely present in a lot of newbies and some professional expertise world help. In some ways that is what we often do here, absent the explicit couples dynamic.Consider Belle last week and now Debbie. I am smelling a market there
      Alan

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    3. I think you're right that there could be a market, but the issues would be:

      (1) It would probably work only in states where you don't need licensing to be a "therapist." It's hard to imagine a psychologist or psychiatrist keeping their license if they openly supported or advocated for DD.

      (2) My guess is the therapist is going to get blamed, and probably sued, the first time a husband gets more than he bargained for or if the marriage eventually fails.

      (3) Adult spanking *could* qualify as assault in a lot states (though I still suspect a lawyer who was actually half-way good would win), and some states have mandatory reporting laws that apply to therapists.

      I totally agree that therapeutic counseling involving spanking *should* be available, though I do see the above hurdles.

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    4. As you point out there are legal issues, but my guess is that right now some therapists are supportive. I know there have been anecdotes describing that in various blogs over the years -and if I am not mistaken our very own Peter and Anna were influenced by a therapist during marriage counseling to move in that direction.
      Alan

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    5. Do an internet search for Kink Aware Professionals and you will find a searchable directory. You still would want to have a phone conversation in which you bring up DD, as the concerns expressed above are valid. Any spanking that leaves bruises or other marks, even consensually, would be of concern for a professional, and in most if not all states would be reportable.
      A professional

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    6. I have consulted the directory and may find it useful although it is not well organized for specific problems. I have also talked to my lawyer in my state and am informed she knows of only one case where any laws were enforced regarding "consensual " activity and she think that was actual abuse. According to her police are not interested in private activities and would only become involved if there were a complaint. My husbands only complaint is that I don't spank him enough.I also understand that the therapist "reporting" issues is not an issue unless you make it one ( in other words always emphasize it is consensual, and don't talk about bruises. I don't know what sort of "professional" you are, but you should try to be more positive and accurate in disseminating information to people who are looking for answers.
      Deb

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    7. Your lawyer is probably right, though most of the reported cases seem to follow a fact pattern of: (a) there is a consensual relationship, often long-term; (b) the couple breaks-up; and (c) then there is a claim that there was either a lack of consent, or that something happened that exceeded the consent. So, I do agree that prosecution is pretty unlikely, though it also depends a lot on the quality and stability of the relationship. It's one reason I do think DD is not something to be played with unless you are pretty damn comfortable with the trustworthiness of the other spouse. That's true on both the receiving and giving ends.

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  14. This comment is for my punishment spankings only as maintenance spankings generally take much longer. We do not time discipline spankings, but rather use, as a guide, the list of infractions we both drafted before the DD actually began. Each offense has a 3 level of punishment. Each level adds strokes or a different implement, or both. Most times a level one spanking is delivered with upper levels usually come into play for repeating the offense too soon or often. The guide provides the implement(s) and number of strokes. I stress the work 'guide' as she has complete control over discipline spankings. She can and does alter the implement and number of strokes. She will deliver what she feels is proper given the offense. She knows my limits and I have complete trust in her. I simply stay in position and accept whatever she dishes out. I have no input or comment once she determines a punishment is warranted.

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  15. Since I started this, I wanted to weigh in as early as possible (we are on the West Coast and had a pretty busy Sunday). The reason I asked Dan about this is because we have been trying all sorts of things to get to a true disciplinary spankinh. Neither of us has a background of spanking in our families, so we had no points of reference. Maybe an effective spanking is a little like beauty; you know it when you see it, or in this case, feel it.

    we went through a number of options: The first was for Mrs. Lion to hit me very hard right from the start. The idea there was it would differentiate itself from a play spanking, which starts off rather gently. We discovered that starting that way I couldn't hold still for more than six or seven swats. We kept this up for a while, I never got any better at holding still. Mrs. Lion did not want to do bondage to keep me in place. Then I consulted with a woman who is a very expert spanker. She said that she always did "warm-up" swats before getting into the disciplinary spanking. We experimented with that and it worked.

    Our spankings are at least 300 swats and make me quite vocal. However, I didn't feel any residual pain an hour after the spanking ended. It's been my view that the disciplinary spanking should be felt for at least another day. We discussed what could be done. I suggested that she increase the force of her blows as I got used to being hit. And, when I started getting numb enough (some people think this is subspace, I disagree), she should hit me much harder so that it would leave a lasting impression.

    Ironically, the first time she did this was just after I sent my email to Dan. Those late blows given at very sharp intensity, absolutely made a lasting impression. I bled a little, but there were no bruises visible. However it hurt to sit down all the next day.

    The way we handle the severity of an offense is by me being sentenced to more than one spanking, each given a day apart. In this case, I had a four-spanking sentence. The first left me very sore. I truly dreaded the next.

