Saturday, January 24, 2015

The Forum - Vol. 74

Happy Saturday all.  I hope you had a great week.  We had another great conversation last week, though it went in a direction very different from what I anticipated.  And, it was a rather telling one.  The topic was alternative punishments.  More specifically, alternatives to spanking.  I assumed we would have a lot of suggestions for alternatives, lots of stories about being subjected to various non-spanking forms of discipline, and maybe the seemingly inevitable tangential discussion around chastity.  But, very little of that actually happened.  Instead, the surprisingly strong consensus seemed to be a lack of interest in alternatives, and a strong desire to make spanking the exclusive means of discipline.  This seems to me to have inadvertently answered a question I have thrown out there in various ways in past posts, namely to what extent is discipline--changing behavior--the motivating factor in these relationships versus an interest in spanking that is as much an end as a means.  Clearly, each relationship has its own position in that spectrum, but I was surprised at just how vigorous and numerous were the viewpoints that spanking is not only central to the DD relationship, but that alternatives might be counter-productive.

Anyway, it was a good discussion, and there was another aspect of it that caught  my attention.  When one commenter reacts to another commenter on this blog, they are often forced to preface it with something to the effect of, "I am responding to the anonymous commenter who said . . ."  If there is anything that is clear about our Forum participants, it is that--with a few exceptions like the Merrys--we place an extraordinary value on our anonymity.  A very large majority still post without using even a fake profile and, to my knowledge, we have only one reader who maintains a blog that uses her real picture in that profile such that, for all intents and purposes she is "out" as being on the receiving end of a spanking relationship.  And, there is nothing at all wrong with any of this, and this post is in no way meant to challenge it.  If anonymity is the grease that keeps the conversation going for all of us, then the more of it the better.

But, this week's question asks you to engage in a bit of "what if" exploration, that also may again test a bit the extent to which some of us talk a good game about submitting to our wife's authority. The question is, what if your partner told you they wanted to be more openly in charge?  What if they told you that they want it be clear to anyone who is watching and interested that she wears the pants?  Not necessarily a public announcement that you are in an FLR relationship, but outward actions that leave no doubt about it. And, what if that included her disclosing to anyone she chooses that she spanks you?



How would you react?  Would there be some groups you would be OK coming out to, but not others?  And, which of those do you find more discomforting (to the extent you do find this topic discomforting), the prospect of being outed as being in a relationship led by your spouse and in which you are the junior party, or being outed as being spanked?  That distinction may itself be telling about where we think our society is in terms of both gender equality and openness to kink because, it says a lot if people are coming to see spanking as socially acceptable but there is still a stigma around a man taking second place to his wife in the decision-making hierarchy.



Speaking for my own relationship, as a practical matter, I don't think either of us is ready for being truly open about the DD aspects of our relationships, or the FLR aspects to the extent we really are practicing FLR.  But, pracicality and real life likelihood really weren't part of my question, were they? The question was, "What if your spouse TOLD you that THEY WANT to be open about it?"  What if this were the direction that your partner--the partner who some of you have agreed will act as head of your household and exercise final decision making authority--told you that this is what she wants and that she expects you to comply?" Would you do it?

For myself, it would make the decision quite a lot easier if two groups could be magically walled off from the disclosure: work colleagues and my parents.   On the workplace issue, given the profession I am in, I do think there could be a significant downside for my career if it were commonly known that my wife spanks me for disciplinary purposes.  Yet, paradoxically, a comment by Anna a few weeks ago about the feedback she gets from some of Peter's work colleagues about his behavior in that venue left me really wishing that such feedback were available to my wife, because work related temper problems and an unwillingness to submit to authority have definitely had a negative impact on my upward progress.  So, while I find the idea of being outed in any way in that context extremely upsetting, I also recognize that not being out about it also has a negative consequence.

Now, again, as a practical matter, it is very unlikely that my wife would ever "out" our disciplinary relationship. But, again, for this week's topic, we're not dealing in reality.  We are playing a game of "what if . . ."  So, let's explore that a bit.

Have  a great week.

Dan

42 comments:

  1. Well, Dan, I know you couched this in a "what if" scenario, but as you know from several previous posts here, this situation is EXACTLY what happened to me soon after Rosa moved in with her kids. I had to really talk it out with her because my first fear was losing respect. She reassured me on that point and explained her desire was to provide a living example of the 'normality' of any consensual lifestyle choice that harms no one else to her kids, who she felt were far too long repressed.

