Saturday, June 4, 2016

The Forum - Vol. 160 - Let's Talk About Sex (Again)

 Everything in the world is about sex, except sex.  Sex is about power. -- Oscar Wilde

Hello all.  Welcome back to the Forum -- Disciplined Husbands & Disciplinary Wives.  Our weekly gathering of men and woman who are participating or interested in being in a Domestic Discipline or Female Led Relationship.

First, thanks to all of you for continuing to visit with us every week.  While I was in a bit of a snit last week about some of the downsides, our one millionth page visit is still a milestone worth noting.  So, while notoriety is not without its problems, I do thank each of you who make this blog part of your weekly routine, particularly those who pipe up with comments or who take time to tell us a little about yourself in the Guestbook.  Thanks for your time and for helping encourage people who are new to, and maybe a little skittish about, this idea of adult discipline and F/m relationships.

A couple of our contributors have recently suggested sex-oriented topics, though with kind of opposing themes.  Anna suggested talking about the role of sex in Domestic Discipline, while Alan suggested forced chastity and orgasm control/denial.  While I am probably screwing myself out of future topic material by combining them, let's make this week a bit of a free-for-all where the topic of DD and FLR and sex is concerned, under the broad heading of "What role does sex play in your DD or FLR relationship, and vice versa?"


In other words, let's look at it from both angles: (i) What role do sexual related issues and themes play in how you approach your DD and FLR relationships; and (i) what impact do those lifestyles have on your sex life?  Some issues to ponder:

--  To what extent is domestic discipline something that overlays a more fundamental spanking fetish?
--  Are sexualized practices, rituals, dress, etc. part of your discipline sessions?
--  Does sex often accompany a discipline session whether after:



Or perhaps before?



-- Do your DD or FLR "rules" include sexual-related prohibitions or practices, like forbidding masturbation or imposing some form of forced chastity?
--  Does practicing the DD or FLR lifestyle help energize your sex life?  Does it have any negative impact (other than the obvious impact on our upturned bottoms)?
-- For the women especially, does taking on a more powerful role in the marriage, including something like a real Head of Household position, make you feel more sexually powerful or turned on?

For myself, I don't deny that there is a mix of sexual and non-sexual elements that underlie our DD relationship.  If I have to pick one as more fundamental than the other (the disciplinary aspects versus the sexual component) though, just looking at the sequence of events that led us to DD, it seems like the interest in being disciplined preceded, and caused, the sexual reaction.  For others, probably a big majority, it seems to work the other way: the spanking fetish or interest precedes the discovery of domestic discipline.  People also seem to be all over the map on the extent to which sex is part of the actual discipline event.  Regarding whether it has improved our sex life, I think it has improved her sense of self-confidence, which to me is always sexy.  Overall, in terms of the extent to which sex is the motivator or underlying force charging our domestic discipline and FLR relationship, I noticed as I was looking for appropriate artwork for today's post, that I often gravitate to drawings that are the least sexualized and that, instead, involve a strong and confident woman just "taking care of business."

Or, "getting the job done."
That may, or may not, be an indicator of the relative balance of sex and discipline as fundamental to my interest in this lifesytle.

I hope you all have great week.  As always, if you are new to the Forum, please drop by the Guestbook (tab above) and tell us a little bit about yourself and your DD or FLR relationship or experiences.


45 comments:

  1. I would be very interested in trying to mix them up, but my wife wants the spanking to be completely separate from sex. We started with the one day rule- sex and spanking had to be separated by one day. But due to the kids' schedules and the frequency of my travel, she has modified it to a six hour rule.

    Joe2

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    1. Six hours seems much more workable . . for you! :-)

      Dan

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    2. I'm glad to hear Joe2 reference the "realities of life" getting in the way! I have multiple kids at home and travel pretty extensively for work as well. Maybe a "mini topic" for another day.....it would be interesting to hear if others have found it challenging to fit discipline in....and how people have worked it out making time and having the privacy needed to fit in a spanking.

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    3. Hi Darren. We've done topics on working around kids and distractions before, but maybe it's time to do those again.