    My wife did not let up on the second, third, or fourth spanking. By the time we got to the fourth, I was really in pain. Unfortunately for me, I had earned another spanking. This was delivered the day after I had finished the fourth. Fortunately for me, she took mercy on me and was not quite as severe as she was for the four preceding spankings. Still, she drew blood and visibly bruised me. In fact, she had to put Band-Aids on a couple spots.


    That was two days ago. It still hurts a bit to sit down. I think we have reached a true disciplinary level of spanking. Rather than deal with how long I am spanked, Mrs. Lion attempts to do all spankings at approximately the same intensity. Severity is handled by the number of spankings I earn when she sentences me. I think this is going to be very successful. I really hate the thought of doing something to earn some more.

    In my email, I also asked Dan to open the subject of what implement is used. We have a lot of paddles. Over the years, when I was a top I acquired quite a few. Mrs. Lion is found most of them quite useful. I bought a few more trying to be "helpful" to her. The most effective is a ferrule paddle made by John Hanson. He sold his business a few years ago and I believe these paddles are still being made by a company called Paddlewerks. We have this particular model in bloodwood. It's absolutely the most vicious instrument in her collection. The face is only 3 inches in diameter and it has a 24 inch handle. I was told that this particular design was copied from one used for punishment in colonial times. It really works!

    That's my story.

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  16. Dev likes the idea of a timer. She said a little while ago. “ you earned yourself five minutes over my knee “ JR

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  17. We almost always have Disciplinary Sessions rather than A spanking. There are rituals I use to reinforce my disciplinary message, so if all I gave him was A spanking, he might not get the message. It usually involves more than one trip across my lap besides him being bent over something or me requiring him to assume a certain position. There's no time or number of strokes except for the tawse. I usually apply the tawse for a specific infraction during the Disciplinary Session (he always commits this infraction).

    He gets 25 strokes of the tawse and he must count each one. If he misses the count, we get the count right, but he gets additional strokes for each number he counts. Then we start all over again, but I "help" him count. It works out to him getting three strokes for every number he counts.

    I don't say much while I'm applying discipline to his bare bottom until the final trip across my lap (usually third or fourth). I've heard this from a few people I've consulted and I've read it too. You want his focus on the discipline being applied to him, so you don't want to distract him with comments. For the final trip across my lap (and for the additional swats afterward when he's in another position), I do comment and ask questions about his violations and if he's sorry and if he's going to disobey me and what happens to disobedient little boys. I know him, so I know how to tell he's truly sorry while he answers my questions while he's bawling. Once I'm sure he's really sorry, I stop the OTK. Usually, I'll have him put away the brush or paddle, then have him bring me a leather paddle or strap, so I can ask him more questions and punctuate them with strokes. Finally, it's off to the corner to stand or sit, as I decree.

    On the last trip across my lap and on the swatting at the end of the session, I'm looking for the sound of his bawling voice that tells me he knows he's been naughty, deserved what he got and is really sorry.

    I'm avoiding too much detail, since I don't want anyone to think I'm writing pornography or that it's BDSM. I do use some of the BDSM stuff when I discipline him, but, I turn it strictly to disciplinary purposes. This isn't play for us. We aren't FLR or full time DD, but, when I inform him he's under discipline or the lock clicks on his chastity cage, I AM in charge and he must follow certain protocols until I inform him he's not under discipline or chastity any more.

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    1. Thanks, Cecilia. A tawse is about the only iconic disciplinary instrument that we don't own. I probably should fix that at some point.

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    2. You can buy them with different kinds of handles and different sizes and thickness of the straps. They also come with different kinds of handles. You can even get up to 4 tails (that's the most I've seen). Since we're in a large city, there are shops that sell these kinds of things and that's where we went. The gentleman there recommended one like the traditional with 2 tails, but a little larger and heavier handle.

      He asked me if I wanted to use it for play or actual discipline. When I told him discipline, that's what he recommended. He said the heavier ones and with the thicker straps and huge handles were more for BDSM play and the ones with what he said was a medium, traditional or average strap thickness were better for actual discipline.

      The gentleman even let me try a few of them on then boyfriend (now husband) to get the best "fit". If you can find a good shop with people who know it's a real advantage.

      The gentleman at the shop even had me try the models for "BDSM play" so I could see the difference.

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    3. Actually, authentic tawses do not have handles. They are a single piece of thick leather cut into strips a few inches from the bottom. There are actually different degrees of intensity specified for each tawse.you can read about them as well as seeing pictures of authentic models here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tawse. Some time ago I found a website that sold authentic, rated, English tawses. I'm sorry but I can't quite locate it now, but I can say they are excellent and I have one of the heavy-duty ones in my collection, or should I say Mrs. Lion's collection.