    After I agreed I was amazed at what a great idea she had. It enabled us to live each day in the moment of a DD dynamic. If I messed up, there was no need to wait until the house was empty or everyone was asleep. Instead it was just as if I was a kid again back with my mother. Back then nothing spared you the embarrassment of punishment, whether guests, or sometimes even where you were.

    Shortly after that the openness spread, slowly at first, then more rapidly. My neighbors were told, Some of her work colleagues were told. Eventually I too began to 'come out'. I told my kids and then , as I've told before, my late mother. As you recall from a post around Halloween, that holiday she asked me to include some very flagrant DD depictions in our Halloween Village and anyone who came over got an eyeful, if they looked about carefully.

    It was at that time that I was a bit surprised she chose to be fairly open with my nieces as well. (My brother was already well in the loop by then.) Even without the Halloween village we have some pretty open signals besides Rosa's frank announcements that she's the boss, to be seen in our home. There's an oversized wooden spoon with my name on it, and there are some fine art pictures about with a very obvious "woman in charge" theme.

    The thing is, not one of the people who've been informed has been anything other than cool about it. Some are fascinated, others bemused, none are shocked.

    The only thing that happens as a result of all this that is truly embarrassing in the moment are the public warnings to behave, and the reactions from those around. Not once has anyone ever said, "now Rosa, give KD a break, you're being too hard.". Nope, every time the reaction is a smirk and a look over to me and even a "you better be careful" warning to me! In fact, now that my nieces know, I just had an occurrence where I was being very impatient and snippy with Rosa and she warned me about it out loud, and my youngest niece gets this big grin on her face and says, "you better not make Rosa mad, uncle KD.". She wasn't being mean, but acted just like I've seen any kid tease another guilty kid who was on the verge of big trouble.

    So for me this isn't a matter of speculation. It's a daily possibility! And not one bad thing has ever happened as a result of it. Our friends and families all love us, and we get to live our life openly.

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    1. Thanks, KD. That really should give all of us pause to think and, not to get all philosophical, to question how much we live our lives in very constrained and limited ways based on overblown fears of embarrassment or bad consequences. Mark Twain had a great line about the extent to which many of our trials and tribulations exist only as fears and mental constructs: "I am an old man and have been through some terrible things in my life, a few of which actually happened."

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    2. KD, one other question that I don't recall the answer to from your previous post: Are you and Rosa "out" specifically that she uses spanking to punish you, or is it more generally the fact that she is the dominant party in the relationship, or both?

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    3. Most but not not all of those "who know" clearly know that spankings are involved. A few have only been given fairly obvious hints and probably 'know' but seem content to leave it as an amusing suspicion, but these are a minority. Most know what goes on.

      Of course within our household it's common knowledge. My brother knows about the reality of the punishments, as do our neighbors with whom we've discussed the particulars in very specific detail. When I spoke to my mother our first talk was a "general overview" but our second was an hour long detailed discussion. When done she fully understood that we lived in a situation where Rosa was in charge, made the rules, and enforced them with serious, non-erotic, spankings.....and she not only accepted our lifestyle but actually gave her approval. When it comes to my nieces, I think the only way they could not 'know' the spankings are real is if they chose to not believe what they've been told, maybe thinking Rosa is joking. I don't think that's the case though.

      Friends who Rosa works with know different things depending again on their receptivity, closeness, and trust level. Some just know we're "kinky". Some know about the DD, and some even know I am also kept chaste, sometimes even with the use of a locking device.

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    4. Thanks for clarifying. Also, for some reason each of your comments appeared twice in identical form. Same thing happened yesterday. In each case, I deleted one of the duplicates. Not sure why it is happening, and it seems to be happening only with comments from you.

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    5. Well as I've grown older I have been known to repeat myself. And sometimes I repeat myself. ;-)

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    6. Dan, I struggle with the same thing actually as to whether the fear itself is overblown or whether it really should stay completely private. For me, over the last months, I am starting to feel as if the fear of the unknown may be overblown.