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  2. Anyone who has presented an erection before a spanking realizes sexual feelings are connected to spanking. On the other hand that erection disappears when real spanking starts so its really a fantasy about spanking rather than spanking itself that is the turn on. Also if you have ever been spanked after ejaculating you know what the absence of sexual energy does to you.Then there is the effect of spanking on love making.My wife is much more open to sex after she has disciplined me.For my part making love to the woman who has just disciplined me is very exciting and almost liberating.There is no doubt that spanking has created a bond between us that goes beyond sex.She likes it when I take a spanking the way she expects and I like the approval I get from her for respecting her authority. It's all very sexy.
    Ed

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  3. [erotic] Spanking in my view is very intimate. More intimate than penetrative sex.

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    1. Thanks. Not sure I would go that far, but to each his own.

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  4. For us, "DD" is one aspect of an overall D/s relationship, so our feelings may not match up with couples who are strictly DD. As a D/s-F/m-FLR-DD couple, we do a lot to emphasize Rosa's dominant status besides just recognizing her authority to discipline. So we do also incorporate 'sexual rules' foremost being the recognition of the genitalia on my body actually belonging to Rosa in a pretty real (though perhaps not legally recognized) way.

    Therefore, just as I would not use her laptop without asking, neither am I allowed to just start touching "her property" without permission. Permission to touch (or tease) is usually given....but not always. In this case, Rosa just loves that I have to ask. Orgasms however are infrequently allowed. Of the two rules: no unauthorized orgasms whether with her or alone, and no touching except to wash or pee, the second is actually the hardest. Rosa has said as much herself but feels like the second rule REALLY drives the point home of just who those parts belong to.

    I've written before on spanking and sexuality, so I'll just briefly recap. We spank for sexy fun on occasion and therefore we can both be aroused by spanking even as it's happening.....but for me the purpose, pace, and severity easily can change the experience from erotic to "Ahhhh!". For her, even punitive spankings are a turn-on, though they are only 'sexual' for me before and after, never during.

    As for one leading to the other? Well, for her, yes, absolutely though not always. And for me, Rosa will never give me an orgasm after a punishment.....but even if we are just playing, she will only grant one occasionally. As others have said, spanking itself (if not serious) can be very sexually rewarding, and so are the various forms of oral worship I am allowed (usually feet or butt), but when you are kept chaste, these activities are a bit of a two-edged sword; on one hand they 'help' substitute for an orgasm to a degree, but they only help in the moment (like a sexy distraction). Once the activity ends I can feel even more frustrated than before. But that feeling does fuel a deep sense of submission.

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    1. Hi KD. Definitely agree on spankings being sexual only before and after, never during.

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  5. Sex and Spankings my wife states do not mix. I always get an erection when knowing I'm getting a spanking, my wife will either have me relief myself of it, enjoying watching me, or she will do it herself and that is not fun. A couple of days later in bed she inspects my still red bottom and what follows is wonderful, trust me the spankings are for real.

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  6. Dan linked sex and orgasm control to me and its true my orgasms are controlled by my wife. She requires me to get explicit permission from her before I come either from masturbation or intercourse.But neither one of us consider me in chastity and she is generous in allowing me to orgasm unless I have been recently punished.Absolutely no orgasms after punishment for at least a day.I don't even ask. I don't wear a device of any kind as this is a lot about me learning and practicing self control. This works for us because it allows her to exercise her authority and builds sexual energy between us while I practice the self control I lacked in earlier years.I like the idea she controls when I come and she likes controlling when and how sex happens between us. I can understand why this doesn't work for everyone. But at the same time I don't believe a woman is in charge if she doesn't control a man's orgasms. Spanking really is the prelude to this because it was only after disciplinary spanking was well established between us that she decided she wanted to control my cock.
    Alan

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    1. Hi Alan. The issue of orgasm control is one that it will probably always fall to you and others to address, as it hasn't been a part of our thing and probably won't be unless she takes it in that direction, though she has never seemed to have any interest in doing so.

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  7. A lull in sex with a girlfriend prompted a spanking, her idea. Answering the door one afternoon I saw my girlfriend naked, smiling, I quickly got her in and closed the door. What I said, she smiled just wanted to be naughty today. I looked at her and taken her arm said naughty girls need to be spanked and over my lap I gave her a spanking. She noticed a bulge when she got up rubbing her bottom and smiled, you liked that. I stood up and soon my pants and underpants were down and off and my erection she was soon enjoying. She told me afterwards that all males enjoy either getting a spanking or giving, the erection is automatic. Since then she has giving me spankings, but she makes me relief myself of my erection, enjoys watching me as she state preform for her. The spankings really hurt more and the next morning she will satisfy her needs and mind, it is great. I find giving and getting pleasurable, but have to admit, masterbating before her is a real turn on, she reminds me not so hard and fast, don't want to damage her play toy.