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  18. Hi Dan,
    We're actually back at it. We position me so that the lower third of my butt and my thighs are the available target and so we avoid any possible damage to the neuro-stimulator. The bad news is that only switches and a single braided belt are our only implements, to play it safe.

    As to how hard and how long - today we used a deck of cards like "A Learning Experience" from the original DWC. I flip a card, then flip another to match it by number and colour. If it does not match I get the face number of the card from 2 - 14, aces high. If I get a joker I get twenty. I have to hit two jokers before the match counts or we put the match back in the deck. Our deck has 4 jokers and we replace them until two jokers have been hit.
    That usually amounts to somewhere between 150 and 250 whacks, but has been higher.

    The bad news is I was spanked today and will be tomorrow. Also, I have a morning and evening spanking coming on Thursday.

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    1. Hi Fred. I do recall that story from the DWC and have thought about suggesting she play that "game" at some point.

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    2. @Fred, Would you message me privately for more info on that card game. Explaining it here in more detail would use up too much of Dan's blog. cowboy_lac@yahoo.com is my e-mail.

      Thanks, cowboy

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  19. We always have thought more in terms of the number of whacks rather than time. My wife spanks at a good pace and mentally keeps count - although she has told me that if she loses count, she will always chose a lower number to pick up on - as she wants to make sure I do not get any less - and more whacks can only be beneficial. I used to occasionally try to keep count of the whacks, but rarely do any more - as I find it can distract from my submission and acceptance of the discipline.

    Weekly maintenance spankings start at 100 whacks ("the base") and almost always go somewhat higher as she adds some whacks for minor infractions or just because she feels like it - so often around 150 but sometimes as high as 200. Punishment spankings start at 200 and are likely to go to 300 (and, of course, she also spanks significantly harder in punishment mode as well). --al

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    1. Funny, we do just the opposite and it works for us. Our maintenance spankings last much longer and the stroke count, if she keeps one, is much higher. I never count for the same reason as you. Just last night my maintenance was short in comparison and she said I got 100 from each of 3 implements and 50 from another. She occasionally adds strokes for minor infractions as well. Punishments on the other hand are much shorter and fewer strokes, but the strokes are significantly harder like yours. However, punishment spankings do not have a warm up, no safe word and no after care immediately following the discipline. It will come later on. Just goes to show....different strokes for different folks and whatever works for each couple is the best for them.

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  20. I told my wife about the timer and she likes the idea. She told me to get the hourglass one for five minutes. She says i am to keep it by my head while being spanked and if it's a 10-minute spanking or longer and I forget to watch and turn it over, then just too bad, the spanking continues.
    Anton

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  21. Hi Dan,
    I like topics that focus on the “why?” of DD, but I love the “how?” topics! While I have learned a lot about myself and my motivations from the why discussions, I have also learned that no two people are wired the same. Even though I am sure there are big differences in discipline styles too, I think we can all learn a lot from each other abou the “how.”

    I too have wondered how long the “average” punishment might be. We have never timed ours, nor have we ever considered using a fixed time, or even a fixed number of swats. Rather, she punishes until she feels she is done (occasionally), she becomes concerned about the state of my bottom (most of the time), or our time alone ends because one of our kids shows us (too often).

    Duration has increased greatly over the course of our DD. Actual spanking time has increased, but not that much in individual rounds. What has increased a lot are the number of rounds of punishment and the cornertime in between rounds - which is often punctuated by humiliating or painful non-spanking additional punishments. I would guess that a very serious punishment might span an hour or longer, but the actual spanking time is probably no more than 10 minutes?

    As I said, she usually ends up stopping because of the appearance of my bottom, but even that is changing. Sometimes, she has had me put on underwear so she could continue a little longer. Normally I might think that is a bad idea because it is safer if she can see it, but she has seen it up to that point so can pretty well gauge the damage. Also, her tolerance for seeing visible bruising has increased quite a bit, and she has even casually mentioned seeing a bit of blood even as she continues, which never would have happened a few years ago. Regarding the bruising, I have two comments. First is that her hating to see bruising has nothing to do with DD or her causing it, since she winces as much when she sees a bruise on my arm. Also, like others I have found that I bruise a lot less now, and even when I appear quite bruised immediately afterwards, the next day it is like a clean canvas, even though I might still be feeling the effects for days.

    Ironically, just last week we have started doing something new, which entirely changes the time aspect. As I have bemoaned many times, we are seldom home alone, and our apartment is just too small and poorly insulated, so usually punishments get put off indefinitely, and often end up not happening. However, we realized that while repetitive sounds might raise curiosity, a single sound or two, as long as it isn’t too loud, goes unnoticed by everyone. So now, when she feels like bringing an issue to light, she summons me to our room, often with a text message, and then gives me one or two really severe stripes with the delrin cane and we emerge with nobody the wiser. The pain is unbelievable, and the burning lasts for hours. Of course, this doesn’t accomplish the same thing as long punishment sessions, but it is perfect for “little things” for which a more proper, long punishment session might seem unfair.