      I am not comfortable (nor do I think he is) making the disciplinary part of this known outside of my relationship, in a similar way to just generally keeping what we do privately private. But as we have been doing this more seriously or getting into the stride of it, I think my husband actually prefers people to at least see certain aspects of me taking more control without necessarily outing it. This may only make sense in my head, but I think it is a good compromise for us at least. It allows us to be open but not out. So, for example, he has no problem taking a polite order from me or me directing him to do something even if we are in public. A few weeks ago my aunt was trying to move her heavy suitcase, and I simply said that he would take care of it. She really did not think anything of it but he enjoyed that I had simplified what needed to happen and that he could be counted on to assist other people as necessary. He also makes sure I have a drink or whatever wherever we are and is attentive. I do not know that people necessarily see it or assume what it going on. I thought it would be obvious and had been afraid of it. Even the suitcase thing with my aunt, I asked him immediately how he felt about it and he loved it, and she really did not think anything other than he is respectful and helpful.

      I think allowing there to be subtle openness works best for us and I am not sure I could be more out about it, even if he wanted to. I imagine as time goes on it will be more obvious maybe, but the immediate reaction of someone knowing is not as much as a fear at least as i have seen it play out more recently.

      I think our kids will be the hardest to strike the right balance, although he is deferential to me generally irrespective of who is there. As we have daughters, I am hopeful even the undertone of general deference or respect/attentiveness may help them to be stronger and more assertive women.

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    7. Hi Rhiannon. It sounds like you and your husband are striking a great balance. We have the same issue around what to do with kids. It's hard when they grow up for a lot of their lives in a more tranditional household, then all of a sudden Mom is indisputably in charge. Or, at least I think it would be hard. The fact is, we have taken only baby steps in that direction, and you are probably right that the fear is likely overblown and the potential impact could be very postiive.

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    8. Rhiannon, I liked your reference to your drink being attended to. (It is one of our "public rules".) Rosa expects me to keep her properly beveraged and has shared this rule with our one neighbor, and for a bit of fun, has included her in it as well. So when we are all together it is expected that I will make sure both of them are attended to. Now I try to do that with everyone always as a good host, but it's kind of fun to have either of them wave their empty glass at me with a wink or grin knowing what will happen if I don't keep them both happy. (It is one of our more playful DD rules, but a rule nonetheless.)

      As for the kid thing.....>sigh<. Let me say this. When we were first started doing this and the kids were younger, they were more eager to see me punished. Now that they are older they just accept it. One seems to have gone from seeming interested in such a lifestyle to not being interested in it much at all. Another admits openly that the lifestyle is appealing but is struggling with the sexual/non-sexual overtones. I bring this up because living openly has not changed who these kids are or 'forced' them in a direction. It merely pointed to another possible door that they have looked through and will no doubt enter or not enter as suits who they are. If you are into gardening and you involve your kids there is no guarantee once they grow up that they will take up gardening. You just shared a possibility. That won't make them gardeners. same with DD. You are showing one acceptable alternative to dealing with things. There is no reason to think they will 'become that way'. But if the inclination is there, your openness might make that decision easier for them. And if nothing else, openness teaches them to respect alternative choices in others. It may make them more open and tolerant people.

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  2. Dan
    Check out my last entry in last weeks question. I think it gives a sense of how we handle things.
    Anna

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    1. It does. Thanks, Anna. I hope you and Peter are having a great weekend.

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  3. Very good question (again) Dan. One of my bucket list items is to be in an environment where my Mistress Wife's loving authority over me (in all aspects) is not unusual. Not necessarily expected like if we were on FemDomme Island necessarily (although that would be fun too), but in a community of like minded people with regard to D/s and power exchange. I know that's what play parties are all about, but that scene is more of closed society. As a practicable, in the real world where we must live everyday, I don't think either of us would be comfortable being "outed" among our friends and family. It just creates too much of an unnecessary burden on everyone else to be able to truly understand the significance and joy of it all that Mistress and I naturally feel is now normal. That being said, should we be in another town where we are not known, I'd definitely be proud to be revealed as a submissive husband in a loving marriage to others, including the revelation that spanking is part of the deal. Even to the extent that those very spankings would be witnessed by others. As an added measure and in order to enhance the obvious nature of what our relationship is like, being required to be naked and caged while in public would be an added bonus. Being caged, Mistress would not be at risk of feeling any embarrassment should I have an erection.