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  8. We use chastity to give my wife the ultimate control. Since the majority of us enjoy (before and after) and crave spanking, it's not a real punishment, but limiting and denying a man's orgasm combined with spanking is a powerful combination. From a sexual component it's like being back in high school where you pursued your girl friend and did everything in your power to win her affections , but usually ended up frustrated but always in pursuit. The orgasms are much more intense after a period of time has expired, especially with some teasing from my wife. She gets all the foot and back massages,and sexual favors that she desires.
    John

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    1. Hi John. I think many would dispute the "it's not a real punishment" but I get the position that orgasm denial adds to it. Not my thing, but it does seem to be for many.

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  9. Our FLM rules require plenty of rituals including absolute prohibition from engaging in any physical sexual activity unless I am giving permission to do so, in the presence and under the supervision of my Wife. I am even prohibited from touching myself for any reason other than natural fun pans cleaning.

    When I am punished, even severely punished, there is and will always be a sexual component attached to it, so much so in fact that even though I am full of regret for whatever infraction I am being punished for, I always have an erection. The sexual source for me comes from the unmitigated joy/lust I feel in the knowledge that my wife loves me enough to control and punish me the way she does. I call it a love boner

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    1. Hi Sub hub. Welcome back. Haven't heard from you in a while.

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  10. Hi Dan
    Sex really doesn't play any part of discipline for me. He is punished for specific acts of disrespect or disobedience that effect our relationship or diminish him as a man. I do forbid masturbation but that goes back to before we were married and I have never had to punish him for that.Disciplining him has removed stress from out marriage but our sex life was always good and spanking him hasn't changed that
    Holly

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    1. That's great Holly. Your approach seems consistent with what I described above as a "taking care of business" approach.

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  11. Our situation is similar to Holly's relationship with some exceptions. Discipline in our house depends on whether or not there has been a violation of agreed upon rules. Sex plays no part in that. If a rule is violated I am spanked, no exceptions. The purpose is to improve my behavior in areas that cause stress in our marriage. For the most part my behavior has improved dramatically and spankings are down to three or four a year. When we started DD I got three or four a month. I think the important element of our DD program is I wanted to improve and tried hard to improve. It was obvious to both my wife and myself I needed discipline. My wife liked the idea of having the power to correct my bad habits and demeanor and has done her part to help me improve by making spankings very unpleasant experiences. I do not enjoy any part of being spanked, and when it happens I some times second guess myself about why I would have agreed to consenting to give my wife this power over me. However, in my recovery period after being spanked, I realize the many benefits we both get from having done so. I really respect my wife and the power she has to set me straight when I go astray. I have clear cut boundaries that keep me under control, at least most of the time. My wife gets any pent up anger out of her system and I think appreciates the fact I am willing to submit to punishment to improve our marriage. The result of all this is a relationship where our love for each other has grown and although our sexual relationship was always good, it is more loving and caring now.
    In our house spankings and sex don't mix. When I'm about to be spanked, sex is the farthest thing from my mind. I am consumed with fear and dread of what is about to happen to me. Yet, just before I am spanked I get an erection that goes away as soon as the spanking begins. I have looked for an answer on the web. Some have said fear causes an adrenalin rush increasing one's heart rate which speeds up the flow of blood to the nether region. Or is it the intimate relationship that will soon take place between wife and husband. I don't know, but maybe both.

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    1. Hi Anonymous. Great summary of the benefits of DD. That explanation for the pre-spanking erection seems as logical as anything I have heard.