    Finally, regarding the longer session that led to tears for me, I will write about it in a separate message, since this is already getting long.

    -ZM

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    1. Looking forward to the "tears" story!

      I too have been "saved" countless times by the condition of my butt.

      Interesting observation about the Delrin cane. Kids are less of an issue for us these days, but something that allows for short but intense interventions would seem to make a lot of sense.

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  22. Hi Dan
    I am slightly astonished by the number of guys who time or try to time their spankings.It seems to me a form of control like being told in advance how many strokes are coming and then counting them. It can keep one from letting go to the experience and letting your emotions flow. Saying that I admit I too have tried to time mine counting from the time the brush first connects to my ass until she lets me up. But oddly I have never been able to keep my mind on it to really know how long its been. I have referenced the alarm clock on the bed table and even tried to use a stop watch but always forget to check them ( I do think most of actual wood to bum is five minutes or less but sometimes it seems an hour) I do think to be effective a spanking has to take you to the point you stop fighting it and let go to it. But what really makes it effective for me is the emotion she expresses, the scolding and the embarrassment or shame I experience. So I would say a good long hard speaking is probably necessary but not sufficient. One also needs that emotional connection and feeling that come from a spanking
    Alan

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    1. Hi Alan. I totally get it. I have tried to estimate time and have tried to count swats, and somehow I've never once accomplished either of those counting exercises.

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  23. Reading through these posts, it would appear that our disciplinary wives have taken to heart Aunt Kay's counsel that: "The longer and harder you spank, the more he will love you for it." It does seem that most of us often receive dozens and even hundreds of swats during a disciplinary session. For those who just referenced the (time) length of their sessions, even a three minute session on the egg timer could go well over a hundred if the wife is spanking at a brisk pace (as my wife almost always does). And I doubt that any of the wives represented on this group (either as participants, or by proxy through their husbands who post) are doling out love taps. Based on his many references, I suspect that our host, Dan, has to be near the top of that list (hardest spankings). Most likely, any "outsiders" looking in on an DWC style spanking, would be be very surprised at what they would witness. --al

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    1. Hi al. It's definitely a good point that duration doesn't tell you much of anything without pace. And, maybe that it itself is a topic for another day. I honestly don't know which is more painful -- short but very rapid fire, or long pauses between swats. And, does that depend on the implement.

      As for who get the hardest spankings among us, I've very confident that is not a contest I want to win. :-)

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  24. We found this topic very interesting. Perhaps at some point in the future you could post a similar discussion topic on Corner Time - How long for / how are you dressed or undressed / hands on head or back of neck/ holding implement/ does it have to be a "corner" / before or after punishment / timed on a timer / which room / witenesses or ??????

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    1. I am sure that Dan appreciates suggestions for topics, since it must be very difficult choosing good topics every week! And corner time is a great topic.

      At the same time, might I suggest that you set up an account and post under that account for a while, rather than anonymously. Then, after you have been posting a while and we all kind of "know" you, it might be more appropriate to suggest topics.

      At least the past year or two, we have had a constant stream of people who come, participate for a bit, generally try to take over the discussion each week, and interestingly, have often had new "suggested topics" just about every Friday. When Dan doesn't cater to their every whim and doesn't do what they think he should with HIS blog, they inevitably get mad and "leave" (though I kind of feel that we keep seeing them again and again, with only the names changing). I am doing some AI analysis on comments, but need a bit more time to be sure about who is who.

      I apologize if I have come across as harshly, and I recognize that it is not even my place to say anything, since it is not my blog, but I do think that it would be good to let people get to know you before you start suggesting topics, since ultimately it should be Dan's decision alone about which direction he wants to take things.

      -ZM

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    2. Hello Dan..where to send you a private message? Do you have email?

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    3. There is an email address included with my profile under "About Me" above and to the right.

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  25. Sorry if I suggested something you have already discussed. Since we have found this blog we have read the last two weeks, then have started from the beginning and haven't made it up to two months ago yet. My apologies once again.

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    1. It's OK, assuming you did recently discover the blog. What you are seeing from ZM is a fair amount of frustration at a few commenters who pop on, try to take things over, flounce out when called on something, then come back in different form. Unfortunately, it has contributed to doubts about whether anyone is who they say they are or whether we are just seeing another incarnation of the same problematic personalities over and over again.

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  26. My wife is like most, when she has gotten her point across then she stops. Normally its about a minute after I have started crying and begging for her stop. I have to keep a fresh switch for her in the garage. She likes the welts and you can definitely tell every time I get a good whipping. The marks will last for a weeks to remind me.

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