    Conversation along this line of thinking could lead to conversation about such things as CFNM and the expectation of open sexual servitude in front of others as well.

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    3. One of the primary rules of communication applies to just about everything, including DD. KNOW YOUR AUDIENCE.

      Shoving in someone's face-type feelings occur because the person communicating did not take their audience into account. Rosa is very open. She's told a lot of people. She has not told everyone. Same for me. And the degree of frankness is also tempered against the audience in question. One friend might be curious over every detail (like our one neighbor) while others don't mind knowing the overall situation, but would find a "blow-by-blow" to be T.M.I.

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    4. KD, this is directed to your comments above and to this one. Let me begin my saying, you are a braver and more liberated man than I am. I can almost see myself coming "out" to certain friends, and maybe even some people at work, but the thought of having a long conversation with my mother or father about anything related to DD just petrifies me. It would be extremely difficult.

      But, now, the topic (and this seems to have gotten lost in some of the comments above) is not how each of us personally feels about the desirability of being more public with our DD relationship but, rather, whether you would comply if your DD spouse told you they wanted to come out in this way. You and Rosa are already pretty much out, so for you the answer is not only yes, but you've actually done it and lived to tell the tale. But, while a couple of our other commenters have said how they feel about coming out, they have not addressed whether they would actually do it if their spouse directed them to. For my part, as I said, I can see in happening in certain contexts, but I just don't know what I would do if was something like telling parents or siblings.

      And, I go back and forth on whether it should be hidden from kids. I tend to agree with you and Rosa, that the openness would probably be less traumatic that the "traditionalists" believe, and also that it might be a good thing for children to see an example of a strong and empowered woman as HoH. But, the last time we discussed that issue here in the Forum, there seemed to be a big majority on the other side of the issue. But, I just had the downside to it being a big secret hit me in the face again last night, when my wife had ordered a punishment session earlier in the day but it didn't happen because of the fact that kids might overhear. There is no doubt that in our relationship, the #1 impediment to living a more consistent DD and FLR life--hands down--is the possibility of kids knowing about it and the scheduling problems and delays that creates.

      Dan

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  5. One evening, well into the DW phase of our lives, my wife and I were watching and episode of the tv series, "House, MD". In this particular episode, there was a scene in which House says (approximately) "Cutty has a hairbrush and she knows how to use it - trust me". My wife and I both got a kick out of this, neither of us really envisioning Cutty as a spanker (and I believe the point was that House was making one of his frequent "jokes" - but I would bet that there was as a spanko somewhere on that writing staff!). Anyway - my wife then playfully asked me if that was what I said about her to my friends. I replied jokingly, "All the time" , but went on to add that it was too bad we didn't have a DWC style culture in our society - then a man could tell his buddies at the bar, "Got to go guys - don't want the wife waiting up for me with her hairbrush" - and then the guys would reply with knowing nods and tell him that he better be on his way before he got his butt blistered. And the discussion continued from there - it was a fun talk, if fanciful.

    In the real world, neither my wife or I would choose to go public. The two major reasons would be to protect both our careers and prevent embarrassment to our children (while grown and out of the house, it would most likely still be an embarrassment to them because of their friends) -
    it's just an unfortunate societal fact.

    However, my wife figured out early on that it helped reinforce my position as a disciplined husband if she threw in some public innuendo from time to time - slapping my behind in public, making veiled threats (like "wait till I get you home" or "you do remember what happened to you last week when you did that", etc) that might imply discipline. Among family and close friends she would even "jokingly" threaten me with a spanking. I would always have that sinking gut feeling when she would do this type of thing, but the fact is everyone really just thought it was all in fun. That is - all except her sister - who first suspected, then eventually discovered the whole truth, and then witnessed a number of my spankings. Now, my wife occasionally asks her sister to fill in for her - which she does with gusto (turns out that although she had not participated in any prior adult spankings, she definitely had a touch of the kink).