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  12. Hello Dan,
    Thanks for another thought provoking question. We don't practice what I understand to be erotic spanking. All Jay's spankings are punishment and sex afterward is not an option for him. But without doubt our life in the bedroom improved almost immediately when we started discipline.Part of the reason for that is he no longer acts like a macho jerk in bed and can relax and let me lead. But probably more important is that spanking ended the power struggles we had earlier and I am much more interested in having sex with him.So spanking actually has had a big influence on our erotic life even though we don't practice erotic spanking. Here I will make a small confession. Sometimes (not always) spanking him does turn me on,especially when he shows real remorse and cooperates with me in his punishment.It does open up some strong feelings for me but I don't act on them immediately because that would send Jay the wrong message. So I guess it is contradictory to say sex and spanking are completely separate for us. Sex never follows a punishment spanking but spanking does stir sexual feelings that I believe I should not act on if I am going to be an effective disciplinarian.Maybe this is only me but I wonder if other wives who have assumed the discipline role don't have similar feelings.
    Marisa

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    1. Hi Marisa. Great observations about DD ending the power struggles. It took me awhile to appreciate that as one of the real benefits of DD. I used to have this vision that the ideal was some kind of egalitarian relationship of pure equality, but I've come to wonder whether that ever really exists. I'm coming to believe that most human relationships require some kind of hierarchy to work well, and things are apt not to work well when the hierarchy isn't recognized and that power struggle is happening.

      Thanks for the confession, and I would be surprised if many don't share those feelings. Like you, we don't do erotic spankings, and that may in fact be exceptional. Sounds like a good poll topic.

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    2. Marisa, My Rosa gets turned on by all but the most serious/emotional spankings she gives me. I will admit that at first I had a hard time with this because i felt like I needed to know she was serious and not just sex-playing. However, she stood her ground and logically asserted a view very similar to yours; that even in a real punishment situation, my obedience, compliance.....and yes the way I ouch and jerk under her spanks turns her on. She loves the thrill of her power in action. And she said that she sees no reason why she shouldn't enjoy her part of the discipline even if that discipline is unpleasant and unenjoyable for me.

      It took me some time but it really did make sense. The easiest way i finally was able to see her point was to put myself in her position in my head. When i thought about it, I realized she was reacting as anyone who is into all this would.

      So now we are both resolved to our roles with all that comes with them. And I have to say that she has been totally true to her word. She may get turned on, but she is turned on by the fact that our discipline sessions ARE real and not just a game. A built-in contradiction, but apparently true.....and perhaps true for you as well?

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    3. KD, it seems to me that you have struck on an important distinction, namely between getting off on inflicting pain versus "the thrill of her power in action," i.e. getting off on exercising power or, to put it more mildly and maybe more positively, enjoying being dominant and showing it.


      I don't necessarily see an inconsistency between wanting your way (dominating) and getting enjoyment from making it happen. The first is the goal and the other may be a collateral benefit. And, as long as he consents (and if our polling is correct, he probably not only consented but affirmatively requested it), then everyone is happy. It sounds like the complicating for you in the beginning was you needed her motivation to be a 1:1 match for hers but over time the alignment became more apparent. But, don't mean to put words in your mouth.

      While I don't have much problem reconciling a disciplinarian also enjoying powering, the two concepts that always seem harder for me to reconcile are on the other side of the paddle, i.e. reconciling real masochism and DD. If you are truly a masochist, i.e. you LIKE receiving pain, then it is hard me to understand how a true disciplinary spanking can be disciplinary for you, because you enjoy it. But, maybe it is a matter of degree and pain up some limit is pleasurable, but above that level becomes real pain? Hard for me to say. I'm not masochistic by nature. I have a weirdly high pain tolerance, but I don't enjoy pain regardless of its level.

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    4. I'm definitely a masochist. There's no way to deny it. And for me, other than certain exceptional joint injuries I've had and an infected stitched finger......nothing is worse than a sinus headache so persistent that it feels like a migraine in the making. Intense pain.........and not sexy at all. But why not? It's pain. I "like" pain. So why don't I orgasm spontaneously from a sinus headache rather than wish for a swift death? LOL

      Even a masochist likes what the Greene's called in their book, The Last Taboo, "a tidy pain". The pain can be intense (it can be even severe by certain standards)....but it has to be where we want it and somewhat how we want it. It needs to measured, focused, purposeful to be erotic.

      A spanking can be erotic, as long as you hit towards the lower part of the cheek and not high up, you keep the pace reasonable so as to let each swat sink in before the next, and most definitely if you slowly build intensity as the body acclimates itself to the situation with endorphins.