    I also think that I posted a few weeks back that as we were visiting with a couple who is new to our neighborhood and that we are getting to know - that my wife, upon hearing the other wife's complaint about her husband's bad habits, suggested in front of all of us that she consider simply taking an old fashioned hair brush to his bare behind. The neighbor wife didn't miss a beat - she asked my wife how that worked her. My wife was just as quick and replied, "Oh, quite well actually". The neighbor wife just smiled and said that she might have to give it a try. The other husband smiled nervously and looked a bit flustered. He actually did ask me later if she was joking. I was taken a bit off guard but only hesitated a moment before saying something like "oh, she definitely knows how to use a hairbrush" - and then changed the subject. While my sister-in-law had known for some time and I had actually been fairly ok with that, I did find it a bit embarrassing to have to talk to another man about it. We still see them occasionally and the subject has not come up again - but one wonders.
    But - if my wife were to insist that we become more open about our disciplinary arrangement, my thought is similar to that of our moderator, Dan. If I could actually wall off our work lives and close family, I don't believe it would really bother me all that much. --al

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    1. Hi Al. It sounds like you share with KD the stutus of a spanked husband who has already been outed to some extent, at least to your neighbor!

      I agree, Cuddy just doesn't seem to be the spanking type. If she had been, House wouldn't have gotten away with so much . . . stuff.

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    2. Dan, yes you could say we outed - at least to a minimal extent. The saving grace part is that it is a minor enough exposure that we could laugh it all off as a joke if, for some reason, we felt we had to. My wife says that the comments just sort of popped up unexpectedly, unplanned. But we both agreed that it was a good minor experiment in how it would feel to be open about our lifestyle. We both agreed that it felt good but also agreed that we would have to be careful so that it did not get back to work or family. Although the subject has not come up again, my wife is considering doing a followup conversation with the neighbor wife to see if there was any interest. To our surprise, they did seem to at least have some curiosity about it all. I suspect that my wife would love to have a real life DWC "sister" just down the block - to mentor and swap notes with. :-) --al

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    3. I've thought for a long time that my wife could use a similar DWC "sister" to exchange ideas with and enourage rigorous application of the paddle. Unfortunately, no obvious candidates have preented themselves so far.

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  6. Shilo and I are "out" as far as lifestyle friends are concerned, and we're even taking baby steps as to my polyamory. (obviously a subject for another time)

    I just hide things less and less, and the more disgusted I get with people in general, the less I really care what they know. A series of rather unfortunate events has occurred, so I've found myself questioning as to whether or not I really care what others think, and I see God as my judge, not a bunch of self-righteous intolerant people.


    On a nicer note, I frequently joke about spanking Shilo in front of people who know us,

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    1. Ms. Merry,

      I found myself curious about your polyamory arrangement as my wife is also contemplating exploring that dimension of our lifestyle. I did notice that you have your own blog and read through some of it. I am somewhat curious as to Shiloh's feelings and emotional response to your being with other men - since he, like myself, is a disciplined, submissive husband/bf.
      I would imagine that there would be a powerful initial response in the beginning, followed by gradually increasing understanding, acceptance, and appreciation - the way it is with so many things.

      I have posted our story in detail a couple of times - but in short, at around 40 or so we entered into the DWC lifestyle - pretty much mainstream at first. However, as time went on, and my wife explored such Femdom sites as Elise Sutton, the disciplinary domination carried over into the bedroom. While chastity was never a desire for either of us, my wife adopted several other dominant bedroom practices (as I have posted before). Eventually, she came to exert clear dominance in this area of our life, although I am not in the least deprived, and have even gradually come to appreciate certain aspects of the sexually submissive male role. This has finally evolved to the point that she is seriously considering experimenting with polyamory - specifically with the seduction of our widowed neighbor and friend. He is a few years older than us but his wife had shared with my wife before her sudden and unexpected passing a couple of years ago that he was an excellent lover, very well endowed, and still quite virile well into his fifties. This has intrigued my wife to no end. He lives next door and we are all close friends (and were as couples before the untimely passing of his wife) - so it is an interesting situation. She has begun the process to some degree, most recently removing her top as the three of us shared the hot tub on a recent evening. After gauging his reaction to that situation, there is no doubt that she could have seduced him right then and there if I had excused myself for the evening. He had told us fairly recently that he did not want to date because he did not want the complications of a new romantic entanglement at this age - but that he sure wouldn't turn down a f**k buddy or "a friend with benefits" if the situation presented itself. So, I think part of it also that my wife would like to a "good deed" on occasion for our good friend next door - and oddly, I can somehow understand how she would think that. She has not make a final decision, but I am suspecting that she will go for it before too much longer - and the situation could get very interesting. --al

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    2. Hi Merry! I generally agree with you. On some level, I just don't care what anyone thinks. But, I do care about what they do or, more to the point, what they can do to me or to others I care for. So, while I think I would have a little embarrassment and then get over it if people at work knew, I would not quickly get over the potential income impact and loss of status among others in this profession.

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    3. Hi Al!

      Perhaps I should explain that I was Poly before I met Shilo 2 years ago. Understand, I'm not into cuckolding him, nor am I into sexually humiliating him either, Hopefully, Shilo will drop in with a comment.

      Merry

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    4. "A" comment, huh? Seems like more than one might be indicated.

      It has not been quite two years ago that Merry and I met. THAT anniversary is a couple months away.
      After we met and started dating (in a BDSM fashion), sex was not in the question, and was even written into a first and second contract as OUT of the question.
      Then, l-o-v-e happened, and thoughts of sex became more than fleeting fancy fantasies.
      And she explained to me, polyamory....that should we become lovers, she may be the only one for me (...my choice) but I would not be the only one for her.
      And I was good with that. I AM good with that.
      AN ongoing discussion ne argument between Merry and me:
      I AM a cuckold, by the very broadest of definitions, and I quote Merriam Webster: "A man whose wife has sex with someone else."
      However, Merry does not deny me.
      OMG, does she NOT deny me....

      for Dan:
      I do not get embarrassed, or humiliated.
      It has at times become a game or a challenge: "try to embarrass me".
      Has yet to happen.
      However, I don't talk much, at work, or elsewhere, so what happens at home rarely comes to light in conversation at work.
      If I was asked a point blank question, such as "..Ever been spanked by your wife?"
      I would answer truthfully, but probably with a straight face and in such a way that I would not be believed.
      If I was believed, it would not effect my employment standing in any way.
      ...Shilo














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    5. Thanks for comments, Shiloh - appreciated! --al

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    6. Dan - on your comment above on this thread - I think you make a good point. If my work associates discovered that my wife blistered my behind with a hairbrush periodically, it would cause some embarrassment, but it would pass - after all, a spanking is not really that big a deal it would seem. However, my suspicion is that some people would be visualizing black leather clad dominatrices with whips and chains - and *that* could indeed be damaging to to a professional career, --al

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  7. My wife has a couple of close girlfriends who know, being from a small town, hard at times to keep a secret. You squirm at the local diner, the waitress knows, she smiles at my wife, and the smile is returned. Still in your pajamas in the middle of the day, a visitor drops in, doesn't matter male or female, they know. My wife from the first date made it clear, others knowing will remind you to not do it again. As for others seeing the actual spanking, she prefers for the most part to keep that a private affair. A few times I have been spanked in front of others, her mother dropped in once during, I partied to late to many times during the week, her mother just took a seat and watched, her only comment was, the underpants needed to come down, worse of all worse, my wife pulled them down. The only other time was her best friend from out of town was visiting, and I wore little around the home in the morning, told to change that for a week, well I did not and my wife really spanked my bottom, bare, in the bedroom, I stood facing the wall, my wife then showed her friend, the friend just said, never to old for a spanking I see. So others may know, especially my wife women friends and her mother, thankful that is as far as it goes, except for the few times that I have experienced.

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    1. The "few times" you've experienced?? It sounds like more people know you get spanked than know me at all ! ;-)

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  8. Neither my wife nor I have any intent or desire to reveal our DD relationship. Some things are better left unsaid. I do, from time to time, observe some husbands (and wives too) that I think need to be spanked. Although I would like to advise the offended spouse to buy a hairbrush or paddle doing so could well reveal our own private and intimate relationship and I keep my mouth shut. DD would help a lot of marriages and it's too bad the Spencer Spanking Plan is not on the pre-marital reading list.

    Fred

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    1. I also have known couples who could use the advice to take up DD, including social or work friends of mine who clearly could use an application of the paddle by their long-suffering wife. Like you, I haven't brought it up.