      So, all Rosa has to do to use a spanking for punishment..............is not do any of that. Spank hard from the outset. Be brisk. Repeatedly hit one cheek in succession before doing the same to the other, and have the ordeal end before endorphins come to the rescue.

      Even if you look at alternate BDSM-type tortures......you see slapped, pinched and jabbed nipples, genitalia, lower bottoms, anuses, but how often do you see a Top going after a sub's elbow with a small hammer? The areas usually "tortured" erotically tend to be erogenous zones as well. (there are exceptions)

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  13. Dan
    Hate to always have to say it but Marisa is as usual, right! Although our spankings are not what most would label erotic, there is a sense of power that I have in his submission that arouses. The more Peter
    submits the more erotic it is to me. To have him curl up in my arms after, often feeling the heat radiating from his body does make me feel more connected than any other time. I will add the sex the next day is always exciting.


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    1. the above is from me .. Anna

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    2. Hi Anna. This seems to be the same distinction KD was also hitting on. There is eroticism in the "sense of power I have in his submission." For the men (or for me at least), there is a similar eroticism in her wielding power. Also just in her exuding confidence and leadership qualities.

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    3. Dan
      Could not agree with your take on it more. In addition I want to say that I do feel a sense of being forgiven for something I know was wrong. To be embraced by Anna after a session I do feel the warmth of erotic emotions mixed with a sense of pride that the woman I married has
      shown me the way back to the proper way of behaving.
      peter

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  14. I spank my husband for foreplay, he enjoys it and I enjoy his erection rubbing between my legs. I know when to stop and have him on the verge of coming. I also spank him when he needs a reminder that I run the household. Like most males that little boy is in them all. These spankings do not lead to sexual pleasure, the only pleasure is when I watch him relieve himself of his erection, sitting on the toilet (less clean up), he feels those spankings the way I wished them to be felt. We control his penis in many ways.

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  15. There are women who find ways to get a spanking, it is a turn on, but on the other hand there are women who get turned on by spanking men or even women. Would enjoy hearing their views, how they give a spankings, what is really the sexual reward they receive, power?, so just throwing this out there.

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  16. In our experience (whether with N. or with J.) spanking or whipping have almost always led to great, mutually enjoyable sex experiences.

    L.

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  17. If I want sex after disciplining my husband I will have it. If my husband has an erection before a punishment it's gone before I'm through spanking soundly. Often I will have him emptied prior to discipline as it adds to the punishment. I've sent him into the bathroom to handle things himself (with a short time limit), or I have him masturbate as I watch and wait (again there is a time limit) Or I'll get the lube and give him a quick, no non sense jerking off! He complains I'm too rough but it's not for his pleasure at these times. Then we clean him up, he goes across my lap and I beat his little rear end good! Discipline is for discipline! Jill.

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    1. My goodness. In so few words you have described so much!

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  18. Dan,

    This is probably not the right way to do this, but I can't figure out how to contact you directly by email or how to ask for an invitation to your private blog.

    Thank you,

    Carl H

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    1. Hi Carl. The private section is really just a placeholder at this point. I've considered various uses for it, like a gathering place for the wives or for people who are regular contributors and want to a less public forum in which to communicate. But, that is difficult because so few people are using actual accounts and, instead, just post anonymously. I'm not giving out my email at the present time, unfortunately.

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  19. It would be interesting to know how many wives actually use this technique ( requiring an orgasm before spanking) The reports seem to be all over the place from never experienced it to she does it that way every time. My wife is very interested in trying it but I am not sure it is a good idea and her spankings already leave me teary eyed. Also I know that once she moves the goal posts we never go back
    Paul

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    1. My wife reserves the post forced masturbation, full orgasm for the serious offenses. They suck

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  20. It's the same drill here. Oppositional disobedience about getting punished or untruthfulness of any kind brings out the KY and towel. These do get my attention so I have learned to avoid both of these offenses. But I do have mixed feeling about being spanked that way. There is no dignity in it and the warm after glow that comes from surrender to her isn't there after it is over.If it happened often I would probably rebel (not proud of thinking that way) but she uses it so seldom its really not a major issue.
    Ed

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  21. lOVE YOUR BLOG. To my mind spanking is connected to sex. Power exchange for sure. Some role play. some really DOM! Different strokes for different folks..........................

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