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  9. Dan, I was reading these very great posts and I see a related theme: embarrassment in general. Obviously the spanker's inclination TO tell is to embarrass their misbehaving mate....or just to brag a bit. I would love to hear more and offer more on this aspect especially in terms of the trend for the dominant party to develop a little bit of a "spanker's swagger" as their confidence develops.It seems there is a natural inclination for the spanker, due to not being embarrassed about being the one in charge, to use their partner's embarrassment over being the one subject to spanking to either heighten the punishment or to make a point, or just because it's fun. What do you say? ;-) A future topic? LOL.

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    1. Definitely a great future topic candidate. But, keep in mind that our topic was phrased in terms of the dominant party wanting to "out" the relationship because the question at hand was whether the other party would submit to that "outing" if demanded. So far, the only thing that is really clear is that no one wants to actually answer the question! There have been lots and lots of expressions of opinion on whether such activities SHOULD be outed, several on whether their own spouse would want to, and damn few on whether they would submit if, despite their own wishes and their spouses current predispositions, they were ordered to do so.

      And, in my own case, the scenario was a bit counter-factual, because while I have told one person about our DD relationship,, to the best of my knowledge my wife has not told anyone. So, in her case, no obvious "spanker's swagger" yet.

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    2. Dan - you may have posted this before, but who was the one person with whom you have shared your DD relationship? -- If you feel comfortable sharing this. The only person who definitely knows about our DD is my wife's sister. And, as I posted earlier, we have a neighbor couple that we"vaguely" told - but they may or may not believe we were serious. --al

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    3. Hi Al,

      I think I have posted about this before, and there is a slightly fictionalized version posted in the "User Stories" section but, the shortened version is that over too many drinks, I told a work colleague who was a close mutual friend to both my wife and me. She was a very "free spirit," and one day over a few glasses of wine, we started swapping relationship stoires. We were very new to DD at that point, and I was like one of those annoying new religious convert, just bursting to tell someone about the conversion experience. I ended up telling her that my wife was "taking more control" and, a few glasses later, that such control involved spanking. Several weeks later, my wife and this friend went to a ballgame together. They spent a few hours hanging out, soaking up the sun at the stadium and, I assumed, chatting about whatever it is women chat about when we're not there. Late in the afternoon, I called my wife to see whether the game was over. She answered, I'm catching a ride with Jenn (not her real name) back to her place to get the car," she replied. "She says "hi." "Tell her "hi" for me," I replied. "Are you hanging out over there or coming home soon?"

      "I'm going to come home long enough to pick you up, then you're going to take me out to dinner. You owe me after coming in late last night."

      "OK, you're right. I do owe you one."

      "Oh, and sweetheart, after we get back from dinner, I am going to spank your bottom like it hasn't been spanked in a very long time. You aren't going to sit for a week."

      Long silence on the phone. I was totally mortified! She explained--with our friend overhearing every word--that they had just had a nice long conversation about, "Exactly how I spank your ass when you've been a bad boy. She knows you need it and, given that you're the one who blabbed it to her, you're hardly in a position to object if I tell her all the details."

      As I said, totally embarrassing. While I had, in fact, blabbed first, it had been only at a very surface level, with virtually no details.

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    4. Dan - thanks for retelling your story. I can certainly imagine your embarrassment - and I'm sure it had to be almost embarrassing the next time you saw here face to face. As I've posted before, my wife' sister suspected for a long time and then happened to overhear me being spanked when we did not know that she was in the house. My wife and I were unaware of this, but my sister-in-law told my wife that she had inadvertently overheard us a few days after the event over a few margaritas. Not long after this, my wife determined that I needed a spanking while her sister was visiting - and took me back to the bedroom and gave me a good sound paddling while leaving the bedroom door wide open. Her sister, of course, heard every bit of it, including my pleading, yelping, and sobbing. Immediately afterward, my wife required me to go apologize to her sister for being such an ass around the house that day. I did, of course - and knowing that she had just clearly heard everything that had happened. It may have been the most embarrassing moment of my life. --al

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    5. I cannot even imagine. Great story, but I'm very glad it was you and not me. ;-)

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    6. I have had the same experience - not once, but several times - with my wife's sister (who has, more than once "given a hand") ... and also -, not too often, fortunately! - with some of her closest friends.

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  10. Kd - interesting phrase - "spanker's swagger". My wife would certainly be a candidate! I also think that would make for an interesting topic one week. -- al

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